Replies

Thanks guys (metaphorically speaking),
I have now resolved the original problem but all of the replies have contributed to a better understanding of the underlying problem. I have also spent the last 18 months on vbc programming at collegiate and understand that the method by which the programme stores the data is a contributory factor in the resulting ‘loss’ of accuracy.
A simple example of this is in Excel, where if you perform a calculation which results in a known 2dp result, then copy the results into a new area as values only, you will quite often get a 2dp value with a string of 999999999999 at the end, hence rounding to your original result.
As I have found with a lot of MS applications, there are bugs and there are fixes, but quite often a fix is a workaround and hence not a fix. hmmmmm, when is a fix not a fix? It’s a programmers joke I’m sure
Thanks
Again

John,
I’m afraid your sarcasm is lost on me, I work in the technical document industry so I’ve seen and heard just about every angle from clients, customers and operatives alike. I think my job title is probably one down from accountant on the boredom scale and one up from undertaker on the job satisfaction scale.

However, BS 7649 was not the standard to which I refer. I am familiar with BS7649 from my programming side but it is not in my immediate library.
BS5261part2 – Copy preparation and proof correction is one of our references, and part one is recommended and I quote: “The preparation of typescript copy for printing, so that it is clear in presentation and consistent in style, is dealt with in BS 5261 part1”
Additional reading for a start may be: http://www.rbs0.com/tw.htm – Technical writing by Ronald B. Standler
Hope this helps.
Alan
cheshire

John,
Don’t know if your from UK but there is a British Standard available as a reference for technical authoring (amongst other things). I don’t have the numbers immediately available but when I am next at my office (a.m. tuesday 11th) I shall post details.
Or try search engine for British Standard authoring technical documents or some such.

Also, when you change the styles, if you make sure the “Heading n” is a style based on normal, when you change the normal style the Heading n will change also. Be afraid.
Alan Edwards
Cheshire
UK

Andrew,
I have tried the file and it appears to be working fine. A workaround I was planning to use was to have the user not type over the final full stop (or character) of the form field and it then seems to obey the update without changing the bullet numbers. But your version seems infinitely more user friendly. If you could post the solution I’d much appreciate it.
Thanks
Alan
Cheshire
UK

btw, if the cross reference bullets in the original file are change to bullets and not numbers, then you get a weird pseudonumberbullet result, ie, bullet, bullet, number, bullet, bullet

I tried the Ref Text1*Mergeformat but when I entered the form field and updated I was left with the cross reference bulleted as 1;4;2 (when using three bullets as the form field).
Copy doc attached.
Any other suggestions or is there a particular setting I am not using that flips the bullets.?
TIA
Alan
Chesire
UK

Hot off the press:
Just got a solution and what a gotcha!
MS actually has the solution but no fix to stop it happening in future, it’s one of those, yeah we know it happens but when it does just use this cure:
Open the worksheet that the error occurs in
Select EditReplace
Find what: =
Replace with: =
Select replace all
and is if by magic, the formula disappears from general view and the values appear as one would expect under normal circumstances.
I live and learn.
I believe MS recognises this as a ‘bug’ for MAC edition Excel 98 but no mention of Excel 97.
See MS Q184261
Thanks again
Alan

John, Thanks for suggestion. Cells are all formatted as numbers (and text where the result is a text string).
Alan

Thanks Van, I preferred the ‘fidgeting’ solution to the one offered by MS.
Yeah, I’ve seen it a few times previously as well but it’s just one of those things that went beyond annoying, specially when the clients looking over my shoulder and saying “Oh, and why don’t the fields appear then?”
I fidgeted, I cursed, I had a mild bout of mouse rage, but the final solution was:- go back to desktop and change display properties to something more like they should be. Voila, the fields re-appeared. Thh screen was on 16 bit and is now on true colour, the refresh rate (I am reliably informed from IT admin), was set to 75khz when 85khz was more suitable for the screen. I don’t know if this will work as a universal solution, but it was well worth figeting with.
Thanks again
Alan
Cheshire
UK

Jefferson: I haven’t tried the code yet but I’m sure it’ll sort out the section page numbering. Unfortunately, the document has many (23 at last count) sections some of which are continuous and to restart the page numbering for each section would not be the exact solution. (think of the document like a book of many chapters, each chapter containing several sections. Although the sections change, I want to retain an order of numbers for the chapter). Many many thanks anyway and I will be using that code on a.n.other project.
Hubert, I know you all think I’m para, but I’m not. ‘Evil lurking’? You hit the nail on the head!!! Strangely, as the first section had been set with first page different, the subsequent sections (continuous OR new – it didn’t matter) inherited the same page setup for the header footers (same as previous in HF view). Even after unchecking the same as previous and unchecking the different first page the page numbering was all awry. The ultimate solution to the problem was to change ALL of the section breaks to new page, set each section with not same as previous and not different first page, then enter the page number on each first section page ensuring the format was as required i.e. continue previous section or restart at 1.
It was evil incarnate and I have consigned it to the fires of Redmond.
It’s a conspiracy I tell you.

