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  • Oh boy. Just what we need. Another edition of Windows 10, WTFCUPFWP

    Home Forums AskWoody blog Oh boy. Just what we need. Another edition of Windows 10, WTFCUPFWP

    This topic contains 57 replies, has 23 voices, and was last updated by  AlexEiffel 2 months ago.

    • Author
      Posts
    • #128977 Reply

      woody
      Da Boss

      I think I’ll open the acronym up for your comments. Keep it civil, please. Windows 10 Fall Creators Update Pro for Workstation PCs, or WTFCUPFWP Post
      [See the full post at: Oh boy. Just what we need. Another edition of Windows 10, WTFCUPFWP]

      1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #128983 Reply

      Geo
      AskWoody Lounger

      It should be called Windows 7 SP2.  Back to the drawing board.

    • #128984 Reply

      anonymous

      WTFCUPFWP

      Why The Frick Can’t U People Fix Windows Properly?

      Total of 24 users thanked author for this post. Here are last 20 listed.
    • #128987 Reply

      lurks about
      AskWoody Lounger

      The first three letters are a good start. I did not count the variations of W10 but something is out of whack. At most there should be 3 versions: server, enterprise, and generic desktop (approximately Pro). When released, each variation should be not alpha/beta ware but ready for installation by anyone with periodic LTS version. If MS needs help they should go Ubuntu.com to see an example how it should be done.

      One has to wonder at the competence the high ranking PHBs at MS. Far too many variants to sort out for most users. The KISS method works wonders here.

      4 users thanked author for this post.
      • #129060 Reply

        Noel Carboni
        AskWoody MVP

        The KISS method works wonders here

        Who said it was about anything that “works”? That stopped being relevant when Microsoft decided to get out of the operating system business because it’s too hard.

        -Noel

        • #129063 Reply

          lurks about
          AskWoody Lounger

          Question for MS, is do they want to stay in business? These versions seem to be more geared to confusing people rather than helping. Confused people do not like to spend money because they fear making a mistake and if there other options they might investigate them more seriously.

          People complain about the number of Linux distros being confusing but within a distro and its family there is a common philosophy and options. Most ‘versions’ of distro are only differ by the desktop environment used (which can be easily changed by the user).

          2 users thanked author for this post.
    • #128988 Reply

      Cybertooth
      AskWoody Lounger

      Good thing you specified to “keep it civil,” Woody. The initial trio of letters in the acronym suggest themselves…

      • This reply was modified 2 months, 1 week ago by  Cybertooth.
      2 users thanked author for this post.
    • #128994 Reply

      MrJimPhelps
      AskWoody MVP

      Windows
      Ten
      Fosters
      Confusion
      Und
      Panic
      For the
      Whole
      Population

      11 users thanked author for this post.
    • #128990 Reply

      anonymous

      How about calling it the Whiskey, Tango, Foxtrot Edition?

      4 users thanked author for this post.
    • #128991 Reply

      anonymous

      “A leopard never changes its spots”
      .
      The many many editions of Win 7 and their respective “progressive” pricing was just M$ purposely adding or subtracting features to the OS, eg purposely blocked Win 7 from using more than 2GB RAM = Win 7 Starter.
      .
      M$ added a few features to Win 10 Pro = Win 10 Pro Workstation.
      M$ subtracted a few features from Win 10 Pro = Win 10 S.

      • #129042 Reply

        anonymous

        “M$ added a few features to Win 10 Pro = Win 10 Pro Workstation.
        M$ subtracted a few features from Win 10 Pro = Win 10 S.”

         

        Sooooo where does Home version fit?

        • #129073 Reply

          anonymous

          Reply:
          IOW, it will likely get the same treatment as for Win 7 ‘Home’ Starter, Win 7 Home Basic and Win 7 Home Premium.

          • #129089 Reply

            anonymous

            CANNON FODDER hey!

            or Collateral damage for the benefit of the favoured WaaS target audience.

            I want my hard earned moolla back for the license which I paid,  for a stable and workable O/s which HOME versions aren’t.

            Wombat.

    • #129000 Reply

      Jan K.
      AskWoody Lounger

      Woody, are you mocking Microsoft? 😛 Does it matter if there are 22 or 23 different Windows 10s?

      Frankly, this is the best news I’ve heard in a long time!

      I do rant a lot 😀 but also have requested exactly this Workstation Edition at least a couple of times… $300 or more is no problem at all and would still be happy to pay a yearly, reasonable “user fee” for updates and patches…

      But all settings for all telemetri must be open and honestly represented by Microsoft for each user to choose his/hers preferred setup…

      Really looking forward to hear more about this Edition!

