Reviewing your licensing options

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ISSUE 22.13 • 2025-03-31 TAME YOUR TECH By Susan Bradley Can you get a license for that? With the upcoming end of life of Windows 10, I’m often asked
[See the full post at: Reviewing your licensing options]

Susan Bradley Patch Lady/Prudent patcher

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ibe98765, Great Lake Bunyip, fisher75, lmacri, CR2, TechTango, Bill C., John Barbee, dutchjim, Ulti P. Uszer, DLivesInTexas

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I constantly see advertisements about cheap versions of Office.

As mentioned a couple of times before, it depends on the country you live. In the US, you cannot sell used licenses. But it’s different in Europe.

Business Software Alliance

Autodesk was also an aggressive BSA user. We used to receive a letter each year from the BSA, demanding a license overview of Autodesk products. I haven’t received their letter anymore since the GDP is in effect.

These days, we rarely hear such stories. Have we all become legitimate?

I wonder about this too. It seems license-compliance is no longer enforced and I wonder why….

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Peter Chapa, Pim

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I once got into an argument with someone on Facebook over this. They were claiming that they could pick up LTSC for $5. I replied to say that the licence was not legal and that these websites that sell cheap keys are all stolen or redistributed VL and MSDN keys. His response was “you work for an MSP, you should know better”. Umm… yeah I do know better, I know more about how Microsoft licensing works!

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SteveTree

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LTSC seems like exactly what I want. I spend too much time disabling “features” I don’t want from my retail Win 10 Pro version. I just want an OS that lets me on the internet with reasonable security. I don’t want AI, a Microsoft account, or anything “Edge.”

But I can’t buy an LTSC license because I am not a corporation? This seems like a great marketing opportunity for some entrepreneur. What is a “corporation?” Some entity could incorporate, and buy a large number of the licenses. A person who wants one buys a membership in the corporation and gets one of the licenses. The “corporation” only exists to distribute licenses to people who are otherwise only retail customer.

What would Microsoft think of that?

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ibe98765, Peter Chapa

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Chris wrote:

LTSC seems like exactly what I want. I spend too much time disabling “features” I don’t want from my retail Win 10 Pro version.

LTSC is the only worthy version of Windows that’s left. And if Microsoft cared about users usability & productivity LTSC would be the real Windows Pro version, because it is like traditional Windows versions as it is made for the user and not made to use the user.

Been disabling secure boot and other tomfoolery for over 10 years now.
I run IoT 11 in MBR.

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windbg, Peter Chapa

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I couldn’t have said it better myself.

For those who remember Windows 7 Pro sp2, I liken the current Windows LTSC to that version of Windows 7, but Windows LTSC is better in every way.

There are many, completely safe, both legitimate and illegitimate ways to get Windows 10 (or 11) LTSC.

I prefer Windows 10 LTSC for most computers. I only use Windows 11 LTSC for computers that rely on Intel’s efficient cores (e-cores). Some laptops have -only- e-cores. With the latest Win10 updates, I wonder if the e-core benefit of Win11 still exists. When considering AMD cpu computers (all p-cores, for now), this is a non-issue, they all get Windows 10 LTSC.

I do have to manage some business computers, which are locked into a contract of Windows Pro or Enterprise. These nodes cause a lot of grief compared to Windows LTSC.

 

Windows 10 LTSC + Excel 2024 + Synology Docs + Firefox w/ Ublock Origin

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It’s not just that you’re not a corporate buyer, but you’re likely not a volume buyer.

I haven’t done a lot with Microsoft purchasing, but I have purchased licenses for Office that way.  It’s definitely less expensive to be buying licenses in bulk, and the more you get, the more discounts that you get.  But in my experience, you have to keep buying new licenses each year, and if you go more than 2 years without any purchases (or enough purchases) then to qualify for any more licenses, you have to buy another batch of licenses, all at once.  And you have to go through a qualified Microsoft dealer.

My experience is definitely at the low end, where I’m also working through non-profit discounting.  I’ve never seen stuff on a larger scale with Enterprise licenses or for Windows (whether desktops or servers).  However, I think it’s likely that Microsoft isn’t offering LTSC to any customers that aren’t already purchasing server licenses, and in bulk.

Susan’s original article does make it clear that one of the conditions of LTSC is “volume licensing”. And even if the product delivered is what you may want from a minimalist offering, I’m guessing it’s still a server version of Windows.

For an individual user, even after paying how many digits to the left of the decimal point, an LTSC install is not going to be a legal license, even if Microsoft doesn’t enforce it.

