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As the weekend comes to a close, I’m baking Lemon Zucchini bread and looking over the results of the two surveys I did earlier. First off – yes I know
[See the full post at: Patch Lady – results of the Consultant patcher survey]
Susan Bradley Patch Lady/Prudent patcher
Impressive to see the number of responses you received, Susan 
Thank you Susan for this work. From the responses I have read, it seems very clear there is a disconnect between what a lot of customers (“consultants” in this case) want vs what is offered. If Satya Nadella used this as the tool to measure customer satisfaction instead of their own metrics that probably have bad side-effects like number of active installations on version x or how much Bing was used (hello, forced web searches), a lot of people would not get their bonus.
I don’t understand the problem with Microsoft. What people want is so simple and MS already have everything they need to make it happen. Strip the OS, make it easy to save and copy settings even for casual users, stop changing it and leave most things optional. Then, just keep costs down, indirectly charge for support in the form of a new license bundled with new PCs like before for OEM for home and SMBs, use subscription for big Enterprises but in all cases, provide what people want so there is no incentive to look elsewhere. Provide reliable, tested, security patches and let people do other things with their PC than focusing on their OS.
If WaaS was optional, they would get their free beta testers for those willing to, while a lot of happy people would run the polished LTS version for a few years until the next stable release.
I get that Nadella thinks he needs to do a revolution to reinvent the company, but I think they won’t succeed at that. I don’t believe they are better than the competition on this and they are ruining their competitive advantage in a traditional field that is I think still there to stay even if the market shrinks.
Just trying to view the responses to your survey online on onedrive gave me so many issues! I got many error messages about the server having issues, then responses were shown blank often and it took time for them to appear when they appeared at all. The interface doesn’t make it easy to read long responses in a cell. This online Excel in read only is not great. Trying to download the file for offline viewing wasn’t working at first. I guess the survey is popular and the load isn’t handled very well.
No need to apologize, but 7 isn’t coming back. 10 — or something like it is our current and our future. Note that I sent this survey out to folks on the patchmanagement.org list, and various consultant listserves that I’m a member of so it wasn’t just members of this venue who answered it.
Susan Bradley Patch Lady/Prudent patcher
10 — or something like it is our current and our future.
Only if you let it be.
MS has brought the full power of their monopoly to bear in order to force people to into the Windows 10 gulag, making it harder than ever to avoid. If you accept it and do as MS wants, you’re validating their methods and giving your stamp of approval, whether that is your actual intention or not. You wrote that “this isn’t working” in reference to the patching strategy and methodology, but to MS, it is working– they’ve got nearly 700 million devices in their thrall, and their stock prices and revenue are up. Those two statistics are the only definition of “working” they have. You say it’s not working, and the survey in question shows deep dissatisfaction, but if you’re one of the 700 million, you’ve voted that it is working in the only poll that MS cares about.
I’ve heard, of course, all of the arguments about why people must select Windows 10 on devices they control. I know that some don’t like Linux for one reason or another, or maybe it doesn’t do what they need or run the programs they require. I know why people don’t just keep or revert to an older Windows (8.1 still has some good years left) too. Maybe they have newer hardware that won’t work with any other Windows. I know there are good reasons why people who absolutely would not choose 10 if they felt they had any choice in the matter feel compelled to do so anyway.
None of that matters, though, to MS. They are trying to force everyone into 10 so they can be monetized, and if you capitulate and use 10, that’s a vote in favor of what MS is doing, period. If revenues from monetization roll in, that’s THE sign that things are working. Nothing else matters– not our dissatisfaction, not our increased costs, not the frustration… none of it.
I did not participate in the consultant survey, since I’m not one of those. I did participate and give my honest feedback in the consumer one. I would love for it to work! It’s good to vent now and then (or more, given how fast the frustration piles up), but sadly, that’s all that any efforts to “reach” Microsoft will ever be, in my estimation. They know we’re not happy, and they don’t care. The only way they would be made to care is if people refused to get on board and be monetized. If people are behaving in a way that benefits Microsoft even though they’re not happy about it, what would be the motive for MS to concern themselves with things like customer satisfaction? They’re already proving that it simply does not matter.
So, to go back to that initial citation at the beginning of this post:
10 — or something like it is our current and our future.
No, not in mine. I might keep it caged in a VM to prod and poke like some kind of strange animal whose very existence is a curiosity, but it’s not in my current or future as anything beyond that. It’s not a qualified, “serious” operating system. If that’s what you’re looking for, Windows 10 is not fit for purpose. It’s not even one of the choices for me going forward. Linux, BSD, MacOS, using an older version of Windows past its end of support date (possibly within a VM running on Linux), ChromeOS, or giving up PCs and moving to Android or iOS are all choices that exist, with varying degrees of appeal, but Windows 10 didn’t even meet the preliminary requirements of an OS to make it on the ballot. I have my doubt about Android too, but I haven’t used any version of that newer than Jellybean, so I can’t really say.
