Test-driving ‘free scan’ tune-up suites

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	TOP STORY Test-driving ‘free scan’ tune-up suites
	By Fred Langa Even on well-maintained systems, free system scanners might find hundreds of “problems,” as I discovered from a test of three products from well-known companies. These suites typically offer to fix system problems — for a fee — but are these problems real or just scare tactics to drum up sales?

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The full text of this column is posted at windowssecrets.com/top-story/test-driving-free-scan-tune-up-suites/ (paid content, opens in a new window/tab).

Columnists typically cannot reply to comments here, but do incorporate the best tips into future columns.[/td]

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Hi
I stupidly bought and installed WinZip Utilities Suite. Now, after it “ZIPped” through “hidden privacy exposing traces” (a default option which I equally stupidly didn’t de-select), I can’t access my HotMail in Internet Explorer and I am unable to generate new e-mails in Google Chrome. When I try to enter text in the main body of the e-mail I get the following helpful message:
Hotmail was not able to complete this request. Microsoft may contact you about any issues you report.
How do I “report” this to Microsoft?
Instead, to create new e-mails, I have to “reply” to any previously received e-mail and systematically “deconstruct” it as a new document.
After some considerable searching (FAQs don’t apply) I’ve contacted them at help1@winzip.com and received a reply which helped briefly with the Google browser. When I followed-up with further complaints (still can’t access HotMail on IE and Google was a one-of “fix”), I’ve received no further replies…
Beware, not only do these guys invent “issues” to get you in, they screw you and your computer! Virtually no after-sales service!!
Paul Pettigrew
South Perth
Western Australia

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Couldn’t agree more. I have tried out at least 20 of these so-called cleaners. One of them found over 1200 “problems” on a hard drive which had nothing but a freshly installed xp pro. I also keep my computer clean using the same programs that you use. I regularly download and test all sorts of programs just for the heck of it. I use Revo-pro installer to install and delete them. Even Revo misses some of the registry files. To fully uninstall these left over entries, I use Registrar Registry Manager (free for home use). It finds all orphans belonging to the program you tell it to look for. It is amazing what it finds.

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I just want to raise a few points:

Running the “PC manufacturer’s official driver update tool” is most definately not a good way to check for the latest driver updates, as manufacturers rarely have up to date drivers. Some manufactuers such as Lenovo do a reasonable job of providing driver updates, but for most manufacturers they stop providing updates around 6 months after a computer is released.

Going to the manufacturers website for each device is time consuming but will get the latest drivers.

Having used the driver updates in Systweak’s Advanced System Optimizer (which Winzip’s product is a licenced version), and their stand alone drive updater, Advanced Driver Update, I can say that it is very rare for them to find incorrect driver updates. Also it makes the driver update process really simple, becuase it installs the driver updates silently with no user intervention required.

As for the registry errors, if you look at the individual problems found in the software section, you would probably find that the actual uninstallation registry key is being flagged as an error, but rather there are some empty, unneeded registry keys found.

For the record, I don’t recommend using this registry cleaner as it gives occasional false positives. However jv16 PowerTools has the same problem.

Cookies are indeed a privacy issue becuase they can show websites you have visited. However, personally I also never delete them, and always disable any option to clean cookies in junk cleaning software.

I don’t recommend this software, particuarly due to the false positives given by the registry cleaner, however Advanced Driver Updater is a very good program, and I have purchased several licences in the past.

Also, with reference to AVG PC Tuneup, it is a licenced version of Auslogic’s Boostspeed which is a well respected optimisation suite. The Auslogics registry cleaner is available sperately for free, and does not give any false positives – so any registry errors found were indeed genuine (athough, by and large registry errors are harmless and don’t need to be cleaned).[/SIZE]

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I would avoid running anykind of “online tune-up suite” just for the heck of it, unless, it is from a reputable maker and, most importantly, it purports to fix a very specific problem you are actually having. But over all most of these online scanners are 100% pure garbage to be avoided imo.
There are enough problems to contend with in life, there is no reason to go looking for more.

