Win7 reaches milestone; prepare for its demise

Topic

New Reply

	TOP STORY Win7 reaches milestone; prepare for its demise
	By Susan Bradley It might be difficult to believe, but on Jan. 13 we begin the final countdown for Windows 7. On that date, one of Microsoft’s best and most successful versions of Windows hits its official “end of mainstream support.” Here’s what that means for all Win7 users.

---

The full text of this column is posted at http://windowssecrets.com/top-story/Win7-reaches-milestone-prepare-for-its-demise/ (opens in a new window/tab).

Columnists typically cannot reply to comments here, but do incorporate the best tips into future columns.[/td]

[/tr][/tbl]

Reply | Quote

Replies

But how do you currently upgrade and to what: Win7->win8->8.1 ?

Or are you obliged to install from scratch ?

For a non professional installation I faced numerous issues with stupid (when problem found) issues. But the Common denominator was host: In machine unavailability, in hours spent, in calendar time. I’m sure that for the small Business user, the problem must ne identical or a multiple of what I saw.

B.r.

R. Moller

Reply | Quote

Finding out just which vn of .Net a bit of software needs seems to be an unaddressed issue – and uninstalling dotNet to test is a clumsy (and time-consuming) way of doing it. I found that CFF Explorer could identify the vn of .Net required by an individual program, but manually accessing each program was a pain. I briefly pursued writing a script to plow through my programs folder, using the scripting feature of CFF Explorer (which uses Lua), but gave up after making too many silly mistakes. If anyone has a bright idea, I’d be interested (or I may have to get back to that unfinished script).

Reply | Quote

This is an important, and good article, but it spends too much time addressing legacy software. I know that older software is still useful, regret loosing some good stuff, but I am not a business. I wish you had offered comments on upgrading from Win7 to Win10, and what to do about upgrading from Office 2010. Will there be hardware requirements for Win10? Office?

Reply | Quote

This is an important, and good article, but it spends too much time addressing legacy software. I know that older software is still useful, regret loosing some good stuff, but I am not a business. I wish you had offered comments on upgrading from Win7 to Win10, and what to do about upgrading from Office 2010. Will there be hardware requirements for Win10? Office?

Given that Windows 10 is still in beta, I don’t like to be exact when it’s still in the oven baking. The goal is to not have more hardware requirements but less so it can go on lesser sized tablets. BUT we all know that some Windows 8 machines got stuck on 32bit and couldn’t go to 64. The consumer beta is coming out at the end of this month so we’ll get a better hint then.

Reply | Quote

I resent MS forcing us to ‘upgrade’. I detest Win 8 — gave away the laptop I bought having it.
It’s all about maintaing the revenue stream.
Win 7 forever with good protection software.
And I feel better getting that off my chest.

Reply | Quote

I resent MS forcing us to ‘upgrade’. It’s all about maintaing the revenue stream.

Yup.

Win 7 forever with good protection software.

A lot of us felt that way about XP, but Win 7 Pro turned out much better in most aspects and I would never go back.

I did, however, hold on to XP on all of the systems in my business until I was very sure that Win 7 Pro had settled out, then I upgraded them all. (Except one Vista system which runs one piece of irreplaceable software and is turned off except when we actually need to use it.)

I did the same with Win 8: waited. And decided not to upgrade to it. It appeared that Microsoft had lost its way and was trying to put consumer style smart phones on the desktop. Sorry, but I and most of my employees already have a smart phone. We need a real useful business system on the desktop and a useful cash register on the checkout counter.

Now I am playing the waiting game for Win 10. If it looks like Microsoft has found its way again I will continue to wait until all of the inevitable problems are ironed out. Then I will upgrade. Otherwise I will continue to wait until they release something useful or I retire, whichever comes first.

Of course it would be nice if Microsoft would make the networking easier to setup and use without reducing capabilities or forcing me to conform to their pre-determined view of the world. It would be nice if the kernel was better designed so it was not so vulnerable to various hacker exploits. Etc. There are probably a lot of ways they could improve it without reducing its usefulness, but I’d just settle for something as good as Win 7 Pro.

Reply | Quote

Now I am playing the waiting game for Win 10. If it looks like Microsoft has found its way again I will continue to wait until all of the inevitable problems are ironed out. Then I will upgrade. Otherwise I will continue to wait until they release something useful or I retire, whichever comes first.

Great minds think alike.

I am also waiting for the reviews of Wndows 10 and some hands-on advice from the contributors to Windows Secrets. Things look pretty good so far.

Of course, I didn’t go the Apple way of avoiding Windows 8. I went over to Linux, as this OS can be installed and run alongside of Windows 7, either in a Virtual Machine or as part of a dual-boot. Despite lots of initial headaches, I’m pleased with the setup I’m running now (a dual-boot). Except for updates, I seldom go into Windows 7 for real work now, but that will undoubtedly change when Windows 10 gets a stable release out.

-- rc primak

Reply | Quote

@Backspacer – I am on the same boat.

Reply | Quote

Yup.

A lot of us felt that way about XP, but Win 7 Pro turned out much better in most aspects and I would never go back.

I did, however, hold on to XP on all of the systems in my business until I was very sure that Win 7 Pro had settled out, then I upgraded them all. (Except one Vista system which runs one piece of irreplaceable software and is turned off except when we actually need to use it.)

I did the same with Win 8: waited. And decided not to upgrade to it. It appeared that Microsoft had lost its way and was trying to put consumer style smart phones on the desktop. Sorry, but I and most of my employees already have a smart phone. We need a real useful business system on the desktop and a useful cash register on the checkout counter.