But remember, even if you’re providing the computer to run it on, the copy of Windows you have (any version) does not belong to you.  It’s licensed to you by Microsoft, and you clicked on “Agree” when you accepted the EULA terms when you deployed Windows.  Part of those terms allow Microsoft to dictate how you are allowed to use their software, and they have right to restrict LTSC installs to corporate customers whose terms do allow them to run LTSC.

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https://www.investopedia.com/terms/s/shellcorporation.asp

It wouldn’t be legit.

Susan Bradley Patch Lady/Prudent patcher

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Ulti P. Uszer

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Check this post, these are people that uses W11 and/or Win10 LTSC.

It’s in french, just translate it.

Après avoir testé Windows 11 LTSC, je suis revenu directement à Windows 10 LTSC. : r/WindowsLTSC

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John Barbee

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People use it.  It doesn’t make it a legitimate use of it.

Susan Bradley Patch Lady/Prudent patcher

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Ulti P. Uszer

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I see inexpensive ($45-55) offers for lifetime versions of older versions (2019, 2021) of Office from Stack Social. Are those legit?

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Even better is the current Groupon promo for 2019 Office Pro Plus at $11:

https://www.groupon.com/deals/campaign-0-718195355

To give one anecdotal (which means meaningless) experience, I bought Office 2016 ProPlus from a StackSocial deal (essentially the same as Groupon) when I was in school and eating a lot of peanut butter on rice cakes, and it still works today when I install it after a fresh installation of Windows LTSC.

 

Windows 10 LTSC + Excel 2024 + Synology Docs + Firefox w/ Ublock Origin

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Peter Chapa

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Hello. I don’t want to go to Win 11. What will happen if I don’t do anything? Are there any alternatives that would all me to stay on Win 10? Thank you.

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There will be a 1-year  Extended Service Update (ESU) that you can buy from Microsoft that will continue updates. The information has not been put out completely yet, but Susan will publish the information when it is available.

The other option is installing an 0Patch Subsctiption and installing their software. The information is on their website.

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O.k., thank you PK Cano

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In answer to your question “what will happen if I don’t do anything?”, the answer is: nothing.

Your device will continue to work and Windows Security will continue to receive definition updates. You will simply no longer receive monthly Security Updates for the Operating System.

You can be absolutely sure, however, that you will receive constant nag screens and messages from MS to upgrade and/or buy a new PC, claiming that ‘the end of the world is nigh’ if you don’t do so. Well, they would, wouldn’t they…

It is up to you to decide if you wish to run the OS without Security Updates after October; personally, it doesn’t bother me one bit.

The ever-excellent Christopher Barnatt has a very well-presented video on the options for W10 users at his ‘Explaining Computers’ YouTube channel:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hlBeV0IIoU

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To bad the LTSC editions are not available for everyone. It would save me loads of time from going through the registry and other modiying proigrams to disconect all of the crap and useless programs and changes that Microsoft keeps burding us with.
John

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Peter Chapa

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I agree. See my post on this thread for a link to a legit demo version of LTSC.

 

Windows 10 LTSC + Excel 2024 + Synology Docs + Firefox w/ Ublock Origin

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Another scenario, if I may… Recently I purchased a new Windows 11 system and I wanted to transfer applications from my old Windows 10 system. Generally this worked “ok” except for Adobe Acrobat which, understandably, wanted me to deregister Acrobat on the Win10 system before using it on the Win11 system. However, given the age of Acrobat (XI, I think) I couldn’t reactivate it according to an Adobe policy/rule. Note that I was expecting to have the same version of Acrobat, which I like and had become very custom to using. My solution was to purchase an inexpensive (non Adobe) Acrobat key to install a very slightly newer version. The only reason I did this was because Adobe didn’t permit the re-registration of a legitimate copy when its rules suggested this was possible. My workaround keeps me mostly happy while solving a problem created by Adobe.

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“Be aware of the Intune/Autopilot problem”

I had a similar issue when I bought five refurb iPads from a reseller late last year. Turns out four of them were still registered to the original owner in Apple Business Manager so I could not enroll them in my own MDM.

Ultimately the reseller had to take them back, because it wasn’t sure what org had registered them, and Apple (understandably) would not disclose it to us.

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Bah Humbug..

The last time I commented on Windows LTSC, I asked Susan “what about installing the demo version of LTSC and never activating it, is that legal?”

There was no reply to that query.

So I’ll ask again, for the entire AskWoody community –> Susan, or Max, Is it legal to install and use a demo version of LTSC beyond it’s expiration date? Even if you are not a LTSC license owner?