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As has been posted here many times before, just because you can update a driver doesn’t mean you should do so. While it is true that manufacturers do not update to the latest available versions of the drivers, there may be reasons for this. I can’t tel you folks how many times I’ve experimented with a touchpad (Synaptics) driver update through DriverMax, only to find my touchpad no longer works. Then I have to roll back. Just imagine this happening with a major motherboard chipset driver. You’d be bricked — no way to boot even into Safe Mode.

At the minimum, if you feel you must fix something which isn’t broken, make a system backup and back up all drivers to an external device or media. You will very likely need these and reinstall media for your OEM condition, as well as Rescue Media (on CD or DVD) and a BIOS preset to boot from CD/DVD, then USB, and last from the internal hard drive. This is NOT the default BIOS setting.

Bottom line — these programs are scaring folks into paying to have their computers damaged or “fixed” when they aren’t broken. Never run these utilities if your PC is having no problems. NEVER. And if your PC is having problems you haven’t succeeded in fixing even with the help of us here in The Lounge, it’s a better investment to go to an independent repair shop than to pay these companies to run “one size fits all” fixup tools.

So what do I see directly below this article in the Newsletter? An ad for PC Matic, which is a System Optimizer (in fact, one of the safest and oldest out there). Ironic, eh?

-- rc primak

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I have followed many of Fred Langa’s articles for years, but this is the first comment that I have made. But first I must say that they are very useful, so please keep up the good work Fred. I am not at all surprised at Fred’s conclusion about the commercial drive to scare PC users into buying software that can be obtained free from others, but also may make some dangerous suggestions. I have noticed at gradual change among the “free” providers, that increasingly offer a hook to get you started down the road to buying their product. In the distant, past Winzip was always free, but now it comes with the trap to force you into buying or uninstalling it. And now AVG has joined in. I have been using MS Windows Essentials for some time, but have a different expreience from Fred, because I, and I think quite a few others, find that some of its components such as matshost.exe and MsMpEng.exe can take over your processor (like 98%) for minutes on end. My solutions has been to uninstall Windows Essentials and install AVG, which is how I have found out about their new sales policy where AVG only runs for 30 days before you have to pay up. Removing Windows Essentials has got rid of these MS problems, but now I am going to have to pay for AVG, although I don’t mind paying for good software, which it is. But how do we PC users know which is good and which is bad? No good relying on the big names: Corel, Symantic? What we need is independent professionals like Fred Langa to help us through the minefield of bogus software available for “free” on the web. Thanks Fred.

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Another comment but regarding MS Essentials. Do not use it. I had recommended it for my Father’s new PC rather than Norton’s bloat. It worked well for several months and then out of the blue he became infected with a virus and a slew of malware. MS Essentials didn’t detect it because the virus somehow managed to shut MS Essentials down. It would not start again and after I reinstalled it, it found the virus but decided to shutdown becasue the system was unstable. I had a two minute warning between each shutdown. After 3 hrs, 10 reboots, using a system restore point, and using a recovery disk and toolset from Vipre, I cleaned off the virus and installed Vipre Internet Security 2012. I would not recommended MS Essentials to anyone else.

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I thought the article was well-written and addressed a number of key issues one encounters with “free stuff.” I once used Norton products almost exclusively and stopped a number of years ago when they began to fail to bring any real usefulness to the party.

For system clean up and tweaking, I use TuneUp Utilities (http://www.tune-up.com/). They offer a free 30-day trial wherein the software provides full functionality. After that time expiration, you have to pay to use it. I think it does an excellent job of cleaning and tweaking various aspects of Windows 7.

