Networking home computers with Windows 10

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Am I alone? I don’t think so, to judge by the myriad plaintive messages and almost as numerous fixes which, at best, work for a few people, some of the time.

I want to be able to transfer files between a home PC and a laptop, both running Windows 10 Home, and networked via ethernet cable (the PC) and wi-fi (the Laptop) to the same router. Internet access and printer sharing work fine.

But with the PC and Laptop, sometimes one can ‘see’ the other. Sometimes not. Sometimes one will copy files from another, sometimes not. I have tried innumerable ‘fixes’ involving starting services, some registry edits… Nothing works. I have to revert to using a USB flash-drive. No doubt in Windows 11 this will change to floppy disk?

Surely there must be a fix to this most mundane and common of problems? Years ago there used to be a Cisco app (Network Magic? not sure of the name) which did all this. Now there’s nothing, just the black hole of Microsoft incomprehension.

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Have you tried running the network troubleshooter?

It is a bit of a pain, but have you tried resetting your network using the settings app?

When things don’t work, it is immediately after an update? If so, have you checked all your network settings to make sure something did not get reset?

When things don’t work, does a reboot of either PC fix it? How about a reboot of both?

Do you have an account on each PC with the same user and password? You don’t have to use it. It just has to exist.

 

--Joe

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I have found you need to have IPv6 enabled on all PCs for Windows network to be reliable.

cheers, Paul

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wavy

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WSJMGatehouse wrote:

No doubt in Windows 11 this will change to floppy disk?

ROFL but I feel for you.

Paul T wrote:

I have found you need to have IPv6 enabled on all PCs for Windows network to be reliable.

Now there is an interesting item. I was going to suggest mapping.

🍻

Just because you don't know where you are going doesn't mean any road will get you there.

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1 – Has this ‘always’ been a problem, or a recent development?
2 – Double-check that the Workgroup name is identical between the two. A re-boot/restart is needed to activate it when it is changed.

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I gave up on trying to copy files (or share files) between devices on my home network since Windows 10 1809.
What I did is assigning a fix IP to network devices which solved my problem.

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Michael432

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As the rest of you have noted Windows Networking is a pain! Just query my posts on SMB1 protocol here. I’ve however come to grips with it and can make it work although not as seamlessly as I’d like. Here’s what I do now.

• Of course all are on the same P2P network name (HOME)
• I set up a share on each machine for the G: drive (my data drive where I’ve relocated all the standard folders, i.e. Documents, Pictures, Videos, etc.) in the format xxxDocs-MachineName, ex: BEKDocs-DellXPS8700.
• I open the link in File Explorer, which may require entering \\networkname\Share-name in the box at the top.
• Once opened I pin it to the Quick Access list. This usually solves the problems, for me at least.
• As for syncing computers I use FreeFileSyne to sync up the folders I want to have on all my machines.
• Lots of time when working in other programs that display a file selection box I wind up typing in the \\networkname\Share-name\folder\file.ext to get what I want. However, most of the time once I get started windows usually offers a selection list which cuts down on typing.

Remember in the examples network name is NOT the workgroup name but rather the name assigned to your network by your router, e.g. its SSID!

HTH

May the Forces of good computing be with you!

RG

PowerShell & VBA Rule!
Computer Specs

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BobbyB

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As for step 3 (i.e., “open the link in File Explorer”), I know of 6 ways you can view your network computers and to pin them to Quick Access or the Start Menu.
1. Go to Control Panel\Network and Internet, where you will see the heading “Network and Sharing Center”, under which is a link to “View network computers and devices”.
2. You can type “Network and Sharing Center” (no quotes) in the search box in the lower-left hand corner of the TaskBar, and it will take you to a screen where your network computers are listed.
3. You can go to the Start Menu list of apps, where you can pin it to the Start Menu. This is my strategy for viewing the network computers.
4. You can go to the Start Menu list of apps, right-click, and choose “More”, click on “Open File Location”, and once the file location is found, right-click on Network to “Pin to Quick Access”
5. You can go to This PC, look at the Navigation Panel on the left, find “Network”, and click on it to view network computers and devices.
6. You can go to This PC, look at the Navigation Panel on the left, find “Network”, and right-click on it to “Pin to Quick Access”

I have turned on password protected sharing at Control Panel\All Control Panel Items\Network and Sharing Center\Advanced sharing settings (on left) as added protection in accessing network computers. Look under All Networks, and then under Password Protected Sharing for the radio button to turn this on. This means that you have to give your username and the password to the network computer before you can see its files under the “Username” folder. See attachment. As long as you leave the network computers on, you don’t have to give the credentials again.

