Win 10 dilemma

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I don’t know if this is the right place for this post; if not, please move it.

I’m at my wits’ end with my almost 12 yr-old Compaq/HP small business PC that began with XP Home, was upgraded to Win7 Home, and suffered so many problems I’m running a bare-bones system with just Office 2010 Pro Plus Outlook/Word, and DuckDuckGo/Chrome (and Ccleaner and MSE).

I’ve contemplated buying a new pc with Win 10, but after reading about all the problems, I’m reluctant to do it. It will go out of date sooner rather than later anyway and I’ll be back to square one.

Hardly anyone is selling desktop pc’s, and I’m visually impaired, so a large monitor is a necessity for me. I have a 17″ laptop on which I put Quicken, but much of the time, I can’t use all the functions because it’s not designed for a lower resolution. I don’t know how to connect my 24″ monitor to two computers at once.

I’m a disabled senior citizen with decades of computing experience, but I’m not a tech. I don’t drive, have no family or friends to help (I know more about computing than they do); just developed double vision due to a drug my doctor prescribed (and I stopped), but I’m at a standstill. The computer store around the corner went out of business.

HELP, please…

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The major computer manufacturers (Dell, HP, etc) and other computer vendors (Amazon, BestBuy, etc) still sell desktop computers. These could be ordered and delivered to you. You should be able to use your existing monitor, keyboard, mouse.
A new computer would come with Windows 10, but it is usable and has Accessibility Settings to accomodate disabilities.

You can also keep using your Windows 7 computer for a while.
You will need to stop using IE as your browser – install Chrome or Firefox.
MSE will supposedly continue to get definition updates, but will no longer get program updates. So you should also start looking for another (free) anit-virus program.

If you have any questions, ask them here. There are many people to help.

1 user thanked author for this post.

gjacwel

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BTSAZ1989 wrote:

I’ve contemplated buying a new pc with Win 10, but after reading about all the problems, I’m reluctant to do it.

While problems exist, most people use windows 10 without issue.

BTSAZ1989 wrote:

It will go out of date sooner rather than later anyway and I’ll be back to square one.

Microsoft says windows 10 is their last operating system.  Everything should work until the hardware fails or is old enough to become unsupported.

Win 11 home - 24H2
Attitude is a choice...Choose wisely

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There is quite a bit of computer help available for senior citizens and those with disabilities. Much of it is free and some of it is in-home, the latter of which can sometimes be very useful and efficient. Do a search for “computer help for senior citizens” or something similar. You can even include “in my area” or “in mytown”.

Here’s a few links that might help you get started:

https://www.elderadvisorygroup.com/2015/09/21/aarp-offers-free-tech-help-for-seniors/

https://www.rightathome.net/blog/technology-for-seniors

And of course, as @PKCano said above askwoody is a very helpful site.

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[The Surfing Pensioner]

Please don’t despair. Like you, I have been hanging on to an old Windows 7 P.C. because it has given excellent service and I felt safe with it. In fact, I even invested in a little Chromebook so that I could go on creating documents on my Windows 7 P.C. whilst securely accessing the internet by another means (I am nearly 70 and a trifle resistant to change). But as of yesterday, my CrystalDisk Info began to report the early signs of hard drive failure. The timing is interesting: I shall have to replace the hard drive – or buy a new P.C. – and it doesn’t make a lot of sense to re-install Windows 7 on a new hard drive: even I can see that. And so I shall have to face my fear and start researching Windows 10: after all, other people manage to use it quite successfully. I find myself more accepting of my fate than I expected, possibly because it feels as if the P.C. has made the decision for me……………….maybe it doesn’t want to be relegated to offline duties. I’m sure you and I can both learn to cope with Windows 10 and eventually live at peace with it, and I have heard that Windows 10 is disability-friendly. May I encourage you to take the plunge?

• This reply was modified 5 years, 3 months ago by The Surfing Pensioner.

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You are quite right that it makes little sense to buy a new HD to reinstall an unsupported OS. As to what to use instead, well: I may be quite a bit older than you and, yet, I’m getting accustomed to using Linux in dual boot with Windows 7 in my 8 1/2 year-old laptop. So far, the old PC’s HD is going gangbusters…

Although, truth be told: I have used Linux, UNIX and the like for years, but without having to take care myself of the OS or the machines in which I run it, because some employer or the government always took care of all that for me. And it is quite a big step from that cozy situation to being all on my own, doing everything. But I seem to be managing. So far.

Probably, in your case, I would also consider installing Windows 10 as the least bothersome thing to do; so I would pinch my nose hard and with my free hand proceed to do that to the poor new HD…

Ex-Windows user (Win. 98, XP, 7); since mid-2017 using also macOS. Presently on Monterey 12.15 & sometimes running also Linux (Mint).

MacBook Pro circa mid-2015, 15" display, with 16GB 1600 GHz DDR3 RAM, 1 TB SSD, a Haswell architecture Intel CPU with 4 Cores and 8 Threads model i7-4870HQ @ 2.50GHz.
Intel Iris Pro GPU with Built-in Bus, VRAM 1.5 GB, Display 2880 x 1800 Retina, 24-Bit color.
macOS Monterey; browsers: Waterfox "Current", Vivaldi and (now and then) Chrome; security apps. Intego AV

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Thanks for your encouragement, Oscar. Unfortunately, my local I.T. technician is not versed in Linux and so due to the timing I feel the decision has been made for me: best to give in gracefully, as you suggest! I am researching Windows 10 right now……………………will report back after Christmas. I’m just grateful that CrystalDisk gave me this warning, or I could have found myself looking at a blue screen come the New Year.