       

      2 users thanked author for this post.
      • #129020 Reply

        zero2dash
        AskWoody Lounger

        I believe it’s already been confirmed that this is based on Pro with only the additions listed.

        No changes to telemetry or updating.

        • #129027 Reply

          woody
          Da Boss

          I think you’re right. And that implies it only has an 18 month life – or effectively 14 months if you wait for CBB, and six months if you want to pick up the next version as soon as it’s stable.

          I believe the next version will be called Windows 10 Fall Creators Update North American Spring Revision Pro for Workstation PCs, or WTFCUNASRPFWP

          3 users thanked author for this post.
          • #129050 Reply

            Jan K.
            AskWoody Lounger

            And… suddenly I’m in no hurry at all.

            Perhaps I should just relax, lean back and give Microsoft a couple of years. Perhaps they’ll eventually sort out, where they want “you to go today”.

            /edit

            And no ads, for crying out loud!

            Just a simple, back-to-basic, hard-core, no-nonsence, rock-solid OS…. free of fancy stuff. Go ahead and develope all kind of apps, but place them in the store. Doubt I’ll be interested, but should it happen, I’ll know where to look for it. Don’t feed me.

            Is that too much to ask?

            Suddenly remember Noel: “time spending complaining here, should instead be spent on studying Linux etc.”

            I shut up! 😀

            2 users thanked author for this post.
            • #129059 Reply

              anonymous

              And… suddenly I’m in no hurry at all.

              Perhaps I should just relax, lean back and give Microsoft a couple of years. Perhaps they’ll eventually sort out, where they want “you to go today”.

               

              I deal with Windows since version 3.11, and from Windows 95 on up to know, I think this still does apply.

              <joke> So I think now is the perfect time to install Windows 9 </joke>

            • #129091 Reply

              zero2dash
              AskWoody Lounger

              LTSB.

              Probably what I’ll end up running eventually myself. Grab the eval and just keep running it unregistered. Not many nags.

              https://www.howtogeek.com/273824/windows-10-without-the-cruft-windows-10-ltsb-explained/

            • #129104 Reply

              anonymous

              That’s my plan. If by the time Windows 8.1 EOLs they haven’t fixed Windows, I’ll just jump to the Linux ship. Hopefully by that point any software that I have will have a good enough Linux version. Almost there now.

    • #129003 Reply

      PKCano
      AskWoody MVP

      Well, Win10 was supposed to make things simple – one OS for everything. Lets see:

      Win10 Cloud, S, Home, Pro, Education, Pro education, Enterprise, Enterprise LTSB, Workstation, Server, Mobile, Mobile Enterprise, ioT, ioT Enterprise, ioT Mobile Enterprise

      Win10 RTM, 1507, 1511FU, 1607AU, 1703CU

      Server 2008, 2008 R2 SP1, 2012, 2012 R2, 2016

      Then there’s all the active Builds….

      Whoever Thought Counting Upgrades Perplexed Windows People?

       

      • This reply was modified 2 months, 1 week ago by  PKCano.
      10 users thanked author for this post.
    • #129004 Reply

      Seff
      AskWoody Lounger

      Woody The Famous Computer User Produces First-rate Windows Publications

      I’m sure MS would be only too happy to use their edition titles to promote your books :)!

      8 users thanked author for this post.
    • #129005 Reply

      abbodi86
      AskWoody MVP

      WX is a proper acronym for Windows 10 than WT 😀

    • #129009 Reply

      Charlie
      AskWoody Lounger

      I don’t usually bother to read the constant deluge of problems and change to Win 10 (no offense to you Woody), but I had to read this one!  At least MS has finally come up with an appropriate edition name (or acronym) this time.

    • #129013 Reply

      1CentsLess
      AskWoody Lounger

      WTF… WTF… WTF… WTFCUPFWP
      Sorry, I stu..stu…stu…stutter.

      3 users thanked author for this post.
      • #129046 Reply

        anonymous

        “WTF… WTF… WTF… WTFCUPFWP”

        @1centsless

        From this point onwards I vote for it to be referred to as only WTF!

        • #129323 Reply

          johnf
          AskWoody Lounger

          Or just shorten it to WTFUBAR !

    • #129015 Reply

      NetDef
      AskWoody Lounger

      I’m actually pretty pumped about this upcoming edition – our client base leans heavily on very high end hardware to do large renders of engineering / architectural projects. We’ve run into some performance bottlenecks and limitations on both Windows 7 Pro and Windows 10 ENT/Pro.