Now I am playing the waiting game for Win 10. If it looks like Microsoft has found its way again I will continue to wait until all of the inevitable problems are ironed out. Then I will upgrade. Otherwise I will continue to wait until they release something useful or I retire, whichever comes first.

Of course it would be nice if Microsoft would make the networking easier to setup and use without reducing capabilities or forcing me to conform to their pre-determined view of the world. It would be nice if the kernel was better designed so it was not so vulnerable to various hacker exploits. Etc. There are probably a lot of ways they could improve it without reducing its usefulness, but I’d just settle for something as good as Win 7 Pro.

May I point out that I have unsupported Apple devices and android devices that dropped off the support wagon much faster than Microsoft drops support.

Reply | Quote

I resent MS forcing us to ‘upgrade’. I detest Win 8 — gave away the laptop I bought having it.

No-one is forcing you to do anything. What gives you the idea you are being force to upgrade? The mere fact Win 7 will one day reach the end of its support cycle does not mean you won’t be able to continue using it for as long as you have hardware and other software to use it with. There are millions of people still using Windows XP and Office 2003, even though neither product is supported.

Cheers,
Paul Edstein
[Fmr MS MVP - Word]

Reply | Quote

I so, so, so, so agree with you, NatanElias!!! I will never go to Win8. Does Micro$oft not read anything on the web that the public writes about it? When they finally pry Win7 from my cold, dead hands, I will go to Linux or something. How sad.

Reply | Quote

nice article, but you don’t mention anything about the hardware requirements for 8 and 10 – I have a thinkpad that only supports 2gb memory and does not have PAE (it would make no sense right?) but I can’t put 8/10 on it. I am not sure I will care about it in 2020, but it is an important issue – I can’t just ‘jump to 10’ on it.

the PAE/NX/SSE2 issues are rarely advertised, they say 10 will work on systems down to 1 ghz but not really because of this.

Reply | Quote

nice article, but you don’t mention anything about the hardware requirements for 8 and 10 – I have a thinkpad that only supports 2gb memory and does not have PAE (it would make no sense right?) but I can’t put 8/10 on it. I am not sure I will care about it in 2020, but it is an important issue – I can’t just ‘jump to 10’ on it.

the PAE/NX/SSE2 issues are rarely advertised, they say 10 will work on systems down to 1 ghz but not really because of this.

I am running Windows 8-32 bit with 2 GB of RAM. If you can get your hands on a copy of Windows 8-32 bit, you should be fine.

Full disclosure: I run entirely in desktop mode. I don’t know if “tablet” mode requires more memory.

Group "L" (Linux Mint)
with Windows 10 running in a remote session on my file server

Reply | Quote

I’m afraid that preparing for Win7’s demise is a bit premature for me since I’m still preparing for the demise of Win2K, which I’ve used for most of my computing activity – including Internet access – for the past 4 1/2 years since its own End of extended support with no security incursions whatsoever. But increasing amounts of software that I sometimes want to run won’t run on Win2K without significant tweaking, so I’m trying to decide whether to upgrade to XP (which I expect will continue to be able to run quite securely indeed for at least a comparable period – say, through the end of 2018 – as long as decent third-party security software continues to run on it as it still runs on Win2K) for most of my activity or make the leap to Win 8.1 (since I picked up three Win 8 Pro retail upgrade licenses back when they were available for $30 – $40 and have access to existing Windows versions to use them on, and while I prefer XP going with Win 8/8.1 should defer any need for another platform upgrade for over a decade).

My point is not so much that everyone can easily do without the latest few versions of Windows as that running a version well beyond its end of extended support can be done quite securely if you use good third-party security software on it and at least a moderately up-to-date browser (no, I haven’t used IE on Win2K for a decade or more. save to access Windows Update and the occasional persnickety Web site). And for those who might still be nervous places like msfn.org back-port many security patches for still-supported Windows versions and provide dll wrappers that allow current versions of software to run on older systems, though I haven’t found a need for them myself.

Reply | Quote

I’m afraid that preparing for Win7’s demise is a bit premature for me since I’m still preparing for the demise of Win2K, which I’ve used for most of my computing activity – including Internet access – for the past 4 1/2 years since its own End of extended support with no security incursions whatsoever.

I hated Win2K. You are obviously a patient person but you are going to love the upgrade to XP. Be sure and get the Pro version.

Do you also have a good firewall router? They are vital to Internet security. Otherwise you might just not be aware of the security incursions…

Reply | Quote

I hated Win2K. You are obviously a patient person but you are going to love the upgrade to XP. Be sure and get the Pro version.

Obviously preferences differ, but no surprise there. If I preferred XP I’d already be using it, as I’ve had a retail license for a decade or so which I do have installed and occasionally use when I need something which Win2K can’t easily provide. Ditto for Win7 (though I’m less fond of it than I am of XP), and as I mentioned I have 3 licenses for Win8 (my least favorite of all, but they were inexpensive and thus a good hedge against future software that may not run on earlier systems).

