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There are isolated problems with current patches, but they are well-known and documented on this site. |
UPDATES: See my Computerworld Woody on Windows article.
I saw the first heads up here on AskWoody, from @jwhiz56. He says: This KB installed on my MS Surface Pro 3, my HP HPDV8T laptop but refuses to install
[See the full post at: Win10 Fall Creators Update cumulative update KB 4054517 refusing to install]
Because it’s yet another reason why people should avoid 1709.
(And, in spite of myself, I feel empathy for people who let 1703 upgrade them to 1709.)
I imagine Woody is asking the many, many folks who might not have full control over their computers and have been pushed by Microsoft into upgrading to v1709 before it’s good enough to be their operating system.
This whole thing is kind of reminiscent of when Microsoft moved from booting into DOS then starting Windows to a system that boots directly into Windows – and for how many years there were gotchas where people could get into “you can’t get there from here” situations.
Except this time we’ve already seen them do better in the past.
-Noel
Your post reminded me of this post of mine.
OMG Win10 is so persistent. It’s like a terminator.
I put DENY on everything for that folder for SYSTEM … and it still tried to do the update.
Then I tried this.
I make a 0 length text file in that directory. (after deleting all other files)
Renamed it to “Windows10UpgraderApp.exe”
set every imaginable permission for that file to DENY for every user.
A few minutes ago Win10 threw up a whiny little error message saying it didn’t have permission to overwrite that file.
Success!
I love my W7 more and more…
Windows 10 Home 22H2, Acer Aspire TC-1660 desktop + LibreOffice, non-techie
I love my Win 8.1 pretty much the same. However, I can stand Windows 10 and Microsoft’s policy shifts less and less.
-Noel
I don’t love my Windows. That’s what MS is trying to achieve with Windows 10. It’s just an operating system – it’s supposed to work and nothing more. I may have loved “Bioshock” when I first played it, but I’m now not even 100% sure if I ran it on W7 or W8.1.
I have successfully updated 2 Win10 Pro 1703 and 1 Win10 Pro 1709 with no glitches. No upgrades were forced on the 1703s. No updates were downloaded/installed without my approval.
1703s (KB4053580 CU, KB4053577 IE Flash, KB2267602 Defender, KB890830 MSRT)
1709S (KB4054517 CU, KB4053577 IE Flash, KB4058043 MS Store, KB890830 MSRT)
My Settings are:
1703 CBB (which is ignored), 1709 SAC
Defer feature updates 365 days
Defer quality updates 0 days
In Group Policy Admin Templates\Windows components\Delivery Optimization = 99 Simple (simple download, no peering, HTTP, no DO)
In Group Policy Admin Templates\Windows components\Windows Updates ConfigureAutoUpdates is Enabled = 2 (ask download/install)
Perhaps the Anti=virus. I’m using TrendMicro (paid) and Bitdefender Free with no problems. But some of the other brands are not so kind.
The major other problem that I’ve seen most of in the past is the Graphics component (not video drivers) – but there doesn’t seem to be error codes or as many BSODs this time.
I still can’t work out why so many people continue to put up with Windows 10? Apart from the MS fanboys I’ve seen on various forums (who seem to reach a state of rapture every time a new insider build is released – and, at the same time appear to suffer withdrawal symptoms when a new build isn’t released almost daily) I can’t understand why anyone would want to continue to punish themselves with this perpetual beta (alpha??) operating system?
Honestly, you would think after all the telemetry that MS has collected from the millions of unpaid beta testers over the past several years that W10 would be the best/most secure Windows version yet (how many times have we heard that one over the years?).
Meanwhile, back here in Windows 7 land, it is (mostly) all clear skies and smooth sailing – no forced updates which seem to break things more often than not these days, no ads (hint to MS – the amount of acceptable ads in a paid for operating system is ZERO), no new version every 6 months which usually involves a complete clean install of W10, etc., etc.
I like to use my computer for getting things done, even if it is just playing games – not spend half the day trying to fix MS’s mistakes.
Most of your grievances are solved by tweaking it and setting both branch readiness and deferral of feature and quality updates. Once controlled that way, 10 is easily the best version of Windows you can run. As for the telemetry, if you tweak that, you transmit no more data than any version before it. You can’t run 7 or 8.1 forever… the clock is ticking, after all.