I appreciate the AskWoody community for so many things, I’ve been here since I was in school. But the rigid positions I encounter are sometimes difficult to reconcile, as sometimes they seem quite removed from the real world out there in computerland.

C’mon, a question for you experienced Windows users.. do you really use anything other than LTSC for personal use? Do you just not want to admit it on this forum? LTSC is so completely superior to any other version that I can’t imagine people deciding to invest precious hours of their lives on the consumer (Home or Pro) versions. I understand using the standard Pro or Enterprise versions for business use, as there are audits and other compliance issues.

If you are using the Home or Pro versions of Windows OS for your own personal computers, you are wasting your time on nonsense. You could be spending time with friends/family, reading Dostoevsky, walking in your local forest while contemplating life.. but instead you are dealing with wondering what MS patch is safe? Or forced, non-consensual installations of “feature updates” – really, you want to do this? You want to spend your time this way?

So, once again, here is a legitimate MS link for LTSC demo version:

https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/evalcenter/evaluate-windows-11-iot-enterprise-ltsc

Try it out, then decide.

Although I tried to delete my account at AskWoody.com a couple of months ago, apparently that is not an option, as it is at Reddit or the many other forums out there. Perhaps this is a good thing, as it required me to have a cooling-off period and I do value my many years reading AskWoody, Windows Secrets, whatever the branding/ownership has been over the years.

Is there a way to block certain users? For instance I have no interest in seeing replies from “Alex5723” or “Nibbled To Death By Ducks” (though I do like that username), nor “Microfix” .. these just don’t seem to be nice people, at least in their online personas.

Btw, somehow I didn’t see the newsletter about Woody until I just did a search for the misanthropes noted above; this news saddens me. I hope his family knows how much he meant to this community. I also hope he shuffled off this mortal coil in a peaceful manner, devoid of physical pain.

 

 

Windows 10 LTSC + Excel 2024 + Synology Docs + Firefox w/ Ublock Origin

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No, it is generally not legal to continue using a demo or evaluation version of LTSC (Long-Term Servicing Channel) software beyond its expiration date, as these versions are intended for temporary evaluation purposes and require a valid license for continued use.

HP Compaq 6000 Pro SFF PC / Windows 10 Pro / 22H2
Intel®Core™2 “Wolfdale” E8400 3.0 GHz / 8.00 GB
HP ProDesk 400 G5 SFF PC / Windows 11 Pro / 23H2
Intel®Core™ “Coffee Lake” i3-8100 3.6 GHz / 16.00 GB

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Awesome! A bold typography reply. Thank you.

Most importantly, can you provide links to sources for your opinion on this matter?

 

Windows 10 LTSC + Excel 2024 + Synology Docs + Firefox w/ Ublock Origin

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From Google (you will get the supporting links there):

♦ AI Overview
No, it is not legal to continue using a demo version of LTSC (Long-Term Servicing Channel) software beyond its expiration date, as it is intended for evaluation purposes only and requires a valid license for continued use.
Here’s a more detailed explanation:
LTSC is a Volume License:
LTSC (Long-Term Servicing Channel) versions of Windows and Microsoft Office are designed for organizations and require volume licenses, not individual retail licenses.
Evaluation Versions:
Microsoft provides evaluation versions of LTSC for IT professionals to test and evaluate the software.
Limited Trial Period:
These evaluation versions come with a limited trial period, typically 90 days, after which the software will stop functioning without a valid license.
Not for Long-Term Use:
You cannot use an evaluation version of LTSC for long-term use, as it is designed for testing and evaluation purposes only.
Requires Activation:
To continue using LTSC beyond the trial period, you need to purchase a valid license and activate the software.
Legal Consequences:
Using a demo or evaluation version of LTSC beyond its expiration date without a valid license is a violation of Microsoft’s licensing terms and could result in legal consequences.

Generative AI is experimental.

HP Compaq 6000 Pro SFF PC / Windows 10 Pro / 22H2
Intel®Core™2 “Wolfdale” E8400 3.0 GHz / 8.00 GB
HP ProDesk 400 G5 SFF PC / Windows 11 Pro / 23H2
Intel®Core™ “Coffee Lake” i3-8100 3.6 GHz / 16.00 GB

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@EyesOnWindows ..

Really?? an AI generated response? I guess this topic wasn’t worthy of your own human response?

You do know that AI hallucinates and gives all kinds of incorrect answers to queries, right?

I hope this is not the future of this forum (or any other forums) .. where everyone responds with an AI answer?