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If you get a brand new name-brand computer with sufficient memory and hard drive space (and Windows 10 Pro), it is unlikely you will have problems any time soon (unless you happen to get a defective computer, which isn’t likely if you get a name-brand computer).

Here’s an excellent computer:
https://www.dell.com/en-us/work/shop/desktops-all-in-one-pcs/optiplex-3060-tower-and-small-form-factor/spd/optiplex-3060-desktop/s037o3060sffus

Dell Optiplex 3060 Small Form Factor
8 GB of RAM
500 GB hard drive
Two video ports – one DisplayPort and one HDMI – you can immediately connect two monitors.
You can get a VGA port added in at no charge – even though VGA is low-quality video, it will get you by in a pinch, and it’s a third video port, in case you need an additional video port.

The above computer is currently $539. This is an excellent computer – one of my customers has about 12 of these, and they are trouble-free and fast.

For $38 dollars additional, you can get 3 years of Pro Support Plus, which includes next day on-site service (if your computer has a hardware problem, e.g. if the hard drive crashes). This service includes accidental damage warranty. This is an excellent warranty.

As for connecting one monitor to two computers, here is some helpful information:
https://www.online-tech-tips.com/computer-tips/how-to-connect-two-or-more-computers-to-one-monitor/

There are some KVM switches available here:
https://www.iogear.com/kvm-switch.htm

I saw only DVI and HDMI switches; I didn’t see any DisplayPort switches. Worst case scenario, if neither of your monitors is DVI or HDMI, you could convert from one video type to another with adapters.

Group "L" (Linux Mint)
with Windows 10 running in a remote session on my file server

1 user thanked author for this post.

Cybertooth

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Thanks, but I live in the U.K.! My desktop computer is actually owned by the small charity I co-ordinate and the trustees would not be able to justify replacing the whole P.C. if a new hard drive is all that is needed. My local I.T. technician is able to replace the hard drive for £65+ VAT – my guess is that will add up to about $100. I really don’t need two monitors; I get boggled enough with one! Thanks for your trouble, though.

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Perhaps the OP would be able to purchase a new PC. Based on his original post, it appears that he believes he needs a new PC.

Group "L" (Linux Mint)
with Windows 10 running in a remote session on my file server

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I appreciate all the responses, but most were generalizations, not specifics, which at this point in my life is what I need. Note to PK Cano: your responses tend to be rather condescending. No one with any sense would still be using IE… Note to whoever is using Kaspersky: that is what put the nail in the coffin of my PC…I’d always used Norton Internet Security but read a glowing review of Kaspersky, so I gave it a try. Bad choice; it didn’t work, and removing it destroyed my computer by removing the validation codes for both Windows AND MS Office!

My sincere thanks to Jim Phelps; however the unit you linked to is discontinued… If it isn’t too much of an imposition, I’m including the link I got from the Dell chat tech (who was more confused than I!) for the newer model. https://www.dell.com/en-us/work/shop/desktops-all-in-one-pcs/optiplex-3070-small-form-factor/spd/optiplex-3070-desktop/s008o3070sffus that I had to copy and paste into a new tab. The options were dizzying. I would like to get MS Office Pro with Outlook and Word if the price is right.

My pc was bought in 20o8 and upgraded from XP to Win 7 Home by MS. The 24″ monitor is newer but analog only. I have a new Logitech wireless mouse and keyboard. I’ve got to get Quicken into a format I can see! The laptop just isn’t cutting it. With a new PC, I can put it back with everything else and won’t need two monitors although a digital one might be nice:-).

The offers online at Dell were good until 1/6/20, so if this is your holiday, don’t feel compelled to interrupt it for me. Your further assistance would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks, BTSAZ

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The 3070 is a bit more expensive than the 3060, but it looks like an excellent choice. Dell gives you the option to get MS Office 365 with the computer. You could get Office 365 “Business” for $99 (one year subscription). This would give you Word, Excel, PowerPoint, Publisher, Access, and Outlook, as well as OneDrive (online storage). I have “Business Premium”, which includes all of that plus a bit more, and I am very pleased with it. Office 365 would go very nicely if you had a new computer.

Group "L" (Linux Mint)
with Windows 10 running in a remote session on my file server

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BTSAZ1989

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Thanks, MrJimPhelps! I especially appreciate you taking your time to respond so promptly on a holiday week!

One issue is that I am not fond of cloud computing by subscription; I prefer to have things on my PC… I’ve been the victim of ID Theft so many times, not because of anything I did, but because large companies were hacked. I’ve had a dozen years of  ‘ID Theft Protection’. Big Deal!  I’ve lost too many things to companies that stopped supporting their programs… I guess I’ll have to shell out for the regular version of Office. I only use Outlook and Word for the most part. I think they may have reduced the warranty offer; I saw nothing about on-site help, but perhaps that’s because I’m buying one, not twelve?