      One of the features that may or may not make it in this year is the so called workstation mode for intense calculations. (I think that’s what it’s called, might be close at least.)  This is very likely the same thing as “game mode” on W10Home/Pro now – just rebranded to attract users of 3dMax, Revit or Maya and the like.

       

    • #129014 Reply

      anonymous

      I’m getting tiered of seeing  this build after build nonsense ,i’m glad i’m still runing Win 7  an os that was designed for a desktop  unlike the latest encarnation that belongs on a mobile phone

      4 users thanked author for this post.
    • #129025 Reply

      PKCano
      AskWoody MVP

      Is WTFCUPFWP going to be Enterprise only on a rental basis, or do they intend to sell commercially?
      If so, will it be an upgrade from Pro for those businesses which don’t pay for Enterprise or the general public?

      1 user thanked author for this post.
      • #129029 Reply

        woody
        Da Boss

        Excellent questions.

        What I don’t understand – why don’t we just have a Windows 10 (for the desktop) that adapts to different hardware?

        1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #129026 Reply

      anonymous

      Was there a recent survey saying that more than 80% of Windows users are having below average IQ?

    • #129033 Reply

      MrJimPhelps
      AskWoody MVP

      We
      The
      Frazzled
      Can’t
      Undergo
      Profiteering
      For
      Wicked
      Purposes

      1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #129034 Reply

      Elly
      AskWoody Lounger

      Woody, and all… I could so use a laugh button… I’d be pressing it, over and over, on this page, for sure!

      Looks like they are addressing everything under the sun and moon… except what their customers really want.

      They clearly have all the parts to make it successful, and are still sabotaging themselves with limiting users machines, subscriptions, marketing c***, and telemetry.

      Power and control… its addictive, and addicts lose all sense of proportion compared to normal people.

      Woody, do you really feel like you and the MPV’s here are the orchestra playing while the ship sinks? I think in the long run, we all have access to lifeboats… no matter what version of Linux might be our chosen one. Enjoying the music while floating, floating, floating away to safety…

      Elly-

      Win 7 Home, Group B

      7 users thanked author for this post.
      • #129051 Reply

        anonymous

        @elly

        “I could so use a laugh button”

        Stop laughing this is serious!

        and I seriously suggest that Elly’s suggestion for a laugh button be implemented asap.

        Stop the world I want to get off!

      • #129053 Reply

        woody
        Da Boss

        The Titanic imagery haunts me…..

        At least we have a fine orchestra, here, to make light of the slow descent.

        3 users thanked author for this post.
        • #129110 Reply

          MrJimPhelps
          AskWoody MVP

          The current Microsoft leadership is quite the orchestra!

    • #129030 Reply

      anonymous

      For the 02 Aug 2016-released Win 10 Anniversary Update/Version 1607, M$ degraded the Group Policy Editor for Win 10 Pro, eg could no longer disable “display of ads”, in order to push SMBs from Win 10 Pro to Win 10 Ent E3/E5 subscriptions.
      … Seems, there has been not many “push-overs” or takers after 1 year. So, M$ are now resorting to offering SMBs this new edition of Win 10 Pro, ie Win 10 Pro for Workstations, which will likely and certainly costs more than US$199 per Retail license.

      • #129070 Reply

        anonymous

        The US$199 cost of the Win 10 Pro Retail license can buy you an OEM Win 10 Intel Atom touchscreen 2-in-1 tablet computer.
        To many, it is preposterous or profit-gouging that the price of an OS license is the same as the price of a computer.

        Microsoft = MS = Martin Shkreli

    • #129047 Reply

      alpha128
      AskWoody Lounger

      WTFCUPFWP

      Why They Force C*** Unto PeopleFor Windows Profits!

      1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #129043 Reply

      anonymous

      Keenly waiting for the WXIIWLFIWHBA version (Windows 10 if I wanted less flexibility I would have bought Apple).

    • #129055 Reply

      Noel Carboni
      AskWoody MVP

      They need to restore some of the basic cornerstones, like privacy and control, before a “Workstation” edition really has any meaning. Sadly, just a mention of ReFS (which has been working since Windows 8.1; I’ve been using it for years) isn’t really enough. And I like big systems but somehow have not yet begun to feel that a 2 TB RAM ceiling was a practical limitation.

      Marketing: Give us some numbers you can expand without more than 5 minutes work.
      Engineering: Sure, no problem. We can change a manifest constant and give a few more bits to the max RAM limit.