You can’t run 7 or 8.1 forever… the clock is ticking, after all.
+5 years (for W8.1) is pretty d**n long in IT by any standards… And, while you can easily run W8.1 on your current setup until 2023 safely (there will be no changes that would make your hardware obsolete), you can’t be sure that Windows 1803, 1809 or any later version will simply refuse to install on your system. Hence – while you’re safe to say that W8.1 you can run for the next +5 years, it’s not safe to say that any hardware will run W10 1803 – and that’ll be in 4 months.
It’s been 2 years and I haven’t come across any DX12 exclusive game I’d want to play. There are no other obvious reasons to jump in this pond. And quite a few against.
zero2dash said;
Most of your grievances are solved by tweaking it and setting both branch readiness and deferral of feature and quality updates. Once controlled that way, 10 is easily the best version of Windows you can run. As for the telemetry, if you tweak that, you transmit no more data than any version before it.
That’s only postponing the problem. You can only defer cumulative updates for about 7 days maximum. M$ have begun to not respect users’ deferral of feature updates for Win 10 1709. For Win 10 Home 1709, you can no longer stop Windows Update through the Registry setting.
You are never in full control of Win 10, eg M$ often delete your 3rd-party programs, files/folders and settings during a feature update.
Win 7/8.1 users have the option to not install Telemetry updates, eg KB2952664, and the monthly Rollups. Ask Noel Carboni about how he stopped nearly all Telemetry & Data collection by M$ in Win 7/8.1.
When you say “10 is the best version of Windows released, from a usability and multitasking standpoint” you are making a subjective opinion sound as if it were a factual statement – which it is not, it’s just your own personal experience.
While I am happy to keep all options open until January 2020, on the present state of Windows 10 and given the nature of my gaming preferences, the future beyond that date is beginning to look like a possible extension of time by upgrading from 7 to 8.1 unless it becomes feasible to continue with 7 beyond January 2020 – which may well be the case either because MS bow to the inevitable and extend its life or else because an unsupported 7 proves to be more reliable than a supported 10, with other ways of providing protection. No non-Windows OS is likely to meet my requirements.
However, there is plenty of time still to go, and in any event at my age I tend not to plan too far ahead!
I like to use my computer for getting things done, even if it is just playing games – not spend half the day trying to fix MS’s mistakes.
That brings me back bad old memories of
//wasted night
repeat{
install Win95 (bunch of floppies, more_than_1_hour);
} until (win95 >= stable_enough);
One word of warning: BUY A SPARE PRINTER, compatible with Win7, BEFORE Win7’s end-of-life date. After that, the printer manufacturer will be forbidden by MS to supply the Win7 driver for the printer (because some required component is actually an MS file).
I have experience of this: shortly after Win98’s end-of-life, I bought a (USB interface) HP inkjet which the merchant advertised as “Win98-compatible”. (I also needed a parallel port interface, to use it with MS-DOS 5 and 6 for plain text, but that’s another story). Inside the box, to my dismay, was a flier saying “HP can’t supply the Win98 driver any longer, MS says NO”.
Fixed it 
This may not be the best place for the following, but here goes anyway…
Today I was doing maintenance on a relative’s Windows 10 computer, when the Java Updater popped up announcing the availability of the newest version of Java. I clicked on it, and when the Java installer came up, Windows 10 launched a big window warning me that “this app did not come from the Windows Store”, and did I want to proceed anyway?
Note that this wasn’t a traditional UAC prompt. Rather, it was specifically warning against installing something that wasn’t from their store. I had never before seen this kind of attempt to herd users into the walled garden of MS. The course Windows is being taken on is coming increasingly into focus.
Somewhere in the settings there is a check box that says “install from anywhere.” Probably under the apps and features setting. Maybe someone changed the default.
Oh, and turn off Smart Screen Filter on the desktop.
Loving my 1703 with all my heart. I will only install 1709 when Microsoft gets it’s act together to fix up it’s issues including making sure it’s updates install right than being refused and to ensure nobody loses wifi connection as well.
The basic problem here is that the update can get to 99% then fail, revert, and there is NO WAY TO KNOW why. Not even if you dig with the geekiest intentions into the event logs and such files as CBS.log and other system files.