I’m under a lot of stress and your guidance is very comforting. Thanks again!

BTSAZ1989

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BTSAZ1989 wrote:

One issue is that I am not fond of cloud computing by subscription; I prefer to have things on my PC… I’ve been the victim of ID Theft so many times, not because of anything I did, but because large companies were hacked. I’ve had a dozen years of ‘ID Theft Protection’. Big Deal! I’ve lost too many things to companies that stopped supporting their programs… I guess I’ll have to shell out for the regular version of Office. I only use Outlook and Word for the most part. I think they may have reduced the warranty offer; I saw nothing about on-site help, but perhaps that’s because I’m buying one, not twelve?

You can purchase the local version of MS Office 2013, 2016, or 2019 at Newegg.com:
https://www.newegg.com/p/pl?N=100006800%2050001149%20600030326

2013 is supported till 4/11/2023; the other ones even longer.

Group "L" (Linux Mint)
with Windows 10 running in a remote session on my file server

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1. Don’t be afraid of Windows 10
2. Desk desktop pc’s are available from HP starting at $299.99 as of tonight December 25. However, you would probably be better off with a HP Pavilion Desktop – TP01-0105t at $499.99 or better. Be sure to talk with customer service to make sure that your monitor(s) are compatible with the unit you purchase.  HP can be found at https://www8.hp.com/us/en/home.html .
3. You will probably also need to purchase a new copy of Microsoft Office. I recommend Microsoft Office Home and Student 2019 available from NewEgg https://www.newegg.com/p/pl?d=Microsoft+Office+Home+and+Student+2019 for about $150.00. Buy a boxed version not the download and avoid a subscription edition.

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[mpw]

Kathy Stevens wrote:

1. Don’t be afraid of Windows 10
2. Desk desktop pc’s are available from HP starting at $299.99 as of tonight December 25. However, you would probably be better off with a HP Pavilion Desktop – TP01-0105t at $499.99 or better. Be sure to talk with customer service to make sure that your monitor(s) are compatible with the unit you purchase.  HP can be found at https://www8.hp.com/us/en/home.html .
3. You will probably also need to purchase a new copy of Microsoft Office. I recommend Microsoft Office Home and Student 2019 available from NewEgg https://www.newegg.com/p/pl?d=Microsoft+Office+Home+and+Student+2019 for about $150.00. Buy a boxed version not the download and avoid a subscription edition.

I went to New Egg link you provided.  New Egg says “Your activation code will be delivered on a Keycard with detailed instruction for installing the product. The manufacturer does not produce any CD/DVD/Flash drive for this product.” https://www.newegg.com/p/N82E16832011397

I don’t think any Office Suite comes with a CD/DVD/Flash drive.  I still have my Office Standard 2007 disc but that is a thing of the past unfortunately.

I will get Microsoft Office Home and Business 2019 as I really want Office Outlook and also I will be installing it on a new Windows 10 computer.

Really hate I have to do this.  I was perfectly happy with Windows 7 and Office Standard 2007.

HP Pavilion Desktop TP01-0050 – 64 bit
Windows 10 Home Version 22H2
OS build 19045.5608
Windows Defender and Windows Firewall
Microsoft Office Home and Business 2019
-Version 2502(Build 18526.20168 C2R)

• This reply was modified 5 years, 3 months ago by mpw.

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BTSAZ1989 wrote:

Hardly anyone is selling desktop pc’s, and I’m visually impaired, so a large monitor is a necessity for me. I have a 17″ laptop on which I put Quicken, but much of the time, I can’t use all the functions because it’s not designed for a lower resolution. I don’t know how to connect my 24″ monitor to two computers at once.

The issue of how to connect two computers to the same monitor is relatively easy to resolve.

In all likelihood, your monitor comes with more than one type of audio/video (A/V) connection in the back, for example VGA and DVI, or DVI and HDMI. Check the specs on your monitor’s manual to see which connections IN it has.

Next, you’ll need to see what connectors OUT your computers come with. It’s not unusual for PCs to include more than one type of A/V output. You only need to make sure that the connections OUT on your computers match the connections IN on your monitor. For example, your laptop may have an HDMI OUT connector while your PC has a VGA port; then if your monitor has both HDMI and VGA ports you are all set. Both of your computers can be hooked up to the monitor at the same time and you’ll only need to learn how to use the menu controls on your monitor to change the input and switch back and forth between the computers.

If you have matching connections for your computers in your monitor, then all you have to do is to use the proper cables to hook up each computer to the right port in the monitor, for example a VGA cable from one computer into the back of the monitor and an HDMI cable from the other computer into the back of the monitor.

Before making new connections between a computer and a monitor, make sure that all the machines involved (monitor and computers) are turned off. These are electrical connections you are establishing and the safest policy is to make sure that they are not “live,” lest you end up frying something.

Complications with the connector cables are possible. But your first step should be to see what are all the connections you have available on each computer, and which IN ports your monitor includes.

 

Keep Running Windows 7 Safely for Years to Come  
Make Windows 10 look and work like Windows 7

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To add to your practical and inexpensive advice there is a nifty piece of free software that allows you to switch between monitor inputs without pressing buttons on the monitor itself.