      Marketing: Can you enable some features available to some variant of Windows already?
      Engineering: WinRE has been able to format ReFS disks for a long time. We can just remove the conditional code that blocks allowing it in Windows 10.

      Marketing: Got any old projects that sound pretty geeky that were essentially done but were shelved because Marketing didn’t understand why anyone would want them in a phone?
      Engineering: Yep, how about that flash memory in a DIMM driver we wrote a few years ago?

      Marketing: How about some features that are already in the software but aren’t configured to be enabled by default?
      Engineering:

      NewOldFeature

      Engineering to Marketing: You do know that smoke and mirrors don’t work on actual engineers, right?

      -Noel

      • This reply was modified 2 months, 1 week ago by  Noel Carboni.
      • This reply was modified 2 months, 1 week ago by  Noel Carboni.
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      5 users thanked author for this post.
    • #129065 Reply

      anonymous

      We need a Windows edition name generator program.

    • #129098 Reply

      jescott418
      AskWoody Lounger

      So first Microsoft tries a one size fits all Jekyll and Hyde approach with Windows 8. Now its going the opposite way with a smorgasbord of versions to try and make everyone happy. This whole thing gets to be more of a mess as we go forward.

    • #129115 Reply

      MrBrian
      AskWoody MVP

      Did I miss any editions?

      From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_10_editions: “Windows 10 has twelve editions (excluding the four “N” editions), all with varying feature sets, use cases, or intended devices.” (not including the Pro for Workstations edition)

      • This reply was modified 2 months, 1 week ago by  MrBrian.
      • This reply was modified 2 months, 1 week ago by  MrBrian.
      • #129119 Reply

        anonymous

        @ MrBrian, …

        And most of the 13 Win 10 Editions have 3 Versions being supported by M$ at any one time, eg presently, they are Version 1511, Version 1607 and Version 1703.
        … Then the 2 latest Versions of Win 10 has 2 Branches or Channels, ie CB and CBB or Semi Annual Channel Targeted(Pilot) and SAC(Broad).

        M$ must be running their employees ragged supporting so many combination of Editions, Versions and Channels for Win 10.

      • #129169 Reply

        anonymous

        Windows 10 1709 Home Datacenter Team Edition 😉

    • #129159 Reply

      anonymous

      W10, oh my; what an intricate web we weave when at first we set out to deceive! Nice work Microsoft.

    • #129257 Reply

      anonymous

      How does this relate to the other things, is it a 4d overlapping grid of windows 10 choices? Can you pick more than one?

      What is the Long-Term Targeted Branch for Business? Because I though that was the same as the Long Term Servicing Channel for Business… Is the one you can select in windows updates (on pro) Annual Targeted Channel or just TSLB? What is the Semi-Current Branch? Does that let you delay updates? Is it 35 days or 10 days? Do I get that option if I upgrade to Anniversary Update (1151)?

    • #129304 Reply

      anonymous

      It is not an acronym it is an initialism.  An acronym you can pronounce e.g. NASA an initialism you say letter for letter e.g IBM, WTF.

      🙂

    • #129424 Reply

      AlexEiffel
      AskWoody Lounger

      So now Microsoft has decided to stop developing the OS for normal editions and save that for their special edition? In what world could you justify not having everyone on ReFS if they want to? They need 2 disks anyway if they want the mirror mode, so I don’t think it will be that popular. I already run ReFS on my data disks, what is the advantage of paying to get it on the boot disk? They will remove this capacity from the Pro edition so you see an advantage running Workstation? To me, a resilient file system seems like a pretty basic OS function that should be included in incremental updates to the last Windows ever.

      There is absolutely nothing that great about this version as it is the same version of Windows that expires and changes all the time, feeding you ads and forced updates while you try to do your work, except that it turns a few switches on for people that need the cpu power and are artificially prevented to use it right now. Nothing close to a business version that offers stability, simplicity and no forced down your throat toys.

      If you were hoping for that LTSB equivalent for home and small businesses or an officially supported general computing version for big enterprises, you will have to wait and continue to hope.

      Judging from that blog post MrBrian just linked about how to “automate” WaaS (https://www.askwoody.com/forums/topic/windows-as-a-service-simplified-and-aligned-microsoft-blog-post/#post-129219), this is not about to happen, at all, until Microsoft looses a lot more. Some of their engineers look more disconnected than the marketing folk, so that doesn’t look good for the future­.