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I have followed many of Fred Langa’s articles for years, but this is the first comment that I have made. But first I must say that they are very useful, so please keep up the good work Fred. I am not at all surprised at Fred’s conclusion about the commercial drive to scare PC users into buying software that can be obtained free from others, but also may make some dangerous suggestions. I have noticed at gradual change among the “free” providers, that increasingly offer a hook to get you started down the road to buying their product. In the distant, past Winzip was always free, but now it comes with the trap to force you into buying or uninstalling it. And now AVG has joined in. I have been using MS Windows Essentials for some time, but have a different expreience from Fred, because I, and I think quite a few others, find that some of its components such as matshost.exe and MsMpEng.exe can take over your processor (like 98%) for minutes on end. My solutions has been to uninstall Windows Essentials and install AVG, which is how I have found out about their new sales policy where AVG only runs for 30 days before you have to pay up. Removing Windows Essentials has got rid of these MS problems, but now I am going to have to pay for AVG, although I don’t mind paying for good software, which it is. But how do we PC users know which is good and which is bad? No good relying on the big names: Corel, Symantic? What we need is independent professionals like Fred Langa to help us through the minefield of bogus software available for “free” on the web. Thanks Fred.

If you want a free and full-featured antivirus program which does not require you to upgrade to their paid version (although they do offer a limited-time free trial and the free version does nag you to upgrade) try Avast Free. The Free Edition has most of the features you are likely to need or want. Just add a third-party firewall (like Comodo’s free firewall, set to Safe Mode) for Windows XP — no third-party firewall is needed for Vista or Windows 7. No required upgrades, no free trial versions, and no expiration dates (although the Avast free license is renewed for free each year).

-- rc primak

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If you want a free and full-featured antivirus program which does not require you to upgrade to their paid version (although they do offer a limited-time free trial and the free version does nag you to upgrade) try Avast Free. The Free Edition has most of the features you are likely to need or want. Just add a third-party firewall (like Comodo’s free firewall, set to Safe Mode) for Windows XP — nothing more is needed for Vista or Windows 7. No required upgrades, not free trial versions, and no expiration dates (although the Avast free license is renewed for free each year).

Thanks Bob for the tip; I will give Avast and Comodo a try

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Great article. I installed JV16 Power Tools 2012 (paid version) earlier this year at your suggestion on this site. I have found that the registry cleaner and optimization features have improved my startup/shutdown and operations noticeably on all my home PCs. Worth every penny. The duplicate file finder feature is also handy.

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I’ve always wondered about those free tune-up sites – thanks for doing the work of checking them out in a systematic way. As a network admin, I am get questions from colleagues at work regarding best Internet practices, and articles such as yours help me give more informed answers.

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Thanks Fred for another excellent and in depth article.
I was a little surprised that you didn’t include an analysis on PC Matic since it’s one of the sponsors.
It also happens to be a product I own and I visit their forum frequently.
If possible, can you do the same sort of analysis of PC Matic as you’ve done on the other tune up
programs in the article.
Thanks

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These online scanners are geared toward the novice user and tend to use scare tactics to get your money..

Registry cleaners have always been debated, on my old XP system I NEVER cleaned the registry and it still works fine.

People that use these online tools are usually un-aware of making backups and images so when things go wrong they have no option other then to get their PC repaired in a local shop for MORE money..

Most people learn from their mistakes but many never learn and keep doing the same wrong things over and over again.

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Fred does not seem to participate in these threads, so I’m hoping others here will help me out. In his article, Fred mentions that after running Winzip for example, he uninstalled it, cleaned up his PC, then went on to the next app to be tested.

Would it be a better approach to create a system restore point, install the app, test it, then restore the system to the point created before the test? Would this lead to, perhaps, a more clear baseline than the uinstall, clean up routine?

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Well gw, system restore sometimes doesn’t restore properly depending on what was fixed or removed with the software.

I believe system restore mostly restores registry settings that were changed during the installation of software.

They may be other things system restore fixes but I am not aware of them.

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I did a test with a couple of those free utilities as well, though I took a totally different approach. I took a freshly installed and patched XP virtual machine and asked the product what was wrong with the machine. It too found a ton of problems, some of them self-inflicted, and offered to fix them if I paid a fee.