Windows 10 LTSC + Excel 2024 + Synology Docs + Firefox w/ Ublock Origin

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[EyesOnWindows]

Note that there are no current OS products with mainstream support beyond January 12, 2027 except Windows 11 IoT Enterprise LTSC 2024 which is October 24, 2029 which requires POPCNT support (as do all Windows 11 24H2 versions):

Microsoft Products reaching end of support on October 14, 2025:

• Windows 10 Enterprise & Education
• Windows 10 Home & Pro
• Windows 10 IoT Enterprise
• Windows 10 Enterprise LTSB 2015
• Windows 10 Team (Surface Hub)
• Office 2016 and 2019
• Exchange Server 2016 and 2019
• Skype for Business Server 2015 and 2019
• Visio 2016 and 2019
• Project 2016 and 2019
• Visual Studio 2015
• Visual Studio Team Foundation Server (now Azure Dev Ops)
• Windows 10 Team (Surface Hub)

Windows 11 Home and Pro end of support dates:

• Version 23H2 November 11, 2025
• Version 24H2 October 13, 2026

The Windows 10 Enterprise LTSC 2019 is the last version to receive a ten-year lifecycle, mainstream support ending January 9, 2024, extended support ending in January 9, 2029.

The Windows 10 Enterprise LTSC 2021 version has a 5-year lifecycle, mainstream support ending in January 12, 2027.

The Windows 10 IoT Enterprise LTSC 2021 has a 10-year lifecycle, mainstream support ending in January 12, 2027, extended support ending in January 13, 2032.

The Windows 11 IoT Enterprise LTSC 2024 has a 10-year lifecycle, mainstream support ending in October 24, 2029, extended support ending in October 10, 2034.

HP Compaq 6000 Pro SFF PC / Windows 10 Pro / 22H2
Intel®Core™2 “Wolfdale” E8400 3.0 GHz / 8.00 GB
HP ProDesk 400 G5 SFF PC / Windows 11 Pro / 23H2
Intel®Core™ “Coffee Lake” i3-8100 3.6 GHz / 16.00 GB

• This reply was modified 1 week ago by EyesOnWindows. Reason: Added dates for Windows 11 IoT Enterprise LTSC 2024

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windbg

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You said:

“The Windows 10 IoT Enterprise LTSC 2021 has a 10-year lifecycle, mainstream support ending in January 12, 2027, extended support ending in January 13, 2032.”

Yep, we are good until 2032 .. and a clean, efficient, modern version of Windows (as best it can be with the MS requirement for backwards compatibility)

So nearly every AskWoody subscriber could have a (mostly) trouble-free installation of a de-bloated, enterprise level of Windows, with only security updates (and no unnecessary, unneeded, potentially troublesome “feature” updates), until 2032 –> but for some reason, many here choose to struggle and sink hours into managing other Windows versions.

Windows 10 LTSC + Excel 2024 + Synology Docs + Firefox w/ Ublock Origin

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From the description of Windows 11 IoT Enterprise LTSC:

Windows 11 IoT Enterprise LTSC is intended for fixed-function, special-purpose devices that require a long support lifecycle of 10 years. These devices are typically found in industries including banking, quick-service restaurants, healthcare, hospitality, manufacturing, and retail.

Windows IoT Enterprise LTSC is based on the same foundation as Windows Professional and Windows Enterprise, delivering the same compatibility, security and management capabilities required for commercial deployments. Windows 11 IoT Enterprise LTSC provides additional capabilities to lockdown the device experience for public facing or employee facing scenarios along with the ability to customize the operating system footprint.

My personal observation:

My expectation is that you would only find registry and license file differences in LTSC versus Home and Pro if you looked closely and therefore you could apply only the the registry differences and not touch the license files of Home or Pro to achieve a legal result.

Using NTLite to edit a Windows installation image would be the easiest way to do this. Using the Microsoft Deployment Toolkit (MDT), you could do more or less everything that NTlite does but you have to make all the modifications manually.

HP Compaq 6000 Pro SFF PC / Windows 10 Pro / 22H2
Intel®Core™2 “Wolfdale” E8400 3.0 GHz / 8.00 GB
HP ProDesk 400 G5 SFF PC / Windows 11 Pro / 23H2
Intel®Core™ “Coffee Lake” i3-8100 3.6 GHz / 16.00 GB

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Cleotus Bartholomew

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Now that is a human response that contributes to this conversation! .. Sorry for my pithy comments earlier, but nothing is more annoying than someone posting what ChatGPT (or it’s ilk) said.

Wow, I haven’t used NTlite in years. I should look at it again. I thank you for this significant input.