Do you also have a good firewall router? They are vital to Internet security. Otherwise you might just not be aware of the security incursions…

Yes, I have a good hardware firewall/router and I agree that they’re probably the best defense against unsolicited intrusions. I also run the last version of Online Armor that supported Win2K, largely to catch any unwanted out-going Internet activity but also as a more general second line of defense (edit: it includes a ‘run safer’ option which I regularly use – since I do run as an administrator, not having found any need to do otherwise – for just about anything that does not require more general system access and as I recall it also offers some heuristic protection against dubious program activity). And the last version of Avira AntiVir that supported Win2K, which has heuristic and rootkit defenses and still receives signature updates from Avira. And the last version of Firefox that supported Win2K, which has most of the security that more recent versions do and runs the most recent versions of add-ons like NoScript (there’s a wrapper available that allows running the most recent versions of FF on Win2K, but they’re a lot slower – at least for someone who maintains as many tabs as I usually do, even when I specify that they should not be opened or updated until I use them – even on recent versions of Windows on much faster hardware).

It’s surprising how much current software still supports Win2K and how adequate older versions of other software can be, but of course Win2K was a relatively low-volume product and there’s TONS of current software that still supports XP and probably will for years yet. So now is the time for XP aficionados to load up on the versions that they may need down the road, as I did for Win2K years ago – but that said, as I’ve begun doing this I’ve found that not all software that still claims to support XP always runs properly on it (a bit surprising given the number of XP systems still actively being used).

Reply | Quote

It would be rather nice of Microsoft to issue an SP2 for Win7 so as to incorporate all the updates issued to date, I for one am not happy with Win 8 in any form and am not looking forward to Win 10 unless they bring back the Win 7 type interface which is why a lot of people are reluctant to move to the latest versions.

Reply | Quote

I’m seriously considering buying a Mac Pro and leaving Microsoft in the dust. It is more than ridiculous to be forced to put up with their childlike fears.

Reply | Quote

I’m seriously considering buying a Mac Pro and leaving Microsoft in the dust. It is more than ridiculous to be forced to put up with their childlike fears.

If you think OSX is any different, think again. They actually support fewer versions than Microsoft.

Reply | Quote

If you think OSX is any different, think again. They actually support less versions than Microsoft.

Yep, both less and fewer.

Reply | Quote

Yep, both less and fewer.

Indeed :).

Reply | Quote

I’m seriously considering buying a Mac Pro and leaving Microsoft in the dust. It is more than ridiculous to be forced to put up with their childlike fears.

By all means, do. Just don’t be surprised when you find you can’t do as much after spending much more. Sure, there are some very nice niche apps for the Apple OS, but how about a mainstream RAD/database, for example? Or how about an Office suite (or even a word-processor) that is fully-compatible with Microsoft’s PC-offerings (even Microsoft’s own offerings aren’t)?

Cheers,
Paul Edstein
[Fmr MS MVP - Word]

Reply | Quote

hr][/hr]TOP STORY

Again frustration and utter disappointment-I keep feeling fooled by Microsoft, including their causing me damages, with no compensation. When I purchased, upgraded or whatever the terminology {I call it now being “re-duped”} new Win editions from them in the past – I entered into a contract, which they kept negating resulting in both my financial loss and loss of time. Simple good faithful service to customers would offer updates and new editions for free in a better world.
You wrote in your present article:- I hope all XP users have heeded my advice and are now using some other device for theit internet activities. I missed this articles – and therefore ask Can you offer me advice on any other device foe my Internet activities which is NOT from Microsoft?!?!?!

Thank you

Dr H. Z

(I hope all XP users have heeded my advice and are now using some other device for their Internet activities.Susan Bradley) . I missed this article, so ask:-
Can you offer me some other device for my Internet activities… preferably not from Microsoft!?!?!?!?
Sincere good wishes
[/SIZE][/SIZE]
Zedpeh Dr. H.
[/FONT] [/SIZE][/COLOR][/FONT]
Columnists typically cannot reply to comments here, but do incorporate the best tips into future columns.[/td]

[/tr][/tbl][/QUOTE]

Reply | Quote

When Win7 ends, I’m going Apple. Actually, I’ve already begun, learning how to use an iPad tablet. Next up I’ll get a Mac. I’ll keep the Win7 desktop for another year, but that’s it. I’ve been a Microsoft/Intel PC user since DOS3.6 (and a “Langalist” subscriber for a long time, too), but Win8 pushed me over the edge. With Apple I get an integrated computing environment: phone, tablet, desktop. Microsoft can’t do that. Yes, the change will be a pain in the patootie, but taken in steps it’s manageable. Adios, MS.

Reply | Quote

When Win7 ends, I’m going Apple.

This is a very viable and probably a very smart thing for a consumer to do. But business is more complex than that. We have quite a bit of software that is Microsoft only and would be extremely expensive to replace if even possible. Our Point of Sale systems, for example. If there even is any decent Apple oriented POS software it is probably very expensive. Every cost has to generate income in a business or you can’t spend it. Our POS software was expensive to buy, but we spend a mere $20/month for continuous free upgrades and maintenance. In addition to replacing all of our systems with Macs and all of our software, it is likely that our other POS equipment would be incompatible and need replacement. We would also spend thousands on re-training. All employees would need to spend (waste) a lot of time learning everything new and would make a lot of expensive mistakes. Funny thing about customers: if you make a mistake in their favor, you never hear about it, but when you make a mistake in your favor it ends up costing you even more to fix it.

We would probably have to close our business for a few days or even a week to do all of this, resulting in lost revenue and unhappy customers.