That article can be read here:

http://dascomputerconsultants.com/PCTuneUpUtilities.htm

David Soussan

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…need/want to run Microsoft’s Safety Scanner if we’re using Microsoft Security Essentials?

I ran MSC on a couple of my computers, running MSE, and found nothing. They’re both from Microsoft…why would there be any difference. In other words, if I’m using MSE, why even bother with MSC?

Like many others, over the years I’ve used many pretty bad anti-virus/spam detecting/cleaning programs. Some created more issues than they ever resolved…paid and free alike. After “encouragement” from great advise from Windows Secrets I now depend on MSE. It works for me, and the users I support.

Thanks Fred for all you do.

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Why would we… need/want to run Microsoft’s Safety Scanner if we’re using Microsoft Security Essentials?

I ran MSC on a couple of my computers, running MSE, and found nothing. They’re both from Microsoft…why would there be any difference. In other words, if I’m using MSE, why even bother with MSC?

Good point. It uses the same detection engine and malware definitions.

Bruce

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Good point. It uses the same detection engine and malware definitions.

Bruce

MSC is just an online (scanner) and not an installed version of the basic scanning engine of MSE. I think it is offered in the article as a way for folks who do not have MSE installed to run a quick checkup to see what might be wrong with a suspect computer. Also useful in these cases is Windows Defender Offline (WDO), which runs from a CD and never has to interact directly with a running Operating System. Some rootkits and MBR infections can be picked up in this way.

Either way, Microsoft is one of the Good Guys in this arena.

-- rc primak

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MSC is just an online and not an installed version of the basic scanning engine of MSE. I think it is offered in the article as a way for folks who do not have MSE installed to run a quick checkup to see what might be wrong with a suspect computer.

Fred said he uses Microsoft Security Essentials continuously, and that he also uses Microsoft Security Scanner from time to time “to verify that my system is secure and uninfected”.

Can you imagine why, if they both use the same engine and definitions?

Bruce

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Fred said he uses Microsoft Security Essentials continuously, and that he also uses Microsoft Security Scanner from time to time “to verify that my system is secure and uninfected”.

Can you imagine why, if they both use the same engine and definitions?

Bruce

I am not Fred, but maybe he likes to get a quick scan and doesn’t want to fool around opening the MSE interface to do so.

Otherwise, this is a mystery to me.

Personally, I don’t have a fast enough Internet connection to run any online scan quickly. So I leave those tools alone.

-- rc primak

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This article somewhat reminds me of the TV ad that proclaims the blue screen of death can cause permanent damage to your computer!

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This article somewhat reminds me of the TV ad that proclaims the blue screen of death can cause permanent damage to your computer!

In what sense? The author, or these scanner services?

-- rc primak

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i see frequent references to this service in columns here. I used to use it, but stopped because it was so limited in the programs that it reviewed, and inaccurate recommendations. i tried it again a couple of weeks ago. it gave me a very short list of programs that needed updating, and said that most were up to date. remarkable, since it analyzed the winxp drive on my dual boot computer, which i haven’t accessed in a few years. It said nothing about the win7 drive that i use daily, and from which i ran secunia. bye bye secunia.

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i see frequent references to this service in columns here. I used to use it, but stopped because it was so limited in the programs that it reviewed, and inaccurate recommendations. i tried it again a couple of weeks ago. it gave me a very short list of programs that needed updating, and said that most were up to date. remarkable, since it analyzed the winxp drive on my dual boot computer, which i haven’t accessed in a few years. It said nothing about the win7 drive that i use daily, and from which i ran secunia. bye bye secunia.

What programs did Secunia not list which you consider important to scan? You can suggest to Secunia that they start tracking these programs, unless they are no longer supported by the original vendors (End of Life).

What were these alleged “errors”? Did you check the full paths and look at all places where programs or plugins could be installed on your computer?