ClickMonitorDDC

https://clickmonitorddc.bplaced.net/

I use this to switch between 8 VGA systems on a KVM and my gaming PC on DVI-DL that has a different keyboard and mouse.

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That would be of interest to me but skimming the info @ your link I did not see that as possible could you direct me to the right place in the docs?

🍻

Just because you don't know where you are going doesn't mean any road will get you there.

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wavy wrote:

That would be of interest to me but skimming the info @ your link I did not see that as possible could you direct me to the right place in the docs?

From the linked page:

You can change color-profiles, select monitor-inputs, reset monitor, power off/on monitor, dim monitor, set monitor-speaker-volume, set system-volume, rotate display and set saturation/vibrance. You can do this by user-interface or by command-arguments.

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I do see where it says select monitor-inputs but the screen shots do not show (for me) where those options are. There does not seem to be a hep or wiki that explains things, perhaps it is just too esoteric for me 😕

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Just because you don't know where you are going doesn't mean any road will get you there.

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wavy wrote:

I do see where it says select monitor-inputs but the screen shots do not show (for me) where those options are. There does not seem to be a hep or wiki that explains things, perhaps it is just too esoteric for me 😕

The documentation is certainly clumsy.

I don’t use the program, but to swap inputs on a given monitor, I’d define a function key sequence using the poorly-documented “s” command line option. For example, set ALT-F8 to send the command line “s HDMI” to select the HDMI port.

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wavy

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Ok I see the option but I think this is just to poorly documented for me to get a grip on.
Thanks Anyway
Happy and prosperous New Year

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Just because you don't know where you are going doesn't mean any road will get you there.

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To Kathy Stevens,

Thank you for your opinion, but I have had major problems with every HP product I’ve ever bought, including printers, and I swore I would never buy anything of theirs again. I was so frustrated, I was considering switching to a MAC!

Next, I was specific when I said I primarily use Outlook and Word. Not only does it violate the MS terms of license to use a student version of Office if not a student; it has never included Outlook…making it useless for me as well as illegal. The stand-alone version of Outlook was well over $100 years ago. Thanks anyway. BTSAZ1989.

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I have been using and owned personal computers since the early-1980’s including: an Epson Equity PC clone with two 5 ¼ inch floppy drives, Lenovo ThinkPads, Toshiba notebooks, as well as Compaq, Lenovo, Sony, and HP workstations. At the present time we are working with a HP EliteDesk 800 G2 (P4K19UT#ABA) and a HP Envy Desktop – 795-0050 (3LA27AA#ABA). Except for one Lenovo workstation, they have all been solid machines and we have two XT or former Windows 7 machines quietly retired on a shelf in the office.  They all still work and two 8-year-old Windows 7 machines have recently updated to Windows 10

Over the last 30 years we have had a problem with only one machine a Lenovo E20 workstation. The E20 was new when it experienced a problem and Lenovo sent out a tech who replaced the motherboard for free.

I have no idea what you can afford to pay for a new PC so I recommended a mid-level machine suitable for Microsoft Office and similar software.  The suggested machine is not suitable for TurboCAD, MATLAB, or advance gaming.

I suggest that you look at Consumer Reports computer reviews and take their guidance re machine reliability and the unit most suitable for your needs.

You are incorrect that MS terms of license to use the Microsoft Office Home and Student 2019 version of Office is a violate of MS terms of license to use if you are not a student. It would be a violation of the Home and Student license if it were being used for business activities.

However, I stand corrected – you should purchase Microsoft Office Home and Business 2019 since the home and student version does not contain Outlook. You may be eligible for an upgrade licenses if you own an earlier version of Office.

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If you have the boxed version of Office 2010, you can almost always uninstall it from your old computer and legally install it on your new.  Read your license, it might even allow it to be on both.  Security patches will end – Office 2010 will reach its end of support on October 13, 2020.  Even if you don’t have the boxed version, there may be a way to buy media for a few dollars from Microsoft and legally re-use the key, as long as you uninstall from the old.  Contact Microsoft, and if you don’t get the answer you like, try again later – not all of their techs are perfect.

A key card for Office Home and Business 2019 costs around $250 and includes Outlook, Word plus more.  I do not know the details of the license, and I would never buy a product without media.  I cannot tell how to get the media, I do not see boxed versions of 2019 for sale.  Contact Microsoft or your preferred retailer such as Dell, CDW or Newegg for more details.

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Apparently, when you purchase newer versions of Office, the way it works now is that you download the software. We just did this last week with Office 2019: the software suite arrives as a .IMG file, which you can then burn to a DVD if you wish (and not a CD, as it’s 3.4GB in size!).

 

Keep Running Windows 7 Safely for Years to Come  
Make Windows 10 look and work like Windows 7

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Go to heidoc.net and download and install the Microsoft Windows and Office ISO Download Tool. You can then use the tool to download and install Office 2010. But before inputting your activation key, you’ll probably need to uninstall Office from the other computer.

Group "L" (Linux Mint)
with Windows 10 running in a remote session on my file server

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Just touching base.