Dell XPS 13/9310, i5-1135G7/16GB, KDE Neon 6.2
XPG Xenia 15, i7-9750H/32GB & GTX1660ti, Kubuntu 24.04
Acer Swift Go 14, i5-1335U/16GB, Kubuntu 24.04 (and Win 11)
” I might keep it [Win 10] caged in a VM to prod and poke like some kind of strange animal whose very existence is a curiosity, but it’s not in my current or future as anything beyond that. It’s not a qualified, “serious” operating system. If that’s what you’re looking for, Windows 10 is not fit for purpose. ”
Terrific posting! Hear! Hear! Rapping knuckles on a table while stomping with both feet…
Ex-Windows user (Win. 98, XP, 7); since mid-2017 using also macOS. Presently on Monterey 12.15 & sometimes running also Linux (Mint).
MacBook Pro circa mid-2015, 15" display, with 16GB 1600 GHz DDR3 RAM, 1 TB SSD, a Haswell architecture Intel CPU with 4 Cores and 8 Threads model i7-4870HQ @ 2.50GHz.
Intel Iris Pro GPU with Built-in Bus, VRAM 1.5 GB, Display 2880 x 1800 Retina, 24-Bit color.
macOS Monterey; browsers: Waterfox "Current", Vivaldi and (now and then) Chrome; security apps. Intego AV
These are the responses of the Consultant patcher survey, not the consumer version.
From Patch lady – IT pro survey on patches:
Patch lady here – for those of you that are IT professionals, consultants or business patchers, I have put together a survey regarding Windows patching and specifically on Windows 10 patching.
So, when asking for responses, the emphasis was on W10, to begin with… and I’m thinking that Susan was trying to focus on identifying actual user experiences, to present anyone interested (Microsoft?) with feedback that their telemetry in W10 is obviously not telling them.
Overall, the same things that frustrate the pros are what frustrates me… telemetry, forced updating, no way to skip a problematic patch and receive other patches, unwanted apps, settings being changed, patches causing problems…
Some of the comments say that the consumer stuff (apps showing up and store) should not be on business versions, at all. I’d just like to say that there needs to be a consumer version, even if it is “Pro” that doesn’t shove all the unwanted c*** onto it. I’d be willing to pay for a long term stable version without telemetry, without unwanted apps or features, pay once and no subscriptions…
The fact that there is no such version available is why Windows won’t be in my future.
People who use their computers at home should not have it altered into an entertainment/advertising piece of junk… we actually have real things we want to do with our computers, too! Microsoft just doesn’t respect end users… and the IT pro’s shouldn’t be disrespecting us, either, by saying Microsoft should leave those to Home and Pro users… Those “features” are just not useful to anyone… terribly annoying… and actually why there are fewer people going out and buying new computers.
Maybe Microsoft could offer a free entertainment/advertising version, but sell actual, functional OS to those of us that want one?
There were very few IT Pros that were saying, “this is great” or “easier” or “helpful”… and none saying that it is actually saving time… and they are the best equipped to configure W10 to work the way they want it to…
I sure hope that someone who can make changes in how these changes are being “rolled out” pays attention to the feedback. Maybe they can make the next round of bonuses based on customer satisfaction, rather than how fast and how many machines can be forced to comply. It sort of reminds me of how Wells Fargo got into trouble by incentivizing opening more accounts… and more accounts were opened, but now they’re caught because a lot of those accounts were defrauding their customers.
At some point people, whether IT Pros, or Home customers, don’t want to be bullied or disrespected… and the forced updating and forced changes do that to all of us… and we really hate it!
Non-techy Win 10 Pro and Linux Mint experimenter
Thanks, Elly.
Whatever the intention behind that survey, it was poorly explained in the lead article in Woody’s Home Page, and not very well thought out overall. I feel free to write this because, as you well know, I am not interested in becoming Mr. Popularity.
This, by the way, is friendly criticism. Unfriendly criticism is a lot nastier and largely ad hominem. Some people can take friendly criticism and, occasionally, if the criticism happens to be correct (what mine is, is up to others to judge), even learn how to do things better; some people cannot.
Ex-Windows user (Win. 98, XP, 7); since mid-2017 using also macOS. Presently on Monterey 12.15 & sometimes running also Linux (Mint).
MacBook Pro circa mid-2015, 15" display, with 16GB 1600 GHz DDR3 RAM, 1 TB SSD, a Haswell architecture Intel CPU with 4 Cores and 8 Threads model i7-4870HQ @ 2.50GHz.