Scanning both OS partitions in a dual-boot can be controlled in PSI if you wish. You get to select which drive letters are to be scanned.

Please post details if you are going to criticize a service which most of us have found useful over the years.

-- rc primak

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Thanks for the very detailed testing of these scanners. I’ve been using System Mechanc Pro for sometime and would like to see how it stacks up in a future article

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I think it’s quite ironic to have a column disparaging some these system cleanup tools, followed immediately by a 3rd party add selling the same type of potentially problematic software.

Does WindowsSecrets test out any of these programs in the ads they accept before passing the links along to readers?

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I think it’s quite ironic to have a column disparaging some these system cleanup tools, followed immediately by a 3rd party add selling the same type of potentially problematic software.

Does WindowsSecrets test out any of these programs in the ads they accept before passing the links along to readers?

Any ads on this site are just that, ads. We in no way shape or form endorse any of them.
I suppose in theory the ads on site could be displaying and trying to sell you lingerie, but we are obviously a tech site, so those ads will reflect that. But that in no way translates into our endorsement.

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For one thing, I would NEVER turn my PC over to an online scanner..
Too risky in my opinion…

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My set of apps and protocol is similar to Fred’s, except I use SAS Pro along with MSE, Comodo’s firewall instead of Win 7’s, and keep Revo Unistall Pro at its default moderate scan setting. I’ve tried two of those “tune-up” suites – PrivaZer and Raxco PerfectDisk – and each time I’ve ended up having to use system restore in short order. What’s also tricky with them is that if one is not technically attuned to the scanner’s settings, if it even shows them clearly, all sorts of useful information is lost, such as recent files visited in Office and user stats in other programs. This is also an issue with Piriform’s Ccleaner, but its user interface offers more control up front.

The issue I’d like to see discussed is whether or not registry scanning is needed or safe at all. While I use Ccleaner and jv16 PT, there are some strong expert opinions against it out there in various internet threads.

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My set of apps and protocol is similar to Fred’s, except I use SAS Pro along with MSE, Comodo’s firewall instead of Win 7’s, and keep Revo Unistall Pro at its default moderate scan setting. I’ve tried two of those “tune-up” suites – PrivaZer and another I’m forgetting – and each time I’ve ended up having to use system restore in short order. What’s also tricky with them is that if one is not technically attuned to the scanner’s settings, if it even shows them clearly, all sorts of useful information is lost, such as recent files visited in Office and user stats in other programs. This is also an issue with Piriform’s Ccleaner, but its user interface offers more control up front.

The issue I’d like to see discussed is whether or not registry scanning is needed or safe at all. While I use Ccleaner and jv16 PT, there are some strong expert opinions against it out there in various internet threads.

Doesn’t SAS Pro have active components which can conflict with other active AV programs?

Windows Secrets has already covered at length the issue of whether and how much Registry cleaning is needed or even safe. LOOK HERE .

When used improperly, aggressive Registry Cleaners (not CCleaner nor Macecraft’s jv16) can and do remove necessary Registry entries. Even if your system doesn’t immediately go into endless reboots, at a later time you may need to do an update or Service Pack and find that some needed entries are missing. Threads abound on the Internet about these sorts of delayed disasters.

Bottom line — mild cleaning can help Windows, but too-aggressive cleaning is just asking for trouble. When doing that first Registry cleanup, make a .REG Backup (CCleaner offers to do this on each run) just in case something goes wrong.

-- rc primak

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Tks, Bob. I use CCleaner each time I shut down. I used JV16 many moons ago, back in the windows 98se days, IRCC. I downloaded the free version a little while ago and ran it stock. It found much that CCleaner did not. I let it clean things up and I had printer problems immediately after that. I had backed up my registry before running it, so I simply restored the back up and all was well. Since then, I’ve stuck to only CCleaner.

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Doesn’t SAS Pro have active components which can conflict with other active AV programs?

Windows Secrest has already covered at length the issue of whether and how much Registry cleaning is need or even safe. LOOK HERE .