Thanks again

Alan
Cheshire
UK

Cheers Phil,
I have now resolved myself to the fact that the section breaks must really be held outside of any bookmarks and am currently introducing the users to my new friend Mr 3 by 4 plank of finest Scottish Pine. With regards to the continuous section breaks, my doc is made up of various continuous and new section breaks so setting a default to one is opposed the others in the document.
I also found that by clearing the “widoworphan” and “keep with next” paragraph settings I cleared most of the errors.
However, success on the protection front and the document is now working almost as intended. there is now an additional problem with page numbering – subject of a separate post.
Many thanks again for your time and effort.
Alan
Cheshire
UK

Thanks Phil,
Unfortunately I have quite a few variations on the continuousnext page break scenario in the document and once I get one of the breaks to stay as it is, the next time the document is protected one of the other breaks goes and, well, “breaks”. I think I may have resolved a couple of the breaks by the following method:
add two or three hard returns at the position I want the break,
change the paragraph format of each return so as it does not have widoworphan, keep with next etcetera,
insert the break in the midst of the hard returns.
This worked for a couple of the breaks, particularly those in the bookmarks.

My other ‘solution’ was to insert two breaks, one next page followed immediately by a continuous break. It’s untidy and kind of like using a sledgehammer to crack a nut, but it works (for some) until the breaks decide to change again.

The reason for placing the section breaks in the bookmark – was not to place the section breaks in the bookmark but to place the bookmark startfinish in protected sections. Unfortunately, the users to whom this document is going to includes a minority who take great delight in pulling apart documents and generally trashing the formats and links etcetera. Others just basically don’t understand the documents and whilst having bookmarks turned on (showing the square brackets) delete all the unwanted square brackets – even after we explained that they do not appear on the printed page. Also, some of the bookmarks are within table cells and when the user enters data they use tab to move along cell entries, unfortunately, moving into a cell in this method overwrites the cell contents~a bookmark. c’est la vie.

So, it’s kind of solved in part, but still does not work as intended with basically inserting a break and not having it change format when protected.

If a solution is available I’d be most grateful.

Thanks
Alan
Cheshre
UK

I know it ‘s a bit late in the day, but did you also check you had ‘Precision as displayed’ checked on the toolsoptionsCalculations tab.
I can feel the flames coming already, but it does exactly as it says and gives ‘true to view’ answers.
Alan

Sammy, I ran through all of the YN’s before and after testing as template and the autoshapes are definitely ‘renumbered’ on a template based document. Having tried out the document on a.n.other workstation it appears there is a small irksome problem of “page creep” but this is not too much of an issue at the moment and is separate to the main prob.
I got opportunity to take your advice and used the same onclick events to rename each autoshape with my own naming (i.e. CircA1; CircB1; CircA2 etcetera depending on which question they refer to). It worked!! The document was saved as a template and the new template based files Autoshapes all behaved as originally intended in the locations as originally placed. It still doesn’t explain why the autoshapes are renumbering each time the new document is created but it does mean we now have a workable document. Many thanks for the advice. (I noticed also that by using a msgbox and activedocument.shapes.count I got a result of 78 items, although I can only think of 74 items having been created – 37 labels and 37 autoshapes. Is word mysteriously creating its own shapeslabels I wonder?)
The only part left to resolve is the ‘detachment’ of the references in the vde which appear to be the temp files names e.g. ~WD07432
Regards
Alan
Cheshire
UK

Word document attached as zip file.
Zip (38k in size) contains word document with same name – 180kb in size.
The word document is called ACT1.doc and contains label onclick events for approx 37 labels. Each label calls a sub to reveal or hide the labels associated autoshape.
The autoshapes are all present in the document but may be hidden or revealed by clicking on the Y or N labels.
In the word document it all works fine and clicking on the relevant text encircles it with a circle autoshape.
So far, so good.
Now save the document as a word template (I use my local drive rather than the workgroup templates). I have used the same filename for my template.
Using word I then go Filenew and create a new act1 document.
In this new document when I click on the label text the associated autoshape either does not exist or has been renumbered elsewhere in the document.

Other than saving the document as a template I will be sending a document to the client as read only and requesting they open the document then save_as each time they want a new document.

Any helpcorrectionsnew pair of eyes would be much appreciated.
TIA
Alan
Cheshire
UK

Rory,
Many thanks. Your correction worked first time.
I also needed to change .ActiveDocument.Bookmark.Add “MyBookmark”, BMRange
to
.ActiveDocument.Bookmarks.Add “MyBookmark”, BMRange

added the ‘s’ to bookmark although my reference books show it as singular.
Once again thanks.
Alan