We aren’t salaried employees of some large corporation. When you own a small business, what you spend or lose on stuff like this comes directly out of your income. We would have to do it all at once and we could lose a substantial part of our personal income during that year. Imagine if your boss told you that you had to work for free for two or three months (or more?) You couldn’t quit or stay home and in fact, that you had to work even harder than ever. You wouldn’t do it and neither will we. That’s why we will stick to Windows until we retire.

Reply | Quote

mbutler205:

I’m seriously considering buying a Mac Pro and leaving Microsoft in the dust. It is more than ridiculous to be forced to put up with their childlike fears.

mossbloom:

When Win7 ends, I’m going Apple. Actually, I’ve already begun, learning how to use an iPad tablet. Next up I’ll get a Mac. I’ll keep the Win7 desktop for another year, but that’s it. I’ve been a Microsoft/Intel PC user since DOS3.6 (and a “Langalist” subscriber for a long time, too), but Win8 pushed me over the edge. With Apple I get an integrated computing environment: phone, tablet, desktop. Microsoft can’t do that. Yes, the change will be a pain in the patootie, but taken in steps it’s manageable. Adios, MS.

The problem with going over to Apple is that their hardware upgrades and their OS upgrades are tightly interwoven. When you upgrade the OS, you may need to upgrade the hardware which goes with it.

As Ruirib pointed out, Apple actually has fewer versions supported than Microsoft at any given time. Apple only supports two or three OS versions at a time. If your OS version is any older, even the Geniuses will not help you.

On the plus side, Apple is not charging for OS upgrades now, within the limitations I have cited above.

So when you make the leap over to Apple, keep in mind that that expensive iPad or MacBook will only last you two to four years. You will then not have the option of upgrading to the next new OS version, as your hardware will no longer be supported. The OS upgrade will simply not install. You can’t upgrade Apple hardware to work with the requirements of an OS upgrade which exceeds what your Mac or iPad is able to support. No reprieves and no third party or generic parts.

Something to consider when calculating the true costs of Apple vs. Microsoft computers and OS upgrades.

-- rc primak

Reply | Quote

After all the perfectly good hardware that stopped working on my computer due to lack of drivers after being forced from XP to Win 7, there MOST ASSUREDLY will never be another Microsoft operating system on this computer. Fortunately we ordinary humans are starting to have other viable alternatives for getting our mundane real-world work done. Good-bye Microsoft.

Reply | Quote

After all the perfectly good hardware that stopped working on my computer due to lack of drivers after being forced from XP to Win 7, there MOST ASSUREDLY will never be another Microsoft operating system on this computer. Fortunately we ordinary humans are starting to have other viable alternatives for getting our mundane real-world work done. Good-bye Microsoft.

Not trying to persuade you to come back, but I must point out:
Moving from Windows XP to Windows 7 was a large leap, technically speaking. Not surprisingly, a lot of older hardware couldn’t make the leap.

For those who are interested in system requirements, most Windows 7 hardware made the leap to Windows 8 with no problems except drivers, which are now available. Windows 10 will probably require a few driver updates, but is said to have similar hardware requirements to Windows 7. In other words, if your hardware works with Windows 7 now, Windows 10 should not require a new hardware investment.

In most cases, that is.

-- rc primak

Reply | Quote

Not trying to persuade you to come back, but I must point out:
Moving from Windows XP to Windows 7 was a large leap, technically speaking. Not surprisingly, a lot of older hardware couldn’t make the leap.

For those who are interested in system requirements, most Windows 7 hardware made the leap to Windows 8 with no problems except drivers, which are now available. Windows 10 will probably require a few driver updates, but is said to have similar hardware requirements to Windows 7. In other words, if your hardware works with Windows 7 now, Windows 10 should not require a new hardware investment.

In most cases, that is.

Windows 8.1 hardware requirements are a better measuring stick than Windows 7. CPU support of PAE, NX, and SSE2 is one differentiation as well as driver support as you mentioned. See http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-8/system-requirements for Windows 8.1 system requirements.

Jerry

Reply | Quote

Not trying to persuade you to come back, but I must point out:
Moving from Windows XP to Windows 7 was a large leap, technically speaking. Not surprisingly, a lot of older hardware couldn’t make the leap.

For those who are interested in system requirements, most Windows 7 hardware made the leap to Windows 8 with no problems except drivers, which are now available. Windows 10 will probably require a few driver updates, but is said to have similar hardware requirements to Windows 7. In other words, if your hardware works with Windows 7 now, Windows 10 should not require a new hardware investment.

In most cases, that is.

Well, my hardware still doesn’t work with Win 7 because the Intel Motherboard is not compatible despite their website saying it is, and I am not going to buy another motherboard just to make them happy. As a result I have to use a USB adapter cable with the IDE DVD drive, and another CD drive and a floppy drive were rendered unusable. Yes, I have to be able to write floppy drives to program sewing equipment, so I had to go out and buy an external USB floppy drive. I even tried a PCI card to interface to the IDE drives, but it didn’t work with the Intel motherboard so had to be returned. Everything used to work fine under XP. Changing to SATA DVD drives is also out because all the SATA ports are in use with other hard drives, and I have a problem with polluting the landscape with perfectly good working hardware.

Reply | Quote

Dear rwp728
I feel the same way: may I just ask a question, please? What other viable alternative can you recommend to me? I am just a user and in no way computer-wise. All my work is for my own leisure and at least do not have the real difficulties now being reported by small business owners, who should have a good case for claiming damages and loss of revenue!
Thanks for any reply.
I am

Reply | Quote

Great article and I’m following your advice and passing it on to friends. A question remains:
After Mainstream support ends, will the updates up to that time still be available to download? It’s important to have them available otherwise you could not restore your OS from the original disk. Or else have an image of the up-to-date OS available, which needs to be mentioned in the article.