When used improperly, aggressive Registry Cleaners (not CCleaner nor Macecraft’s jv16) can and do remove necessary Registry entries. Even if your system doesn’t immediately go into endless reboots, at a later time you may need to do an update or Service Pack and find that some needed entries are missing. Threads abound on the Internet about these sorts of delayed disasters.

Bottom line — mild cleaning can help Windows, but too-aggressive cleaning is just asking for trouble. When doing that first Registry cleanup, make a .REG Backup (CCleaner offers to do this on each run) just in case something goes wrong.

Pose a problem on a help forum and techs (e.g., MS) will always claim that SAS Pro conflicts with other active AV programs and should be removed. I haven’t seen any direct evidence of that during several years with XP or Win 7 x32 or x64. That said, the past couple of months I’ve been getting a jumpy cursor for several seconds to a minute or more every so often and when I open task mgr, SAS Pro is always at the top of the non-idle process list, running 2-3% CPU. Makes one wonder, but when I tried disabling it nothing seemed to change. Maybe I’ll pose this on another forum sometime soon.

Your WS linked article speaks more to a comparison of registry cleaners than the underlying debate about whether or not they are needed or even good idea to use at all. I haven’t looked at the issue for two or three years, but have the following bookmarked: http://aumha.net/viewtopic.php?t=28099 (see Bill Castner’s comments, including his quotes from Mark Russinovich).

The problem I see with even the best of all-purpose scanners is that it’s hard to control the aggressiveness of their cleaning. I will give credit to PrivaZer, which in response to my complaints set up a series of settings screens during the install that spoke clearly to popular programs, such as MS Office. But even then they missed a couple that affected me or still got more than I asked for. It’s hard to cover everything a user might want to protect, so it ends up as crapshoot – or a program for users who don’t know much and just bumble along. Safer without those type of scanners.

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Pose a problem on a help forum and techs (e.g., MS) will always claim that SAS Pro conflicts with other active AV programs and should be removed. I haven’t seen any direct evidence of that during several years with XP or Win 7 x32 or x64. That said, the past couple of months I’ve been getting a jumpy cursor for several seconds to a minute or more every so often and when I open task mgr, SAS Pro is always at the top of the non-idle process list, running 2-3% CPU. Makes one wonder, but when I tried disabling it nothing seemed to change. Maybe I’ll pose this on another forum sometime soon.

Your WS linked article speaks more to a comparison of registry cleaners than the underlying debate about whether or not they are needed or even good idea to use at all. I haven’t looked at the issue for two or three years, but have the following bookmarked: http://aumha.net/viewtopic.php?t=28099 (see Bill Castner’s comments, including his quotes from Mark Russinovich).

The problem I see with even the best of all-purpose scanners is that it’s hard to control the aggressiveness of their cleaning. I will give credit to PrivaZer, which in response to my complaints set up a series of settings screens during the install that spoke clearly to popular programs, such as MS Office. But even then they missed a couple that affected me or still got more than I asked for. It’s hard to cover everything a user might want to protect, so it ends up as crapshoot – or a program for users who don’t know much and just bumble along. Safer without those type of scanners.

I notice that even the free SAS has one process which never shuts down on my Windows XP laptop (which is sensitive to such things). There seems to be at least some basis to suspect their free edition of possibly conflicting on some computers with some other security programs. Personally, I’ve never had enough trouble with it to bother me, except immediately after updating SAS or running a scan with it. Rebooting seems to stop the issue for me.

If you want a true opinion piece about the usefulness (or lack thereof) of Registry cleaners, see this Windows Secrets article by Woody Leonhard. He doesn’t like Registry cleaners. Fred is a bit more in favor of them. (I stand with Fred. Registry cleaners can do more harm than good, but the milder ones are less likely to do anything fatal than the more aggressive ones. And in Windows Vista, Windows 7 and Windows 8 64-bit with modern hardware, I have yet to see a Registry cleanup actually improve system or program performance. I do see benefits on my older, 32-bit, single-core, limited RAM Windows XP Pro SP3 laptop.)

