Front Page (2002)

Topic

New Reply

I am using Javascript Menu Builder 1.0 to provide a drop-down menu on http://www.navalofficer.com.au. It works well, but every time I add a page to the web site and change the menu I have to update every page with the new html and reload every page to the web site yet again. Is there a work around for this, please? Is there a css option that might help? Can anyone point me towards a site where I can learn how to handle this?
Regards
Fred

Reply | Quote

Replies

Are the menus the same on every page, or do they somehow indicate the current page? If they are the same for every page, it sure would be convenient if HTML had a feature to “insert other HTML file here.”

There is a concept of an “inline frame” (IFRAME) that can do just that. I’ve never used one, but there was some discussion down on the Web Development board. You might check on FP’s Insert menu and see if it is supported. If so, you can save the menu as its own HTML file and just have an IFRAME in your other pages.

If that doesn’t work, it should be possible to use JavaScript to insert the HTML for the menus. Off the top of my head, I can’t think of an efficient way to do this (efficient meaning not having to rewrite all the HTML so that it will be properly understood by the script interpreter), but maybe someone will have an idea.

Finally, there is the notion in FrontPage of “shared borders,” but this might not be the best choice unless everything above the menus (assuming they are horizontal) also is “shared” on each page.

Reply | Quote

I responded once to this message, but I’m not sure it got through. Please bear with unnecessary repetition.
First, very many thanks for the swift response.
I have the same menus and banner on each page.
I tried “inline frame” but the white space required for the large drop down menu to deploy, in horizontal or vertical mode, is too big.
I was unable to put anything other than an image file in my “shared borders”. It would not look at the html file that sets up the menu on my present pages.
I’m still trying to find a solution.
Regards
Fred

Reply | Quote

(Edited by jscher2000 on 16-Sep-04 21:48. )

After you add the border, you can open the file directly for editing. For example, let’s say your web is named DEMOWEB and is inside your MyWebs folder. You would add a top shared border and save it. You then have this new HTML file:

C:Documents and SettingsUsernameMy DocumentsMy WebsDEMOWEB_borderstop.htm

You can open that file and carefully insert your menu code, trying not to disturb anything that it appears FrontPage would have proprietary feelings about. Does it work?

Added: If you cannot see the _borders folder in FrontPage’s File>Open… dialog, you may not be showing hidden files and folders. This is determined in Windows Explorer, under Tools>Folder Options…>View (many interesting options here).

Reply | Quote

I found the border file, and I can insert an image, but no matter where I tickle the html, I get no response for the inserted drop-down menu javascript. Is there is an or similar preamble required?
Regards
Fred

Reply | Quote

I found the border file, and I can insert an image, but no matter where I tickle the html, I get no response for the inserted drop-down menu javascript. Is there is an or similar preamble required?
Regards
Fred

Reply | Quote

(Edited by jscher2000 on 16-Sep-04 21:48. )

After you add the border, you can open the file directly for editing. For example, let’s say your web is named DEMOWEB and is inside your MyWebs folder. You would add a top shared border and save it. You then have this new HTML file:

C:Documents and SettingsUsernameMy DocumentsMy WebsDEMOWEB_borderstop.htm

You can open that file and carefully insert your menu code, trying not to disturb anything that it appears FrontPage would have proprietary feelings about. Does it work?

Added: If you cannot see the _borders folder in FrontPage’s File>Open… dialog, you may not be showing hidden files and folders. This is determined in Windows Explorer, under Tools>Folder Options…>View (many interesting options here).

Reply | Quote

I responded once to this message, but I’m not sure it got through. Please bear with unnecessary repetition.
First, very many thanks for the swift response.
I have the same menus and banner on each page.
I tried “inline frame” but the white space required for the large drop down menu to deploy, in horizontal or vertical mode, is too big.
I was unable to put anything other than an image file in my “shared borders”. It would not look at the html file that sets up the menu on my present pages.
I’m still trying to find a solution.
Regards
Fred

Reply | Quote

LOL, it does, it’s called an include file.

Reply | Quote

True. I meant with a client-side pull. Using SSI requires that the poster rename her pages with an extension like .shtml so the server will process the include directive. With a FrontPage web, renaming always gave me heartburn, so maybe that’s why I can’t ever remember using SSI (I used ASP instead).

Reply | Quote

It’s really a matter of the web server. You can set an IIS server up to ‘include’ htm or asp files. I have our company’s website up like that. It includes htm or ASP, and processes both htm and asp extensions as asp.

Reply | Quote

Dear Jsher and Drew,
I dunno. Every time I try, the best I can manage with an include file is an immediate menu insert that stays there after I save that page. I don’t seem to be able to make to seek an updated menu. Is there some trick I’m missing?
I must admit the include file gives me better results than the shared border, which had space problems in that I have to drop teh border to accommodate all the drop menus that would otherwise just temporarily flow over existing text, like the include file.
Regards
Fred

Reply | Quote

The idea would be that you would edit all your pages to have the include directive, remove the menu code from those pages, and keep the menu code centralized in the include file. Whenever you want to change the menus, just update the one include file.