Intel Iris Pro GPU with Built-in Bus, VRAM 1.5 GB, Display 2880 x 1800 Retina, 24-Bit color.
macOS Monterey; browsers: Waterfox "Current", Vivaldi and (now and then) Chrome; security apps. Intego AV
There are experts that write surveys. I’m not one of them. Consider this a different way to have a voice.
I don’t consider that Windows 7 will be around for a long long time. Unless you have a premier support contract/extended patching, one should be in the plans to get off of Windows 7. January 2020 will be here sooner than we think.
Susan Bradley Patch Lady/Prudent patcher
While I am not in the target demographic, I appreciate that survey and its results. The results indicate a lot of restlessness out in the IT hinterlands with W10. While that does not mean it will be ditched by enterprise soon it does mean seeds of doubt are being sown. This is a longer term problem for MS as other options appear and become viable alternatives for W10 for enterprises. The longer MS continues to ignore what users really want more likely they are to look for alternatives and pull the trigger when the time comes.
Thanks for the effort and sharing the results.
So I quite agree that, for now, Windows 10 might well be the future… if not a really great one.
Windows 10 is a really great present for me and half a billion others.
At least for ordinary Windows users. Whom, and please, correct me if I’m wrong, Woody’s is, if not entirely, at least mostly about.
Define ordinary.
Windows 10 is a really great present for me and half a billion others.
[Citation needed.]
Just because a person may find themselves using Windows 10, it does not imply that they think it’s “really great.” If it was, MS would not have had to use their full monopoly power to force it on an unwilling populace. There would not have been products like “Never 10” or “GWX Control Panel” if people weren’t trying to defend against having this “great” product forced on them against their will.
A good product sells itself, they say; Windows 10 couldn’t even be given away. They had to resort to malware-like trickery and dark patterns to ensnare unsuspecting Windows users to get them to take the free upgrade. They have done everything in their power to make remaining on Windows 7 as difficult as possible, and they’ve even gone so far as to use the Windows Update system to distribute a Trojan horse to sabotage working Windows 7/8.1 installations on newer hardware, permanently breaking their ability to get security updates, deliberately putting them at risk for future malware infections, all in an effort to make sure that there are no alternatives but Windows 10.
That’s not “really great.” It’s about as far from “really great” as it is possible to be.
Dell XPS 13/9310, i5-1135G7/16GB, KDE Neon 6.2
XPG Xenia 15, i7-9750H/32GB & GTX1660ti, Kubuntu 24.04
Acer Swift Go 14, i5-1335U/16GB, Kubuntu 24.04 (and Win 11)
Wish I was among the lucky “very satisfied” responders that finds patching is perfect, new features extremely useful and can’t have enough of them often enough.
That was a surprise. Didn’t really imagine such people even existed…
Thanks for the report!
Hey Y’all,
IMHO it doesn’t much matter what we think as long as we continue to use, and thereby fund, Windows. Until enough users go elsewhere be it Linux, Apple, Chrome, etc. MS will keep marching to their own drum (read self interest as they perceive it). Just ask IBM… it was the IBM way or the Highway at least until Windows came along and changed the game. It will take another seismic change to maybe get Microsoft’s attention, it never did get IBM’s attention till they had lost the PC business (think Micro Channel Bus and OS/2 here) and then it was too late.
It will take time, much like what happened to IBM. But MS is following IBM’s play book of ignoring what customers really want. And there are options available for having a box with another OS preinstalled. This last weekend, I specced out a few Linux based boxes for a few vendors just to see what was available. Also, searched Amazon for Linux boxes. So they are out there, not necessarily cheap but readily available. I have seen Chromebooks at Walmart and Best Buy, so they are readily available for immediate pickup. Apple stores are in most major metro areas, so they are also available for immediate pickup. The options are out there and there is some consumer awareness on their availability. So all it takes is for consumers and businesses to bite the bullet. When enough do so, MS will wake and find themselves in the same position as IBM is currently.
What MS seems to be forgetting; OSes are not the end but a means to an end. The real value of Windows is not Windows but the entire Windows ecosystem. There is a lot of software that only runs on Windows even now. So the value of Windows is access to this software. But if one does not need Windows only software then one does not need Windows. And most users probably do not need Windows only software so staying with Windows right is more a matter of inertia than anything else.
It took about 15 years or so for IBM to finally realize they were in trouble. They are currently a declining IT player as their sales have been steadily dropping for several years even if the last quarter had a small uptick. At this point I can not think of a specific IBM product I would need that there isn’t a competitive product for from someone else that is often better.
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