1. I just looked at Consumer Report’s website and both Dell and HP desktops are given the same ratings for predicted reliability and ownership satisfaction – “Good”.  Only Apple machines have better ratings – “Excellent”.
2. Double check to make sure that your existing monitor will work with the new machine before making the purchase.
3. Once you make a decision and take delivery of the new PC the next step will be to set it up.
   1. Get Windows up and running – the Ask Woody site has good setup suggestions.
   2. Decide if you want a new version of Office or continue with Office 2010
      1. If you are going to keep Office 2010 you should look into using Laplink’s PCMover to transfer your programs and data files from the old to new machine. Or, if you have the original disks simply do a new install of Office 2010 on the new machine.
      2. Amazon has various vintages of Office available.
      3. If you obtain a newer copy of Office you can do a clean install and then copy your data files to an external drive or USB storage and copy them onto the new machine.  Then you can export your current Outlook profile(s) as PST file(s) to the external storage and then import them to the new version of Outlook.
      4. And, FireFox, DuckDuckGo, and Ccleaner are free downloads.

Good luck.

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I always recommend a SSD drive for booting and a HDD for data you might be able to get that as an addon for a Dell, don’t know could not find a way to add it on the linked page from Jim. I would never look to Consumer Reports for computer reviews( or much else these days). If your Office version is not transferable you might consider LibreOffice a free open source suite. If you use macros a lot it might be problematical. (I use Office 97 on XP in a Virtual Machine and LibeOffice on my main computer)

Enough yammer, the main point I want to make is the higher resolution monitors these days can be a problem for folk that want a larger more readable display. The higher the resolution the smaller the font it wants to display in ‘native’ mode. My old 27″ just died and I now have a spanking new 3840×2160 running at 1920×1080, fonts seem ok set to 175% in windows with some 3rd party tweaks. However some things will just not work correctly with my setting, for example the print controls for PDF-Exchange Viewer always leave important controls off screen and unavailable. The sad thing is more on the screen seems to be what manufacturers quest for rather than more readable, that of course and keeping the gamers satisfied.

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Just because you don't know where you are going doesn't mean any road will get you there.

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wavy wrote:

However some things will just not work correctly with my setting, for example the print controls for PDF-Exchange Viewer always leave important controls off screen and unavailable.

A lot of programs get messed up if the fonts and scaling are not at the default settings.  It seems that developers just don’t bother writing in any support for this; it’s quite possible to do, since many programs DO work okay with it, but it’s easier not to.

Dell XPS 13/9310, i5-1135G7/16GB, KDE Neon 6.2
XPG Xenia 15, i7-9750H/32GB & GTX1660ti, Kubuntu 24.04
Acer Swift Go 14, i5-1335U/16GB, Kubuntu 24.04 (and Win 11)

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wavy wrote:

I always recommend a SSD drive for booting and a HDD for data you might be able to get that as an addon for a Dell, don’t know could not find a way to add it on the linked page from Jim.

When you go to Dell.com and look at the Business Desktops, there will be several configurations listed for each computer. One or more of them will have an SSD as the internal drive; and one or more of them will have a mechanical drive as the internal drive.

Hopefully you can find one configuration which has an NvME SSD as the internal drive, because from what I have read, those are the fastest SSDs.

Group "L" (Linux Mint)
with Windows 10 running in a remote session on my file server

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DrBonzo post #2022690
“There is quite a bit of computer help available for senior citizens and those with disabilities. Much of it is free and some of it is in-home, the latter of which can sometimes be very useful and efficient. Do a search for “computer help for senior citizens” or something similar. You can even include “in my area” or “in mytown”.”
— That is excellent advice.

BTSAZ1989, I am a senior citizen who volunteers at our local Senior Citizens Center on the third Tuesday of the month and set up appointments on other days of the month for those who can use some hands-on training and/or fix some of their issues.
— I am not an expert by any means as I am just an average user but I know how to keep my computers secure and well maintained.
Although that is not the norm at Senior Citizens Centers, call yours and ask if they might have someone who’d be willing to cover what you need to know about your computer.
— I’ve also helped some disabled people more so by contacting a non-profit organization that will do that also.

I also noticed in your post #2036523 “No one with any sense would still be using IE”
— I’ve been in many situations when I’ve seen “No one with any sense would still (???)”
— Fortunately because I do hands-on training I can see what’s going on I can handle that but when I can’t see the computer and someone’s talking to me about their situation on the phone or a casual get-together for other activities I remember my roots because at one time I was one of them who “No one with any sense would still (???)”.
— I see you have been thankful for many posts and I’m glad to see that.

On your Office 2010 Pro Plus, find out what the 25 character product key is.
If you acquired it through Microsoft, especially if using a Microsoft account, or even you might not have the original CD for it, save this link in case it could come in handy for you. You never know but it might save you the cost of a modern version at least for a while, maybe even for a long time.
Download Earlier Versions of Office
https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-download/office

HP EliteBook 8540w laptop Windows 10 Pro (x64)

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To MrJimPhelps:

My voice is shot, so I tried a chat with Dell Business Sales. The 1st was a total waste of time; the next day, I asked for an American agent and fared somewhat better. I asked if I could get a small SSD drive on which they would install the O/S plus the 4GB HDD for data, and if my Office 2010 Pro Plus could get me a boxed copy of a newer version. He came up with a price of $1100+ before tax! I said I was looking to spend more like $7 to 800… His version had an I5 processor, so I asked what about lowering some of the specs, but he came back with a price closer to $1100 including tax saying that was the best he could do… I really want the O/S on a separate drive, even if it’s not SSD! He’s back tomorrow. what do you suggest? Their sale ends on 1/6 and prices will go back up. Thank you very much for your help.