I’ve had both 1703 and 1709 get into this mode.
Perhaps this will push Microsoft over the edge to emit a decent description of why it’s failing. They need to be beaten up until they concede that a complete lack of reporting isn’t even a little bit acceptable!
-Noel
The basic problem here is that the update can get to 99% then fail, revert, and there is NO WAY TO KNOW why. Not even if you dig with the geekiest intentions into the event logs and such files as CBS.log and other system files.
It looks like there is some magic to find an error code, based on a tweet thread about KB4054517, with Jen Gentleman from MS:
0x80070BC2. I run troubleshooting, sfc, dism, and also manually restarted windows update. I even tried to install that update as a standalone (from update catalog). Same problem
— Anton Kozlov (@anton_kozlov) 15 December 2017
Defer quality updates 0 days
Curious why you do this.
I have mine set to 30 days.
I do also have mine set to Automatic Updates = 2, but I have quality updates deferred for 30 days.
That way, if WU checks, it’s not pulling updates (or even finding updates) until long after the DEFCON rating has improved.
I figure, it’s an additional “sanity check”, which, given 10’s reduced update control, gives a little peace of mind to me, at least.
A short while later, Anton reported it had allowed the KB to install, but he had new problems from there:
Upon clean install from ISO, updates installed. However, I now can’t open any links in the browser: state repository service is high on cpu and pc freezes.
The thing that irritates me the most about 8/8.1 is the Charms menu and the Settings – obviously, this has been exacerbated in 10, where they’ve continued taking stuff out of Control Panel and putting it in Settings.
I use Metro Killer to eradicate them both (charms and Settings) from 8.1. Classic Shell allows the user to disable all the hot corners that bring up the charms, but Metro Killer does something wonderful in memory that blocks anything Metro from running at all until you restart explorer.exe. I’ve found ways of doing everything I need without Settings or anything else Metro… I use the Intel ProSet software with my wifi card on my laptop (taking the place of the Metro wireless network dialog), and I use NetSetMan for the same thing on my desktop (since it has no Intel wifi card, I can’t use ProSet).
I use the Atheros Bluetooth suite on the desktop (which has an Atheros Bluetooth adapter built into the motherboard) and the Toshiba Bluetooth Stack on my laptop (it uses a CSR BT183) to replace the Metro Windows dialogs. I use the management console to create new user accounts (which the “users” applet in Control Panel can no longer do in 8.1).
Well, I use those when I am still in Windows, anyway, which is happening less and less often on my laptop (the desktop is still in Windows most of the time). I am using the laptop under Linux Mint 18.3 now (using Waterfox) to write this. Except for the rare case when I want to run some Windows-only games (that don’t lend themselves to WINE, particularly with my laptop’s limited performance; we’re not talking about modern AAA titles by any means), I simply don’t need Windows much anymore on the lappy.
Dell XPS 13/9310, i5-1135G7/16GB, KDE Neon 6.2
XPG Xenia 15, i7-9750H/32GB & GTX1660ti, Kubuntu 24.04
Acer Swift Go 14, i5-1335U/16GB, Kubuntu 24.04 (and Win 11)
I haven’t tried Metro Killer, but I get zero appearance of or influence from Charms or the Start Screen or any Metro/Modern component on my Win 8.1 desktop workstation setup. It’s a pure desktop system – essentially Windows 7.1. And quite lean… It settles to 42 processes to support an idle desktop (12 of them things I’ve added), with 99.5%+ free CPU time on average.
Thing is, Win 8.1 had been started down the dark path, but was only a limited distance from the entrance to the haunted mansion so that it could be pulled all the way back into the light through reconfiguration and augmentation. By contrast, though Win 10 responds to many of the same tweaks, it’s now so far gone with mobile/App garbage that it’s near impossible to maintain a nice, work-oriented pure desktop setup with it. As illustrated by this thread and others, Win 10 is past the “why bother?” stage and solidly into the “it’s just too much work to keep it running for no apparent gain” realm.
-Noel
Hi, Everyone:
I tried installing KB 4054517 three times. Each time, the installation failed. So, I temporarily disabled Norton Internet Security Smart Firewall and Auto-Protect. Within a few minutes, the update installed successfully.
Go figure…
John
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