I’m not sure where that is failing. (Seems safest to test with just a few pages until it is working.) As noted above, in order for the include directive to be processed, the web server has to recognize it as a file that uses server-side includes. The usual way to do this is to change the file name to .shtml or .sht (but if those don’t work, your server might not support SSI and this whole idea goes up in flames).

Reply | Quote

The idea would be that you would edit all your pages to have the include directive, remove the menu code from those pages, and keep the menu code centralized in the include file. Whenever you want to change the menus, just update the one include file.

I’m not sure where that is failing. (Seems safest to test with just a few pages until it is working.) As noted above, in order for the include directive to be processed, the web server has to recognize it as a file that uses server-side includes. The usual way to do this is to change the file name to .shtml or .sht (but if those don’t work, your server might not support SSI and this whole idea goes up in flames).

Reply | Quote

FYI, the attached is how the main page looks in FireFox

Reply | Quote

Leif,
Well that’s a horse’s rear end. Looks like I’m up for an entire web redesign. Any suggestions for a drop down menu option that would retain the banner and menu principles in Firefox?
Regards
Fred

Reply | Quote

The code has been “obfuscated” so that it’s extremely difficult to read. The first part of the script does the browser identification. It sorts out MSIE from Mozilla, that much is clear, but then it gets really difficult to trace. If you can find some code that’s readable, we could work with it, but this stuff is impossible. I guess this means you need to go back to the publisher (http://www.usingit.com/%5B/url%5D)and complain. Maybe they’ll upgrade you to the “Gold” version (which at least says it was tested with Netscape 6 and Mozilla 1.x).

Reply | Quote

Ureka. The include page hint finally hit the spot. I don’t know what I was doing wrong before, but a clean sheet and fresh try certainly worked with the four new pages I tried.
The Firefox problem is on the back burner.
As I recall, the “Gold” version of the menu builder had a couple of undesirable visual characteristics when I looked at it a couple of years ago. That’s why I chose the version included in the web site.
Anyhow, to coin a phrase. Very many thanks for the include page heads up.
Regards
Fred

Reply | Quote

The code has been “obfuscated” so that it’s extremely difficult to read. The first part of the script does the browser identification. It sorts out MSIE from Mozilla, that much is clear, but then it gets really difficult to trace. If you can find some code that’s readable, we could work with it, but this stuff is impossible. I guess this means you need to go back to the publisher (http://www.usingit.com/%5B/url%5D)and complain. Maybe they’ll upgrade you to the “Gold” version (which at least says it was tested with Netscape 6 and Mozilla 1.x).

Reply | Quote

Leif,
Well that’s a horse’s rear end. Looks like I’m up for an entire web redesign. Any suggestions for a drop down menu option that would retain the banner and menu principles in Firefox?
Regards
Fred

Reply | Quote

FYI, the attached is how the main page looks in FireFox

Reply | Quote

Dear Jsher and Drew,
I dunno. Every time I try, the best I can manage with an include file is an immediate menu insert that stays there after I save that page. I don’t seem to be able to make to seek an updated menu. Is there some trick I’m missing?
I must admit the include file gives me better results than the shared border, which had space problems in that I have to drop teh border to accommodate all the drop menus that would otherwise just temporarily flow over existing text, like the include file.
Regards
Fred

Reply | Quote

It’s really a matter of the web server. You can set an IIS server up to ‘include’ htm or asp files. I have our company’s website up like that. It includes htm or ASP, and processes both htm and asp extensions as asp.

Reply | Quote

True. I meant with a client-side pull. Using SSI requires that the poster rename her pages with an extension like .shtml so the server will process the include directive. With a FrontPage web, renaming always gave me heartburn, so maybe that’s why I can’t ever remember using SSI (I used ASP instead).

Reply | Quote

LOL, it does, it’s called an include file.

Reply | Quote

Are the menus the same on every page, or do they somehow indicate the current page? If they are the same for every page, it sure would be convenient if HTML had a feature to “insert other HTML file here.”

There is a concept of an “inline frame” (IFRAME) that can do just that. I’ve never used one, but there was some discussion down on the Web Development board. You might check on FP’s Insert menu and see if it is supported. If so, you can save the menu as its own HTML file and just have an IFRAME in your other pages.

If that doesn’t work, it should be possible to use JavaScript to insert the HTML for the menus. Off the top of my head, I can’t think of an efficient way to do this (efficient meaning not having to rewrite all the HTML so that it will be properly understood by the script interpreter), but maybe someone will have an idea.

Finally, there is the notion in FrontPage of “shared borders,” but this might not be the best choice unless everything above the menus (assuming they are horizontal) also is “shared” on each page.

Reply | Quote

Why not put the menu in an include file? Put the include tag on every page, then just make changes to the include file. All the other pages will pick up the changes when displayed.

Reply | Quote

Why not put the menu in an include file? Put the include tag on every page, then just make changes to the include file. All the other pages will pick up the changes when displayed.

Reply | Quote