BTSAZ

Moderator Note: Attachment edited as it contained personal data.

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If you must have a Dell, consider one of their home desktops instead of their business line. For example:  https://www.dell.com/en-us/shop/dell-desktop-computers/inspiron-desktop/spd/inspiron-3671-desktop/nd3671dszps

That’ll get you the latest i5, 8GB RAM, a 256GB SSD boot drive, 1TB data drive, and Intel graphics. Add $60 for Windows 10 Pro and toss in the $50 off coupon code (50OFF499) and you’ll be in for $639.99 plus tax, shipping included.

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@btsaz1989:

I suggest this one:

https://www.dell.com/en-us/work/shop/desktops-all-in-one-pcs/optiplex-3070-small-form-factor/spd/optiplex-3070-desktop/s018o3070sffus

$729, and it has a 128 GB NvME internal drive, a real screamer of a drive. All you need to do is add an additional internal drive (a 2 TB or bigger mechanical drive or SSD for your data – mechanical will be cheaper). With the power off, you simply remove the cover, install the drive, and plug in two cables — data and power. Put the cover back on and power on the computer, and you now have the best of all situations – a super fast drive for the OS, and a huge drive for your data. If you don’t feel comfortable adding a 2nd hard drive, any computer store could do it for you for just a few dollars over the price of the drive.

A big advantage to keeping your data on a separate drive is, if you ever have to do a clean reinstall of Windows, it won’t overwrite your data, because your data will be on a separate drive.

Good luck!

Jim

Group "L" (Linux Mint)
with Windows 10 running in a remote session on my file server

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cmptrgy

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Wait for comments from others here to confirm what I am saying, but, I believe the phone rep is trying to upsell you / rip you off.

What you want to buy is the “deal of the day” computer recommended.  Pick the option for a small SSD boot drive as the only drive installed, and no office included.  The price should stay about the same.  Cheap, cheap cheap- because you are going to add the expensive parts (office and a big hard drive) yourself.  Buy an external 4TB drive if you need it or whatever size you want from Newegg or Amazon (I guess you have every movie ever made you need to watch?)  And, don’t buy Office at all.  You can use the link above to download it for free, and use your old key from your old computer.  Note – this is legal, as long as after it works on the new one you remove office uninstall it from your old computer.  Run a program called Belarc Advisor (or any other, but make sure it comes from a reputable website like Majorgeeks) to find your key.

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I know you do not like HP but you may want to consider the following. Or at least visit their site.

A HP ENVY Desktop – TE01-0150xt

Windows Home

Intel core I5 processor

8 GB Memory

Storage 1      256 Solid state drive

Storage 2      1 TBHdd

Integrated graphics

DVD – Writer

For $603.99 Delivered.

Base unit at https://store.hp.com/us/en/ConfigureView?langId=-1&storeId=10151&catalogId=10051&catEntryId=3074457345619381818&urlLangId=&quantity=1&jumpid=ma_red-tag-sale_product-tile_desktops_1_7bb48av-1_hp-envy-desktop—te

Then configure as you want it

HP always has a sale in progress so do not worry about a unit going off sale.  I expect Dell is the same.

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BTSAZ1989

Have you decided what you are going to do?

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Thanks to all for your suggestions and guidance. I’ve been ill, so it’s taken me time to buy a PC. The one suggested by MrJimBeatty was not available to the price/configuration he suggested.

Thanks to ‘jabeattyauditor’ for my ultimate purchase just made a few minutes ago. I’d gone on chat yesterday without success. He just would not come down the $30 difference in price, but said he’d get with his mgr. and email the final price, which he did not do! Dell is about the only company whose computers I have not had, and a friend used to buy them often, so I thought I’d give it one more try. This time was a success…, so thank you!

Now I must learn how to transfer all of my important files from multiple backups, and see if programs I purchased will work on Win 10 64-bit when they were 32-bit and are no longer made.

I’ll be back to ‘ask woody’ when I run into problems:-), which is inevitable.

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One more thing please: with all the fear about the Win 10 varieties, I will need help before updating what I believe will need updating in Win 10! To which forum should go I seek help?

Thank you.

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Under whichever version of Win10 you get in the Windows Forum (probably 1903 or 1909)

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Looks as if you are getting a good machine. Congratulations.