Reply | Quote

Great article and I’m following your advice and passing it on to friends. A question remains:
After Mainstream support ends, will the updates up to that time still be available to download? It’s important to have them available otherwise you could not restore your OS from the original disk. Or else have an image of the up-to-date OS available, which needs to be mentioned in the article.

All updates will be available to download even after 1/13.

Reply | Quote

Sounds like you’ve got your sh*t together. It makes me wonder if your vulnerability goes down if you have an OS so old that nobody is bothering to exploit it anymore.

I’m curious (honestly curious, not argumentatively curious) what applications you run which are still useful. In the past I’ve often upgraded my OS when buying new hardware. Or when critical software suppliers stopped supporting their products on older OSes. But last year I built my own desktop PC which I hope will last me for a very long time as I replace and upgrade components rather than wholesale replacements of the whole machine. So longevity of the software is also of greater interest to me than it once was.

Reply | Quote

Sounds like you’ve got your sh*t together. It makes me wonder if your vulnerability goes down if you have an OS so old that nobody is bothering to exploit it anymore. :)[/quote]

My impression is that many and possibly even most exploit attempts aimed at XP (hardly a system that no one was bothering to exploit) would have applied to Win2K as well, and even some that were aimed at Vista/Win7/Win8: the NT family members have an awful lot in common and shared an awful lot of the same security fixes (differing only in minor details specific to each version, and it’s not clear that many exploits differ at all).

I’m curious (honestly curious, not argumentatively curious) what applications you run which are still useful.

Firefox and Thunderbird would be the most generally-applicable to anyone, I suspect – and as I mentioned wrappers are available that allow the latest versions to run on Win2K if people aren’t comfortable running somewhat older ones. Current and/or recent versions of several free office suites run on Win2K (though I almost never use such programs). I fiddle with disks a lot multi-booting Win98SE (or DOS 7.1 when Win98SE drivers aren’t available) along with Win2K (now also becoming harder to find driver support for on newer hardware), XP, Win7, Win8/8.1, and sometimes Linux and find that even the current versions of some popular partition managers plus recent versions of others still support Win2K (though I often prefer earlier versions that are more willing to honor partition ‘cylinder’-style alignment even on ‘advanced format’ disks as long as they support 512-byte sector emulation, since it’s always possible to align the partitions on cylinders that cause the 4KB file-system clusters to align with 4KB disk sectors without running any risk that old software will not play well with megabyte-style alignment; Registry tweaks can force Disk Management in current Windows versions to honor cylinder-style alignment too). Same observation applies to current or at worst relatively recent popular disk- and partition-imaging programs (I think the farthest I have to reach back is Seagate’s DiscWizard version 11 which was the standard version until about 3 years ago though a newer version was available for people who wanted to be able to use disks larger than 2 TB on XP; v11 supports Win2K through Win7). While the latest versions of many utilities may not run on Win2K earlier versions with more than adequate facilities do, including loads of multimedia software (though if we wanted to do any significant amount of stream-video capturing I’d probably use Win8 for that, appropriate software being relatively rare on Win2K, and I forget which one of the stream-media services like Netflix doesn’t run on FF v12). The last (real) version of TrueCrypt (R.I.P.) supports Win2K, though unless resurrected apparently will never support encrypting UEFI-booted system partitions. A recent version of Everything (a desktop search utility which I use a LOT) supports Win2K…

It might be easier to say what I DON’T use Win2K for, and the easiest way to jog my memory should be to see what applications I have installed on XP and Win8 (my supplementary go-to systems: I’ll only bother doing a clean-install upgrade from Win8 to Win8.1 if I start using it much). Hmmm, XP is pretty bare: about the only thing I occasionally use it for is a funky little utility that unwraps a ‘GiveAwayOfTheDay’ freebie such that it can be installed at a later date, which doesn’t run well in 64-bit environments and won’t run on Win2K (though using a dll wrapper would likely fix that).

Otherwise, I usually test non-Win2K software that I might be interested in using on Win8 and/or temporarily install non-Win2K time-limited freebies to create non-time-limited bootable media that I might want to use down the road, but what I actually USE on Win8 seems to be limited to running a recent version of Firefox when v12 on Win2K encounters a Web site that ignores the needs of slightly older browsers or simply sniffs haughtily, suggests that you upgrade, and refuses to run on them; if this happened at all frequently I’d just use the wrapper dll that lets current versions of FF run on Win2K. Any need to run IE on Win8 (I never run it on Win2K any more) is very rare.

I do have AOMEI’s Backupper and Easeus’s ToDo Backup partition-imaging software installed on Win8 because at the time that we got our pesky 32-bit Win8 UEFI netbook they were the only programs which would create bootable CDs for it (32-bit UEFI being unwilling to support ‘legacy’ boot mechanisms at all, at least on any platform that supports ‘connected standby’: thanks, Microsoft): it just seemed prudent not to have the backed-up computer be the only one on which they were installed. And if I played recent games much (for that matter I don’t play ANY games much, though I like having Win98SE and/or DOS 7.1 around if I want to play something OLD) I suspect I’d be using Win8 more for that (e.g., Steam no longer runs on Win2K, nor does Origin).