(Same with defragmenting — on modern hardware, no difference in performance. On older hardware with Windows XP, sometimes the “optimize” phase makes a noticeable difference.)

I run both a Windows XP laptop and a Windows 7/Windows 8 (dual-boot) laptop. XP has benefitted with limited hardware resources from occasional Registry cleaning. Windows 7 or Windows 8 — eh, not so much. Just my own experiences.

-- rc primak

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Tks, B. When I install an app that I may not want to keep, I generally do both. I create the restore point, then install. If I uninstall, I use uninstall in CP to get rid of the app, then restore to the point before the install. I am just trying to find out if this is overkill.

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Tks, B. When I install an app that I may not want to keep, I generally do both. I create the restore point, then install. If I uninstall, I use uninstall in CP to get rid of the app, then restore to the point before the install. I am just trying to find out if this is overkill.

If you use CCleaner or the jv16 Power Tools, reverting to a previous Restore Point is almost always overkill. All you need to do is kill off any remaining Startups and make sure there are no Registry conflicts from the leftovers. Both of the Registry cleanup programs mentioned will do that job.

-- rc primak

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“If your machine is truly disabled by malware, you’ll also need another way to get on the Net. It’s a good excuse to get that new UltraBook or tablet PC you’ve been thinking about.”

Not so fast!

Is it plugged in?

Monitor turned on?

First try “Safe mode with networking” which will allow you to browse the web. Be careful, your firewall and virus protection might not be operational in safe mode.

If that doesn’t work then try that KNOPPIX or other Linux boot disk or USB that you made before you had problems. You did make one (or two) earlier and tried them out, didn’t you? It will at least let you browse the web and there are other repair tools on them. Also check Windows Secrets for other options for making removable bootable media for repair purposes. You could also try the Windows install disk repair mode just to see if the system is working.

If you can’t get the system working but the Linux or other boot works, then it may be time to backup updated files (email, pictures, documents…) and restore from a backup made before problems started, or, that know working virgin backup with applications and patches installed that you made earlier. You did backups, didn’t you?

Before performing the following steps or any other steps that involve reaching into the chassis, grab the chassis metal to ground your self. A real tested grounding strap connected to a ground, or the chassis is even better. (You would be surprised how many times I found open straps, or poor conduction that needed a special conductive lotion. So I still grab the chassis metal even with a grounding strap.) Stay grounded as much as possible, i.e. only one hand inside. If you need two hands, don’t roll your chair, shuffle your feet, squirm in the chair… and reground as soon as possible.

If the system is “bricked” try first removing the CMOS battery for several minutes with the power cord disconnected (looks like a watch battery, oh, it probably is a watch battery, hopefully in a battery clip or otherwise easily removed, which you could have ordered online for cheap). Some systems can also be reset by moving a jumper, power cycling the box (on, wait for initial machine boot screens to complete, then off), and restoring the jumper. You can find the instructions in that missing manual that is probably still in the box that you threw away last year because it was sitting in the basement gathering mold. Aside from directly testing the battery, a dead or dying CMOS battery may result in a message at the very beginning of booting or the boot settings may not be what you had set up. If the battery is dead it time to head to your discount store. The cheapest watch batteries that I ever found were at a “Far East” this and that store. 2^nd place was on the internet, otherwise try a local big box store (Wal-Mart, K-Mart…). This should reset the CMOS settings, so if you have anything special, such as booting CD/DVD first, USB 2nd, hard drive last, you will have to restore them. While you have the system open for the CMOS battery, get out that vacuum cleaner with attachment and the can of compressed air and do some gentle cleaning to get rid of the dust. I usually find a pile underneath the CPU cooler that eventually causes the CPU temperatures to climb.

Good luck.

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This was one of the most informative articles in Windows Secrets. We should appreciate the amount of work that Fred had to do in order to detect all the activities of the online scanners. That took a lot of patience.