Some thoughts:

1. If the new machine shipps with Windows 10 Home or Professional there is no need to worry at startup.
2. Once the PC is up and running click on the looking glass or find the white bar on the lower left corner of the screen next to the Microsoft logo and type About and then start the about your machine app. From there you can see what version of Windows 10 you are using.
3. We are running Windows 10 Professional 1903 without problems. If your PC is delivered with 1909 you may want to consider rolling it back to 1903. An internet search will give you instructions on how to do a rollback.
4. I assume that the programs you “purchased” are on your old computer and you want to move them to the new machine. If you do not have the old disks, consider purchasing Laplink Software PCmover Ultimate with High Speed Cable. It can be used to move your programs and files from the old machine to the new one. It is available from Dell.
5. If you do not purchase Laplink, I suggest that you purchase a Western Digital external drive. Copy your data files from the old machine onto the external drive and then upload them to the new machine. The advantage of the Western Digital drive is that you can download and install Acronis free from the Western Digital site and use Acronis to back up your system once your data files have been moved to the new machine.
6. If your internet service provider is Comcast/Xfinity you can download and install Norton virus protection for free. Just do an internet search for Xfinity Norton download.
7. If you are using Outlook on your old machine you can “export” your calendar and address book to the external drive as a PST file and then import them into your new Outlook.

Good luck

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MrJimPhelps wrote:

@btsaz1989:

I suggest this one:

https://www.dell.com/en-us/work/shop/desktops-all-in-one-pcs/optiplex-3070-small-form-factor/spd/optiplex-3070-desktop/s018o3070sffus

$729, and it has a 128 GB NvME internal drive, a real screamer of a drive. All you need to do is add an additional internal drive (a 2 TB or bigger mechanical drive or SSD for your data – mechanical will be cheaper). With the power off, you simply remove the cover, install the drive, and plug in two cables — data and power. Put the cover back on and power on the computer, and you now have the best of all situations – a super fast drive for the OS, and a huge drive for your data. If you don’t feel comfortable adding a 2nd hard drive, any computer store could do it for you for just a few dollars over the price of the drive.

A big advantage to keeping your data on a separate drive is, if you ever have to do a clean reinstall of Windows, it won’t overwrite your data, because your data will be on a separate drive.

Good luck!

Jim

I gave in and bought this new computer.  HP – ENVY Desktop – Intel Core i5 – 12GB Memory – 512GB Solid State Drive Model:TE01-0014.  I am not a business.  I will probably never use 512GB of memory so I did not get a computer with an HDD as well.  I have not set up my new computer.  I am waiting for the new monitor to come in and I am giving my brain a rest.  It was hard for me to figure out what would be best computer to get.

Now I fear I made a mistake.  Are you saying that in Windows 10 if a roll back is necessary it will wipe out my data?  In Windows XP and Windows 7 it was possible to return to factory condition without losing any personal files or folders.  I only ever had to do it once with a Windows XP computer.  I had the Windows 7 computer for over 7 years and never had to reset to factory condition.

This website talks a lot about “clean installs and reinstalls”.  My Windows 10 came already on the computer.  I think what used to be called “restore to factory condition” is now called “roll back” in Windows 10.

Just want to know if I can use “system restore” and “roll back” on my new computer or if either or both of those actions will wipe out all my personal files because I only have the SSD and no HDD.

HP Pavilion Desktop TP01-0050 – 64 bit
Windows 10 Home Version 22H2
OS build 19045.5608
Windows Defender and Windows Firewall
Microsoft Office Home and Business 2019
-Version 2502(Build 18526.20168 C2R)

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With one drive and one large partition, system restore and reset my PC will still work.  But a clean install, removing all data during or before the install process, would not be possible without data loss.  If you keep backups of everything, then you could clean install and then get your data from the backup.

Some viruses are severe enough that a clean install is the way to fix them, and some people believe that clean installs (even of some of the semi-annual Windows 10 editions) reduce bugs or improve performance.  But a typical user will not need this.  If you have gone years without a Windows 7 factory recovery, you will probably go years without needing a clean install.  If you backup your data, you are ok.

There are users who test multiple or preview builds of Windows, or dual or triple boot any operating systems, who would benefit.

Since you bought a desktop, adding a second drive if you wanted to is usually easy, a few screws.

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mpw

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mpw

Rest assured, you did not make a mistake buying the HP TE01-0014.

The Woody sites are designed to nitpick the Windows operating systems. Most of the flaws that are discussed on the site 1.) will not affect your use your machine and 2.) if they do, they will be corrected over the near term. That said, watch the Woody site for instructions on how to delay Windows 10 updates. Better safe than sorry.

We have been using Windows 10 on HP computers for years without incident. In addition, HP computers come with HP Support Assistant installed that will help you maintain your system. The assistant also notifies you when there are updates for your PC.

We have used Windows 10 “system restore” on numerous occasions and all as gone well. However, you may want to increase the amount of disk space allocated to system restore points so that you can have more options for recovering your system.

In addition, make sure you create the HP recovery discs/USB drive for your machine and keep them in a safe place. When you use the recovery media you will ask you if you want to repair or reinstall Windows 10. The repair feature should be enough if you have a disaster.

I agree with anonymous that viruses pose a significant threat in today’s computer world. In our case, we have a second hard drive on each of our machines and use Acronis to back up the entire C Drive of each computer at 5:30 PM every day and we do a weekly backup to external hard drives on Friday afternoons. Periodic backups to an external drive should be sufficient for your use.