I do remember an old MSDN post from 5 years ago or so (prior to MS changing MSDN) where I saw a schematic that showed LTSB’s path (the first version of LTSC) from the Enterprise version (and interestingly how similar the Education version is)

 

Windows 10 LTSC + Excel 2024 + Synology Docs + Firefox w/ Ublock Origin

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Cleotus Bartholomew wrote:

So I’ll ask again, for the entire AskWoody community –> Susan, or Max, Is it legal to install and use a demo version of LTSC beyond it’s expiration date? Even if you are not a LTSC license owner?

I don’t know about the legalities involved, but the final item under “Installation Gudelines” in the Prerequisites section of the IoT Enterprise LTSC page that you linked to, reads as follows:

If you fail to activate this evaluation after installation, or if your evaluation period expires, the desktop background will turn black, you will see a persistent desktop notification indicating that the system is not genuine, and the PC will shut down every hour.

I, for one, am not keen on having to reboot a PC every hour.

Keep Running Windows 7 Safely for Years to Come  
Make Windows 10 look and work like Windows 7

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EyesOnWindows

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In my experience, this does not happen.

Let’s get some other data points here from other AskWoody members. Does your PC shut down hourly if you don’t activate LTSC?

So much of this stuff comes down to personal experience, with a person’s particular hardware configuration, which is why we have AskWoody and Reddit, so we can see what really happens out there in the wild. So many commas in my response, I feel like Marcel Proust, but without the skills.

 

Windows 10 LTSC + Excel 2024 + Synology Docs + Firefox w/ Ublock Origin

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Cleotus Bartholomew wrote:

“what about installing the demo version of LTSC and never activating it, is that legal?”

The trial of LTSC will expire, just like all other MS trial software such as Server and Office. And when it expires you will be left with a non functioning PC.

Been disabling secure boot and other tomfoolery for over 10 years now.
I run IoT 11 in MBR.

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@ulti-p-uzer

This is not true. Full stop.

A “non functioning PC” .. really? —-> WHAT IS YOUR DATA / EVIDENCE FOR YOUR STATEMENT?

I have tons of experience with LTSB and LTSC .. I have never, ever, like, yeah, never-ever have I seen this end result that you have just posted to our quality forum here at AskWoody.

 

 

Windows 10 LTSC + Excel 2024 + Synology Docs + Firefox w/ Ublock Origin

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WSStephenB wrote:

which I like and had become very custom to using.

I totally agree, Acrobat XI is one of the last classic UI versions of Acrobat and I still also use it nearly every day. And I still, even after a decade plus, highly resent the software UI that started with Windohz! 8 and I have long hoped for the day when we see the demise of that despicable software appearance. I also continue to use Office 2010 for this same reason. Furthermore I have utter contempt for UWP.

Been disabling secure boot and other tomfoolery for over 10 years now.
I run IoT 11 in MBR.

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Glucose, WSStephenB, Cybertooth

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Ulti P. Uszer wrote:

Cleotus Bartholomew wrote:

“what about installing the demo version of LTSC and never activating it, is that legal?”

The trial of LTSC will expire, just like all other MS trial software such as Server and Office. And when it expires you will be left with a non functioning PC.

There are some web sites that claims that full LTSC iso, can be activated and continue

to work after 90 days. !!??

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Activated and working is not the same thing as legal. You may get lucky and find MS have better things to do than chase you up for a license.

cheers, Paul

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Cleotus Bartholomew, Ulti P. Uszer

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I agree with @paul-t on this one.

Naturally, there are many ways to get LTSC to work. Most of the time I tell ppl to just let the demo version expire and keep on using it. If your focus is on a working OS and not niceties of pleasant desktop images, etc – the expired LTSC works just fine. There are other quite easy ways to activate LTSC without a license. I don’t see a reason for these methods myself, as the expired demo version seems to work fine. If there is some update that has changed this, let me (us) know.

I fortunately have LTSC licenses and OneDrive licenses from work. But if I didn’t, I’d still use LTSC, it is far superior to all other Windows versions. Honestly, despite the significant downsides of MacOS, that’s probably where I’d be if the choice was Windows Home or Pro vs. MacOS. As much as I like Linux, and use it daily, esp with my MiniPCs, I don’t want it as my daily driver.

 

Windows 10 LTSC + Excel 2024 + Synology Docs + Firefox w/ Ublock Origin

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Doesn’t your expired LTSC evaluation version shutdown automatically after 1 hour?

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I have changed my motherboard several times over the years and have never had any problems with authentication.
Rebooting from the existing drive, authentication just asks for confirmation that I have made changes to my PC, instancing changing the MB. Confirm and I’m good till the next upgrade.

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Cybertooth

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