I did use XP the other day along with the old Adaptec AHA-2940UW SCSI PCI card that I used to use on Win98 with a Jaz drive (an experience which soured me on Iomega products for life) to get data off an early-’90s Macintosh LC III, whose interoperability with PCs is limited (incompatible floppies, only Localtalk serial-port networking unless you buy an Ethernet card, SCSI hard drive with HFS file system, and USB didn’t exist back then), but as a matter of convenience rather than actual need (and when all was said and done using Win2K would likely have been more convenient but I didn’t know at the time that the software I was using ran there).

So in answer to your question I find that the software I run on Win2K satisfies almost all of my moderately wide range of needs with only a few exceptions, but after writing all the above it just dawned on me that you may have instead been asking what software I NEEDED Win2K for in order to use, and the answer to that would be very little. I don’t use Win2K because I NEED to, I use it because I LIKE it better than later Windows systems (Vista and later being particularly annoying due to their nanny-like nature, and then of course there’s Win8…) and have until now had no sufficiently pressing need to ‘upgrade’. But even leaving aside the fact that finding new hardware with adequate support for Win2K has become difficult the so-far-minor functional needs that Win2K won’t satisfy do keep growing in number as the years progress and while XP would address virtually all of them right now in a manner that I’d find minimally annoying a few years down the road it too will likely need supplementing, so the fact that Win8.1 may future-proof my computing environment for another dozen years or so (unless MS deliberately changes things so much in Win10 that third-party software vendors will start abandoning Win 8.1 long before its nominal end of life) is making it look competitive (and if I find it too annoying I can always virtualize a system that I like better on top of it, though so far I’ve always run directly on hardware: did you know that you can install Windows for Workgroups 3.11 on top of the DOS 7.1 system that you can get by stripping Win98 off the top, and that the result will run on virtually any hardware that has or can emulate a BIOS? just for fun, of course: even I would not argue very strongly for the continuing general utility of pre-Win2K versions of Windows, though some of the die-hards at msfn.org have created wrappers that allow a great deal of XP and even later software to run on Win9x).

In the past I’ve often upgraded my OS when buying new hardware. Or when critical software suppliers stopped supporting their products on older OSes. But last year I built my own desktop PC which I hope will last me for a very long time as I replace and upgrade components rather than wholesale replacements of the whole machine. So longevity of the software is also of greater interest to me than it once was.

Software will last as long as the bits that encode it (so keep multiple copies of those bits), and software worth keeping should after becoming mature have minimal need for further support (save for anti-malware signature updates or heuristics that can catch new and unusual nasties). Only new needs require new software and new systems to run it on, and sometimes those new systems break software that you depended upon so it can be more prudent to add the new systems as supplements rather than as replacements until you know how things will shake out.

Reply | Quote

This is “Zedpeh”. I wrote the first response to the Microsoft item. Thanks for the inputs, and I will certainly go immediately ahead and emulate Messrs. Bloom and Butler and go for Apple. How can I consider costs being an issue, as Mr Primak warns, after spending so much on upgrades to Microsoft? I wonder if a larger -world-wide- Internet protest could change anything to break this continual betrayal of its faithful customers by Microsoft. How about starting one? Any poll I read in the past detests the past XP and present Win 7 betrayals and curse Win 8 or 8.1. I am increasingly angry at being duped, as I stated in my first response, and would still like to hear other suggestions or those mentioned by Ms Bradley in her previous article.

Be well

Dr H Zedpeh

Reply | Quote

This is “Zedpeh”. I wrote the first response to the Microsoft item. Thanks for the inputs, and I will certainly go immediately ahead and emulate Messrs. Bloom and Butler and go for Apple. How can I consider costs being an issue, as Mr Primak warns, after spending so much on upgrades to Microsoft? I wonder if a larger -world-wide- Internet protest could change anything to break this continual betrayal of its faithful customers by Microsoft. How about starting one? Any poll I read in the past detests the past XP and present Win 7 betrayals and curse Win 8 or 8.1. I am increasingly angry at being duped, as I stated in my first response, and would still like to hear other suggestions or those mentioned by Ms Bradley in her previous article.

Be well

Dr H Zedpeh

Microsoft never offered free updates between different operating system versions, not that I can remember anyway and certainly never promised to do so. Even Apple used to charge for updates, although charging quite a bit less than Microsoft. As such, I don’t see how Microsoft violated any contract with you, or anyone else, for that matter. Windows versions support cycles are known and a quick search could get you informed. In any event, extended support for Windows 7 will only expire in 2020. Considering 7 was released in 2009, 11 years of support for an operating system in an era of fast technological evolution, seems quite reasonable to me. I suspect you will find Apple won’t offer support for that long, so in order not to accuse Apple of contract I suggest that you check their support conditions:

– Hardware obsolescence conditions: http://support.apple.com/en-us/HT1752 (you will see a product will be considered obsolete 7 years after being discontinued). You will find some desktops from 2006 already obsolete.

Also as far as I could find (not an Apple user) they will support no more than 3 OS versions. If you consider they release a new OS version every 18 months or so, do not expect more than 54 months of operating system support. That is less than 5 years and well below what Microsoft provides for their operating systems.

As I said, better to know what you are getting into when you make a choice. This doesn’t mean you shouldn’t make any choice you want, but it is always better when such a choice is an informed one.