Installing a second drive on your new Envy machine may take some doing. On our case, in addition to having to remove the side cover, we had to open the front panel in order to slide the second drive into the bay. Last time I installed a drive HP did not provide instructions for opening the front panel of our Envy desktop. The connections of the front panel are delicate. I had to fiddle around to figure out how to snap the panel open. In addition, I learned by accident that I had to remove the CD/DVD burner cover prior to opening the front panel. All this is to say be careful if you try to open the machine. Remember, if you damage the machine you void its warranty!

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mpw

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Kathy Stevens wrote:

mpw Rest assured, you did not make a mistake buying the HP TE01-0014.

Anonymous and Kathy Stevens,

Well it turns out that after the many hours spent by me and Windows 10 techs and HP techs to try and install a printer on my new HP Envy computer it was broke the day I got it.  Something called a WHEA logger was recording hundreds of Warnings every hour and completely flooding the Event Viewer.  It had something to do with wifi or Bluetooth and HP advised I take it back.  Best Buy agreed and I am now waiting to pick up a new HP – Pavilion Desktop TP01-0050.  It has two drives: 1TB HDD + 256GB SSD.  This presents a new problem; I have never had two drives before.

I have read how to change the default storage location on Windows 10 from the SSD drive to the HDD drive using settings.   https://www.ghacks.net/2019/10/14/how-to-change-the-default-save-location-in-windows-10/  I have read it is best to leave Apps where they are.  And I think Programs are supposed to stay on the SSD also but I’m not sure.  I think just data is supposed to be in HDD storage.

I also want to create a “recovery USB drive” but one web site said I needed at least 8GB and one says at least 32 GB so I think I must be reading about two different things. https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/insider/forum/insider_wintp-insider_repair/use-recovery-media-creator-to-create-a-usb/7c472be1-9bf5-48dc-972f-e254f460f1f4

There is also something about only being able to create a recovery disc/usb drive one time.  I am very confused as to how to get off to the right start when the new computer gets here.

You were very reassuring in your replies so I thought I would ask you for help.

HP Pavilion Desktop TP01-0050 – 64 bit
Windows 10 Home Version 22H2
OS build 19045.5608
Windows Defender and Windows Firewall
Microsoft Office Home and Business 2019
-Version 2502(Build 18526.20168 C2R)

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Microsoft says 16GB is needed for a USB Recovery Drive:

Create a recovery drive

(That’s also what the recovery drive creator tells me on its second page.)

It’s not true that you can only do it once.

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mpw

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There is confusion in terminology here:

The Recovery (Rescue) disk/USB is bootable media that gives you access to Utilities, like the Command Prompt, Restore points, troubleshooting. It can be made as many times as desired.

The Restore disk is a copy of the Factory Image. It is bootable media that allows restoration to the day-one Factory condition/load-set. It replaces the set of disks that used to come with a new PC. In most cases it can be made only once.

2 users thanked author for this post.

mpw, cmptrgy

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I am a vision impaired (legally blind) user of Windows 10 and find it quite accessible. I personally use ZoomText for screen Magnufication which removes the need for huge monitors. However it is quite expensive.  There are other commercial screen magnifier/reader programs most if not all come in trial versions.
Windows 10 has an excellent screen magnification tool called ‘Magnifier’.  The Windows 7 version is still good but not as good as Windows 10.

There is free software available to make Windows 10 look more like Windows 7.

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Can Windows Magnifier replace ZoomText or is it still not good enough?

If you have more insights for us, maybe you could start a new thread in the Tech Accessibility section.

cheers, Paul

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$625 seems incredibly high. Is the s/w worth the price compared to the free products?

🍻

Just because you don't know where you are going doesn't mean any road will get you there.

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mpw wrote:

It has two drives: 1TB HDD + 256GB SSD.  This presents a new problem; I have never had two drives before.

You install your OS on the SSD (256GB is more then enough) and use the HDD for data (photos, documents, video, music…) and backups (image, files..). So, in case of an OS crash your data is safe.
It is advisable to create/save image backup on an external SSD/HDD drive as well.

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mpw

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PKCano wrote:

There is confusion in terminology here:

The Recovery (Rescue) disk/USB is bootable media that gives you access to Utilities, like the Command Prompt, Restore points, troubleshooting. It can be made as many times as desired.

The Restore disk is a copy of the Factory Image. It is bootable media that allows restoration to the day-one Factory condition/load-set. It replaces the set of disks that used to come with a new PC. In most cases it can be made only once.

Do I need a Restore disk?  Or is a Recovery (Rescue) disk/USB enough?

When I signed in last time to the Microsoft Store to look for Office 2019, Microsoft took my local account on my computer away and made it a Microsoft Account.  It also took info about the computer.  If Microsoft lists my computer under devices, does it have my product key even though I bought the computer with Windows 10 preinstalled?

I am about to pick up my replacement computer from Best Buy and I want to start out on the right foot.  (I have removed the one I had to take back from my Microsoft Account.)  So I have no devices listed now.

I don’t know whether to start with a Microsoft Account or a Local Account?  If I start again with a local account will Microsoft change it every time I go to the store and then I have to change it back?

 

HP Pavilion Desktop TP01-0050 – 64 bit
Windows 10 Home Version 22H2
OS build 19045.5608
Windows Defender and Windows Firewall
Microsoft Office Home and Business 2019
-Version 2502(Build 18526.20168 C2R)

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