I use a file manager program WinNc to sync my two laptops. It’s based on the old Norton Commander. See #2425279 for info about this software.

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I have a home network with 2 Windows 7 and 3 Windows 10.  All set up to share over the home network.  I can access any files from any PC on the Network.  This is set up according to Microsoft instructions.

What I found that after I set up everything like it should to share files over my home network was hit or miss as you described.  I ultimately found that the cause it was the firewall that was silently blocking LAN ports.  Adjusting those settings for each PC on the network has resulted in dependable connections to any PC I need for a very long time.  Not sure if that is your problem because there are a lot of steps for the security to allow PCs to talk to each other.   My Home network is setup via Windows Home Network with no other software involved.  For me, Windows Home Network works unless some security software or settings prevents it.

HTH, Dana:))

HTH, Dana:))

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As for syncing computers I use FreeFileSync to sync up the folders I want to have on all my machines.

I’m also a big fan of FreeFileSync!  Use it everyday.

Desktop Asus TUF X299 Mark 1, CPU: Intel Core i7-7820X Skylake-X 8-Core 3.6 GHz, RAM: 32GB, GPU: Nvidia GTX 1050 Ti 4GB. Display: Four 27" 1080p screens 2 over 2 quad.

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I gave up Networking with Win10 Home edition some time back, I have maintained that when they removed “Home Groups” from Windows they, for lack of a technical term, “Broke” reliable file sharing with any edition below Win 10 Pro. Basically the other Win10 machines do not show up reliably in the Network explorer  window, i.e. shortcut or run requires a bit of work \\192.168.0.1 etc.

Yes you can get it to work, sporadically, on Home editions but it rarely survives past the first (Re)Boot and has to be reset. Win’s 7, 8.1 seem unaffected.

Win 11 in limited testing with the Pro and above version seems ok but I have yet to use it full time not being enamoured at all with Win 11.

For those running Bootcamp networking Win 10 Pro and above versions seems fine even those running both machines in Bootcamp installations and mixed MacOS and Windows Networking.

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WCHS wrote:

I know of 6 ways you can view your network computers and to pin them to Quick Access or the Start Menu.

None works for me. The “network” doesn’t see my devices.
I assigned a fix IP, added the device to Quick Access.

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Thanks to everyone who has contributed to this thread so far.

The sheer variety of responses and experiences regarding what should be a simple matter just go to prove my point!

Could someone at AskWoody untangle all this and offer a single guidance/FAC which could work to resolve at least most of the problems? It would be a blessing!

In response to some of the questions you asked:

* yes, this has been a problem at least since moving to Windows 10

* updates don’t seem to affect it in any consistent way

* Yes, IPv6 is enabled on both computers

* Network troubleshooter doesn’t tell me anything useful/intelligible

User Accounts: yes, well, yet another area of long-lost clarity on which MS has dumped wagon-loads of obscurity, thanks to the advent of Microsoft Account. Computer-name; log-on name; network name; microsoft account name; log-on pin number (in Windows 11) ……….

Thanks again for all your useful and helfpul advice.

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I suggest you try this:

On the PC you are trying to connect to and “not seeing”, go into it and deactivate the firewall (Windows Defender or other security software) and try to connect again.  If it sees the PC, then the firewall on that PC is stopping the PC from answering the inbound request from the other PC so it is “not seen”.

HTH, Dana:))

HTH, Dana:))

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My default thread for troubleshooting small network sharing is:

Topic: What am i doing wrong? (Networking problems) @ AskWoody

Except NEVER enable SMB1. It’s a huge security vulnerability.