Online cleaners, and indeed all programs that claim to clean the computer, remind me of the trick that vacuum cleaner salemen used to perform when demonstrating the machine for the housewife. They would find a stretch of carpet that the housewife had already cleaned, run their machine on it, and come up with some dust or dirt. I am old enough to remember my mother having that experience. It did not fool her because she knew that no matter how well you clean a carpet(unless you use some extraordinary chemicals), a new vacuum cleaner will find something. I have never yet had a cleaner which was so thorough that another cleaner does not find something. But as Fred demonstrates, what is left after a good cleaning is not worth bothering with.

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(This is supposed to be a reply to #33 in this thread, and why it appeared as #42, I have no Idea…)

One of the best vacuums I’ve ever had is the Neato XV-11 robotic one. Its SLAM algorithm thoroughly goes over the area, and always gets a full bin once a week. It’s obsoleted my brain-dead iRobot Roomba.

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(This is supposed to be a reply to #33 in this thread, and why it appeared as #42, I have no Idea…)

One of the best vacuums I’ve ever had is the Neato XV-11 robotic one. Its SLAM algorithm thoroughly goes over the area, and always gets a full bin once a week. It’s obsoleted my brain-dead iRobot Roomba.

Use the Reply With Quote button and folks will see exactly which post you are responding to. Otherwise, submissions are posted in the order in which they are received.

If this was meant to be a humorous reply, you hit the mark!

-- rc primak

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i just wish fred had reviewed the TV scam “pcmatic.com” and the other made for TV computer fixers. those are truly a joke and should be illegal as they prey on the stupid. i tested a couple of them on a fresh build of win7 and found hundreds of problems, and over one thousand with one of them. not to mention the pcmatic.com fools couldn’t code their way out of an open door, buggy as a fire ant nest.

just my opinion heheheh;)

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I have been reading Fred’s articles and news letter for many years and he is GREAT. However, this evening, based on his article I went and downloaded CCleaner. Once I ran it, for the first time in my life I got a security warning from MS Defender ( I am running Win 8 ) that I have a Trojan on my system. Since the notice happened right after installation of the program Fred had suggested, I can only assume that is is infected. So be warned!!!

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I have been reading Fred’s articles and news letter for many years and he is GREAT. However, this evening, based on his article I went and downloaded CCleaner. Once I ran it, for the first time in my life I got a security warning from MS Defender ( I am running Win 8 ) that I have a Trojan on my system. Since the notice happened right after installation of the program Fred had suggested, I can only assume that is is infected. So be warned!!!

This has never, NEVER happened to me. What was the exact URL from which you downloaded it? Did the link take you through CNet Downloads? Their downloader is sometimes flagged as adware.

-- rc primak

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Absolutely right. This is a case of how vendors use FUD to milk people’s $$$. Great article, Fred. Now, could you give your thoughts on E-Support’s BIOS scan? I have an older Award BIOS (F9) that works fine on my Gigabyte GA8VM-800M socket 775 mobo, and they claim to have a better BIOS for it to flash on.

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Absolutely right. This is a case of how vendors use FUD to milk people’s $$$. Great article, Fred. Now, could you give your thoughts on E-Support’s BIOS scan? I have an older Award BIOS (F9) that works fine on my Gigabyte GA8VM-800M socket 775 mobo, and they claim to have a better BIOS for it to flash on.

Urgent advice — NEVER upgrade a working BIOS! I repeat — NEVER!

-- rc primak

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Carl, I don’t think that anyone is disparaging these sites.

Just because mostly everyone has something negative to say about them shouldn’t be interpreted as ‘disparaging”

If the comments on this topic were complimentary and positive of these scanning sites and you saw the very same 3rd party ad would that also be interpreted as the ad being placed in this topic because of the positive comments?

It’s an open discussion about the pro’s and cons of such sites..Unfortunatley most of the comments are negative.

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