      1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #129798 Reply

      Kirsty
      AskWoody MVP

      New Windows 10 Pro edition reveals Microsoft’s inconsistency
      By Gregg Keizer | Aug 16, 2017

       
      “Microsoft says they want it to be highly reliable, but at the same time, they don’t tell us which support channel it will use,” said Cherry, referring to the release tracks the company offers customers for feature upgrades. “This will run on hardware with non-volatile RAM and a high-speed network interface card, but [will Microsoft say it must be] updated every six months with the latest release? If so, that’s a contradiction.”

      Windows 10 is distributed in three such “channels,” including Insider, a frequently-updated development build; Semi-Annual Channel, an every-six-months-comes-an-upgrade track; and Long-term Servicing Channel, or LTSC, available only to customers running the Windows 10 Enterprise edition. A version of Windows 10 assigned to the LSTC may be left alone, serviced only by security updates, for as many as 10 years.

       
      Read the full article here

      1 user thanked author for this post.
      • #129804 Reply

        anonymous

        “Windows 10 Pro [for Workstations is] designed to meet the needs of our advanced users deploying their workstation PCs in demanding and mission-critical scenarios,” Klaus Diaconu, a manager in Microsoft’s Windows and devices group, wrote in a post to a company blog.

        .

        Long-Term Servicing Branch (LTSB)
        For the mission-critical scenarios in which Windows devices will be used, we will release what we call Long-Term Servicing branches at the appropriate time intervals. Devices on these branches will receive the level of enterprise support expected for the mission critical systems and it will keep those systems more secure with the latest security and critical updates, while minimizing change by not delivering new features for the duration of mainstream or extended support.

        https://blogs.technet.microsoft.com/enterprisemobility/2016/01/06/navigating-the-windows-10-servicing-options/
        .
        So, Win 10 Pro for Workstations will most likely be on LTSB/LTSC 2016 and costs US$400 per license Retail.
        … If so, some Consumers and SMBs will flock to Win 10 Pro W because no need to do upgrades twice a year and EOL is about 10 years in 2026. Next is LTSB/LTSC 2019(EOL = 2029).

        • #129825 Reply

          AlexEiffel
          AskWoody Lounger

          That would be the right thing to do for Microsoft, but I don’t think they want to do this.  I think they will still try to have their cake and eat it by forcing people on the rapid release. Maybe they hope to push more store stuff and other monetization schemes that way, but I don’t see businesses buying into that anytime soon.

          ch100 said many times LTSB is supposed to be for very specific situations, not for general purpose computing. Although, maybe it is just wishful thinking from MS and doesn’t have any relationship to real world use (I don’t see why LTSB would not run Office as well as rapid releases Windows), that clearly doesn’t seem to be what they want to provide an LTS version thst is widely adopted.

          But, since I think for them it is only a matter of flipping a switch, I don’t see any technical reason why they couldn’t change their mind after angering too many customers.

        • #129829 Reply

          anonymous

          @ … AlexEiffel … … . ,

          Remember that for Win 10 Anniversary Update/Version 1607, released on 2 Aug 2016, M$ purposely deprecated Win 10 Pro in order to push SMBs to subscribe to Win 10 Ent E3 or E5 at US$7 or US$14 per month per seat/user/employee, respectively. Eg the Group Policy Editor could no longer disable the display of ads in Win 10 Pro.
          … Win 10 Ent E3 & E5 subscriptions cannot be converted to LTSB/LTSC.

          Likely, after about 1 year, M$ have found that they were very few SMBs taking their “poison pill” to upgrade their Win 7 Pro/Ultimate, Win 8.1 Pro or Win 10 Pro to Win 10 Ent subscriptions.
          … Hence, this latest likely offer of Win 10 Pro for Workstations LTSB/LTSC 2016 to the SMBs by M$.

          P S – In Oct 2016, Win 7/8.1 were forced onto the monthly Patch Rollups bandwagon = a form of OS degradation by M$, likely in order to push their users onto Win 10 in general.

          1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #129860 Reply

      AlexEiffel
      AskWoody Lounger

      Interesting. But maybe small businesses just didn’t know all that or that they could get rid of ads using enteprises licenses or just found it ridiculous to switch to a rental model they found expensive just to get rid of ads or didn’t want to give more to Microsoft feeling bullied into it.

      Yes, I agree Win10 W LTS would make for a very compelling proposition. I am just not sure MS will try that first. It might be a last resort solution if the original big plan fail. I predict they won’t sell much of it if they don’t put LTS.

    Please follow the -Lounge Rules- no personal attacks, no swearing, and politics/religion are relegated to the Rants forum.

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