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@wsjmgatehouse here is a little guide I just put together. I added a new machine to my home network this week and ran into the same issues getting it to both consume and publish resources on my LAN…

Windows 10 – Peer Networking Issues – Mike Tanis – Feb.2022

Quick Reference

• Document network.
• Reboot Router/Gateway.
• Network Reset & Reboot.
• Memorable local Computer name (Hostname) and Workgroup name.
• Private Network (not Public).
• Network Not Metered.
• Network Provider Order (Microsoft Networking on top).
• Network Adapter Options.
• IPv4 settings.
• IPv6 settings.
• Advanced sharing settings.
• Windows Services.
• Windows Explorer – Folder Options – Sharing Wizard & View File Extensions.
• Control Panel – Windows Credential Manager.
• Firewall settings.
• Can’t locally share using a Microsoft Internet Account.

Reference Discussion
This discussion is predicated on a Windows 10 network with NO custom Firewall or Security Suite installed. If you have custom software disable it temporarily until you’ve established reliable communications. Every local machine should be touched to ensure uniformity of settings.

We are also not installing SMB1 due to its security issues.

I am assuming a Residential router set to mostly default or routine settings. Keep in mind we can compare settings with working systems to determine a baseline for default values.

You will need to reboot the local PC several times during this process.

Finally, you will not always see every machine in Network Neighborhood even though you can map a drive or open Explorer to that machine. Not sure why this is, but the lack of consistency here is actually very consistent with Windows 10!

1. Document network on paper.

• Hostnames
• Workgroup name
• IP addresses (Gateway, DNS, Subnet mask)
• Usernames & Passwords
• Login scripts
• Mapped drives.
• Ipconfig /all
• Arp -a
• Nbtstat -c
• Delete old mappings and scripts if not valid.
  • Net Use * /delete /yes
  • If exist t:\nul ( net use t: /delete )
  • Net use t: \\server\share /persistent:no /user:dummy password

2. Reboot Router/Gateway. (Should be early in the process)
3. Do a Network Reset & Reboot. (This is a must!)
4. Create a Dummy local user per machine, make them all the same. Login at least once on every shared machine to ensure Windows correctly instantiates the user account. Will not need to create as an Administrator level if you explicitly give Share and NTFS permissions to the dummy user. This allows you to access any share with \\sharedmachine\dummy and known password.
5. Static IP outside of DHCP range. Best long-term reliability if possible.

• Or Address Reservation in Router/Gateway
• Use addresses least likely to be DHCP assigned if you don’t have router access.

6. Create a memorable local Computer name (Hostname) and Workgroup name.
7. Edit the Hosts and LMHosts files (using #PRE, must be in CAPS, and files have no extensions!). Will need to use Explorer View Options and NOT Hide Extensions! Located in \Windows\System32\Drivers\etc. Use information gathered in documentation phase to enter all sharing machines. In theory this step can be skipped but the old ways seem to work very well!
8. Private Network (to ensure Firewall uses most permissive settings).
9. Not Metered. (May not matter but metering adds an unknown).
10. Network Provider Order (Microsoft Windows Network on top). This is the old LANABASE 0 issue with NetBIOS communications over multiple adapters.
11. Network Adapter Options (to include Microsoft Client, Microsoft File & Print Sharing, IPv4, IPv6, LLDP, Link-Layer items).
12. IPv4 settings (Use Static addressing if possible, set DNS suffix to “local” for mDNS to function correctly, not necessary to register in DNS, but DO enable LMHOSTS & NetBIOS). Proper IP address settings are beyond the scope of this discussion, use information gathered during the documentation phase. Perhaps incorporate DNSBench results if ISP DNS resolvers aren’t good.
13. IPv6 settings (automatic if possible)
14. Advanced sharing settings –

• Private (turn on discovery and sharing)
• All Networks (turn on Public sharing, 128bit, password protected)

15. Check Services.msc (to Enable DNS Client, Function Discovery, Link-layer Topography, Network Connections, Network List, Network Location, Peer Name, Peer Networking, Server, uPnP, Windows Time, Workstation). Use Automatic-Delayed Start if necessary.
16. Windows Explorer – Folder Options (Use Sharing Wizard enabled and Show File Extensions)
17. Create Drive Mappings and/or Desktop shortcuts to desired shares using Dummy account. Need to do this at least once to ensure Windows Credential Manager saves the username/pw combo.
18. Control Panel – Windows Credential Manager (may have to delete old mapping credentials)
19. Windows Firewall – Allow an App through the Firewall – Ensure File & Print Sharing is enabled for Private networks. (Mostly safe to just allow everything in the list for Private Networks).
20. Local file sharing will not work with a Microsoft Internet login. The SMB protocol will not resolve the credentials in that case. Use the Dummy local account instead!