Reply | Quote

Thanks for your in-put, Rui. Not being computer -literate I confess I do not understand all you wrote but appreciate the fact that you have stimulated further investigation. I use my pc and mail for leisure but sympathise for the small-business man and feel they have certainly the right to being heard for damages and financial loss. When I buy the Microsoft package I am not told that I can expect it to die in five years. This is what I mean by being duped. A fact like this would have certainly resulted in re-appraising my purchase. The first article about the demise of Win 7 by Ms. Bradley really got to me since it has so far taking me a couple of years to master it! Especially annoying are those IT geniuses who keep frustrating me with articles “What you did not know your Win 7 can do”…reminding me that I can never be the master of the system I chose or benefit from it completely in the short remaining shelf-life! Frustration is the key word of my reaction to Microsoft products in the past 17 years -when I got my first pc- and am begging for some-one to offer me an alternative.

Reply | Quote

Thanks for your in-put, Rui. Not being computer -literate I confess I do not understand all you wrote but appreciate the fact that you have stimulated further investigation. I use my pc and mail for leisure but sympathise for the small-business man and feel they have certainly the right to being heard for damages and financial loss. When I buy the Microsoft package I am not told that I can expect it to die in five years. This is what I mean by being duped. A fact like this would have certainly resulted in re-appraising my purchase. The first article about the demise of Win 7 by Ms. Bradley really got to me since it has so far taking me a couple of years to master it! Especially annoying are those IT geniuses who keep frustrating me with articles “What you did not know your Win 7 can do”…reminding me that I can never be the master of the system I chose or benefit from it completely in the short remaining shelf-life! Frustration is the key word of my reaction to Microsoft products in the past 17 years -when I got my first pc- and am begging for some-one to offer me an alternative.

Well, Windows 7 will be 11 years old by 2020. No other company offers such a long support for its operating systems, currently. If longevity is the goal, I fear there is no better than Windows. Windows 7 will keep working past 2020, like XP still does.

Reply | Quote

Well, Windows 7 will be 11 years old by 2020. No other company offers such a long support for its operating systems, currently. If longevity is the goal, I fear there is no better than Windows. Windows 7 will keep working past 2020, like XP still does.

Agreed: for all the things that MS can legitimately be criticized for, support duration is not AFAICT one of them. I haven’t tried to run Windows Update on a Win9x system in nearly a decade but it would not surprise me if it still worked, and the last time I did so on Win2K it certainly did (though I haven’t needed to recently since I retain copies of all patches just in case and use them and/or incorporate them into a fully-patched installation CD – thank you and R.I.P., HFSLIP – rather than download again).

That said, MS is hardly beyond using scare tactics supported by bogus ‘research’ (particularly conspicuous in the run-up to XP’s end-of-support date) to try to convince users to upgrade, even well before the end of extended support occurs. But it would probably be unfair to single them out for that: it’s a pretty standard marketing tactic.

Now, if you’d like to discuss how MS manipulated the move to UEFI to make life difficult for people who wanted to run anything other than Win8/8.1…

Reply | Quote

Well, Windows 7 will be 11 years old by 2020. No other company offers such a long support for its operating systems, currently. If longevity is the goal, I fear there is no better than Windows. Windows 7 will keep working past 2020, like XP still does.

I’m guessing that when 2020 rolls around, MS will extend support for a bit longer, like they did with previous OSs.

Group "L" (Linux Mint)
with Windows 10 running in a remote session on my file server

Reply | Quote

Hello everyone,
The way I understand it and the way it’s described in the article, this is just the first milestone. Full support (second milestone – patches, etc.) will not stop until 2020, five years away. This is still too soon to suit me but that’s what I’ve heard. If that has been changed, I’d be interested to know about it. It really is too bad that M$ won’t support its older programs that are still very useable and liked by so many.

Being 20 something in the 70's was so much better than being 70 something in the insane 20's

Reply | Quote

Hello everyone,
The way I understand it and the way it’s described in the article, this is just the first milestone. Full support (second milestone – patches, etc.) will not stop until 2020, five years away. This is still too soon to suit me but that’s what I’ve heard. If that has been changed, I’d be interested to know about it. It really is too bad that M$ won’t support its older programs that are still very useable and liked by so many.

You are not wrong. Microsoft will provide security patches for Windows 7 until 2020.

Reply | Quote

As many have posted, the cutoff point for MS security updates in 2020 isn’t the end of Win 7’s usefulness.
The real point is that something better for security and new features will probably be offered.
The portion of the title of the article, “prepare for its demise” is certainly an attention getter, but, IMHO, a bit over stated.

To those that present Apple as an option, apparently you feel you aren’t bound to MS by specific apps needs. Good luck with that :D.
But if you actually don’t need specific Windows apps, might as well jump into a Linux distro now.
While I have specific needs of a MS Windows platform, this morning I’m surfing with Puppy Linux and currently posting with it, here.
Big benefit is it’s free.

But I have no intention of giving up on MS Windows because I do need if for things other than surfing and posting at web sites on the Internet.

So, while I’ll probably keep Win 7 at least till 2020, I won’t rule out a future MS OS if it will benefit me.

Reply | Quote

For those so passionate about Windows 7, might I point out that the Technical Preview of Windows 10 shows promising and significant similarities to Windows 7, and will probably end up being a worthy and usable successor to Windows 7 in the ways that Windows 8/8.1 really wasn’t!

BATcher

Plethora means a lot to me.