Some sample configurations.
My personal network uses a TDS.Net T3200 Router/Gateway that uses DHCP and DNS forwarding. I have administrative access and have reprogrammed the defaults to change the DHCP range assigned for the router LAN to 192.168.0.101 through 192.168.0.199.

The router/gateway address is 192.168.0.1.

The machine I’m typing on is statically assigned as 192.168.0.250 with a mask of 255.255.255.0 and a Default Gateway of 192.168.0.1 and DNS servers of 192.168.0.1 and 1.1.1.1. My DNS suffix is set to “local” without the quotes and both Enable LMHOSTS and Enable NetBIOS over TCP/IP are checked. The local suffix triggers Peer Name Resolution via mDNS (multicast DNS) broadcast.

My machine name is KIOSK1 and my workgroup is WORKGROUP. All machines share that Workgroup name.

My HOSTS file looks like:

192.168.0.254 MACHINE1

192.168.0.253 MACHINE2

192.168.0.252 MACHINE3

192.168.0.251 LAPTOP1

192.168.0.250 KIOSK1

192.168.0.249 TV8

 

My LMHOSTS file looks like:

192.168.0.254 MACHINE1 #PRE

192.168.0.253 MACHINE2 #PRE

192.168.0.252 MACHINE3 #PRE

192.168.0.251 LAPTOP1 #PRE

192.168.0.250 KIOSK1 #PRE

192.168.0.249 TV8 #PRE

And both files are plain Text but lacking any file extension. (You may have to save the files with the .TXT extension and then come back and use Windows Explorer to rename and chop off the extension.)

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wavy, WCHS

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Networking on Windows was excellent on XP and went downhill on every version after that.

On Win 10 ( I have 2 desktops and a laptop, 1 Desktop with Ethernet cable and 1 Desktop and laptop are wireless, all from same router ). I had an awful time at first and finally just mapped the drives and that solved all my problems. If the other computers don’t show under Network, I just open up the mapped computer drive that I want because they are always there and functional.

Don't take yourself so seriously, no one else does 🙂
All W10 Pro at 22H2,(2 Desktops, 1 Laptop).

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https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/all/cant-see-other-computer-on-network/8ea267ad-e5bf-4019-8b7e-da5b174d0303

Info provided in the above link got me fully interconnected with 3 computers. Two are PCs (ethernet) and one is a laptop (WiFi). Of course you can only see folders (and there contents) from a linked computer if the folder is set up to be “shared”. It has be working great for at least a month. No Problems.

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Let me mention here that those directions include enabling SMB 1.0/CIFS. In the posts above, one in particular at #2425487, it is recommended to never enable SMB1 because it’s a security risk.

Any comments from anyone on this?

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bashbish

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SMB1 has been decided to be unsecure but I haven’t been able to network without it. Your choice

Don't take yourself so seriously, no one else does 🙂
All W10 Pro at 22H2,(2 Desktops, 1 Laptop).

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bashbish

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SMBv1 has some really serious security issues. And while it’s probably unlikely it can be exploited directly on a small home LAN behind a residential gateway I’d rather not take that risk.

If any machine on an SMBv1 network gets compromised, then it could be used to burrow into any other machine using that protocol.

Here’s a good exposition on the protocol, https://cybersophia.net/articles/what-is/what-is-smb-protocol-and-why-is-it-a-security-concern/

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bashbish

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thanks for  the tip people. I did check to see where I may have enabled SMBv1 and it turns out I never checked that box, so I think it is not turned on. I must have used method 1 in the link that I showed in my original post here. In any case, networking other PCs is working good.

If there is any security risk in Method 1 of the link I posted somebody school me on it because security is more important to me than networking my PCs.

Thanks very much for the info

 

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Method 1 is routine and poses no special security risk that we know of at this time.

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bashbish

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TO CLARIFY THE BOX  IN  OPTIONALFEATURES ” SMB 1.0/CIFS FILE SHARING SUPPORT” IS NOT CHECKED OFF

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