Reply | Quote

Susan’s article suggested that you might need to uninstall .NET Framework 1.1 and “see what breaks.” There is a much simpler, safer solution, which I have had in my tool bag for the last five years. To meet a similar need, I rolled my own property viewer that displays the ImageRuntimeVersion of any Microsoft .NET program. Fortuitously, I built it against the Microsoft .NET Framework 4 Client Profile. Since Client Profile is the basic version that many people will have installed on their machines, and it’s the version that shipped with Windows 7, as I recall, if you have Windows 7, you should already have the Microsoft .NET Framework 4 Client Profile.

To decrease the risk of file naming collisions, I named my program WWDisplayAssemblyInfo.exe, and I am releasing it under the three-paragraph BSD license.

Installation is straightforward; install it into any convenient directory, preferably one that is in your PATH list. The names of the main program and its two satellite assemblies are unlikely to conflict with anything else in the directory.

Usage is equally straightforward, unless a command prompt terrifies you.

1) Open a command prompt (DOS prompt).

1) Enter the program name, followed by a space, then the name of the program to be evaluated.

For example, if the current directory is the directory into which yu extracted this archive, the following command asks the program to report on itself.

WWDisplayAssemblyInfo.exe WWDisplayAssemblyInfo.exe

The output of the above command is as follows.

C:UsersDAVEDocuments1) Open a command prompt (DOS prompt).

1) Enter the program name, followed by a space, then the name of the program to be evaluated.

For example, if the current directory is the directory into which you extracted the archive, the following command asks the program to report on itself.

WWDisplayAssemblyInfo.exe WWDisplayAssemblyInfo.exe

The output of the above command is as follows.

C:UsersDAVEDocumentsVisual Studio 2013ProjectsTools_for_ProgrammersWWDisplayAssemblyInfo_Notesdistrib>WWDisplayAssemblyInfo.exe WWDisplayAssemblyInfo.exe
WWDisplayAssemblyInfo, version 2.0.2.23209
Begin @ 2015-01-11 11:56:12 (2015-01-11 17:56:12 UTC)

Detaile for assembly WWDisplayAssemblyInfo.exe:

Name = WWDisplayAssemblyInfo
Version = 2.0.2.23209
Culture = neutral
PublicKeyToken = null
Assembly GUID = c4a55fff-5666-4ccd-9d51-f6d22a037ea9
ImageRuntimeVersion = v4.0.30319
Last Modified = 2011-10-09 13:53:39
Last Modified = 2011-10-09 18:53:39 UTC

WWDisplayAssemblyInfo End – 2015-01-11 11:56:12 (2015-01-11 17:56:12 UTC)
Elapsed time: 00:00:00.000

As always, paths that contain embedded spaces must be quoted.

David A. Gray

Designing for the Ages, One Challenge at a Time

Reply | Quote

Susan’s article suggested that you might need to uninstall .NET Framework 1.1 and “see what breaks.” There is a much simpler, safer solution, which I have had in my tool bag for the last five years. To meet a similar need, I rolled my own property viewer that displays the ImageRuntimeVersion of any Microsoft .NET program. Fortuitously, I built it against the Microsoft .NET Framework 4 Client Profile. Since Client Profile is the basic version that many people will have installed on their machines, and it’s the version that shipped with Windows 7, as I recall, if you have Windows 7, you should already have the Microsoft .NET Framework 4 Client Profile.

The version that shipped with Windows 7 was .Net 3.5.

Reply | Quote

Thank God I purchased a comercial upgrade (initial Summer offering at discount) instead of an OEM license. Recently re-installed Win7 as a VM; works great but it’s taxing even on my 12GByte AMD 8-core w/ Win8.1 as Host. Still, when I do feel XP becomes too much a liability (don’t feel that it is for the way I use it yet), then I have a back up VM. Just ran the monthly security updates for it a few minutes ago. lol

Reply | Quote

I am at the point where I say “why bother with anything”. I jumped on the Windows a bandwagon only to discover that it was a waste of time and money. I understand that Microsoft is going to move off of Windows 7, but it also means that I am not going to invest any sizable money into Microsoft products because they change their mind too much. However, I do have sympathy for my friends who use Apple iOS and iPads because they spend a lot of money and pay a premium price for something that is hard to keep updated. If you follow a lot of the YouTube videos they would talk about the new technological advances but those advances are only good if somebody uses them. I have not found a substantial use for USB 3.0, except for external hard drives. Therefore, why would I care about thunderbolt. I am happy that this article reminds us that we don’t have a lot of control as consumers except not to buy something, but with big companies that not going to feel it as much as you think. The article also reminds us that improvements come at a price. I’m okay with paid a price as long as it is an improvement that I can actually use without having to mortgage my house.

Reply | Quote

I am at the point where I say “why bother with anything”. I jumped on the Windows a bandwagon only to discover that it was a waste of time and money. I understand that Microsoft is going to move off of Windows 7, but it also means that I am not going to invest any sizable money into Microsoft products because they change their mind too much. However, I do have sympathy for my friends who use Apple iOS and iPads because they spend a lot of money and pay a premium price for something that is hard to keep updated. If you follow a lot of the YouTube videos they would talk about the new technological advances but those advances are only good if somebody uses them. I have not found a substantial use for USB 3.0, except for external hard drives. Therefore, why would I care about thunderbolt. I am happy that this article reminds us that we don’t have a lot of control as consumers except not to buy something, but with big companies that not going to feel it as much as you think. The article also reminds us that improvements come at a price. I’m okay with paid a price as long as it is an improvement that I can actually use without having to mortgage my house.

Every technology vendor I know of makes changes. Windows 7 has five more years of solid support. That’s five years of not changing.

Reply | Quote