MS-DEFCON 3: A slightly bumpy November

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ISSUE 20.48.1 • 2023-11-28 By Susan Bradley For most Windows 10 and 11 users, including me, there have been no side effects as a result of November’s
[See the full post at: MS-DEFCON 3: A slightly bumpy November]

Susan Bradley Patch Lady/Prudent patcher

Total of 23 users thanked author for this post. Here are last 20 listed.

jburk07, MHCLV941, MrToad28, opti1, Chris B, saturn2233, TechTango, OhNoBillS, WCHS, windbg, DLivesInTexas, CADesertRat, LH, Geo, John18, astro46, deuce120, lmacri, Kathy Stevens, abbodi86

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Kindly confirm the file system location for the Group Policy files — C:\Windows\PolicyDefinitions for the admx file and a language specific subfolder (en-us on my system) for the adml file.

FYI the link to the registry blocker file is broken at this writing.

4 users thanked author for this post.

Intrepid, kdock, weedacres, The Surfing Pensioner

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Yes, I too have tried to download the reg. file to block Copilot on Windows 10 22H2 without success, but I should really like it. I have located a reg. file to block Copilot on Windows 11 but for obvious reasons am reluctant to try this! Is the link given above –

https://www.askwoody.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/09/DisableWindowscopilot.reg

to download the reg. file for Windows 11 or for Windows 10? The reg. file itself doesn’t say.

Of course, they may be identical, but I need to be sure. I’ve never used Group Policy files before and anyway my laptop is Windows Home. Many thanks, TSP

 

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The correct WindowsCopilot registry blocker link: https://www.askwoody.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/09/DisableWindowscopilot.reg

And, too, the Group Policy setting should be Enabled (not Disabled)

4 users thanked author for this post.

Intrepid, WCHS, kdock, Debra Graham

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and is there an unblock copilot.reg to un-do the block later when desired?

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Yes there is an undo.

I’ll put them in a permanent place on the atie.

Susan Bradley Patch Lady/Prudent patcher

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Susan Bradley wrote:

I’ll put them in a permanent place on the atie.

What/where is “the atie”???

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Try “site” mistyped

1 user thanked author for this post.

WCHS

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Classic instance of keyboard dyslexia. I get it all the time.

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Keyboard dyslexia combined with a keyboard typo makes it much harder to intuit.

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WCHS

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No ‘For Developers’ in the Dutch version (yet)?

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I should really like the reg. file to block Copilot on Windows 10 22H2 but the link given in Susan’s article doesn’t work, as previously pointed out, and the link given elsewhere appears to be for a Windows 11 version. Of course, the identical reg. file may work on both Windows 11 and Windows 10, but I need to be sure. I’ve never used Group Policy files before and anyway my laptop is Windows Home. Many thanks, TSP

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Hi there.

Unless I amissing something, there is no Windows Copilot in my GPEDIT. And I am not seeing what these files are or how to use them. Please explain:

If you’d rather not be a participant in the AI revolution and want to wait for any bugs and issues to be resolved, remove Copilot from Windows (10 or 11) by downloading our Registry file to block Windows Copilot or by using our Group Policy files:

• admx
• adml

I am Win 10 and use several utilities to cusomize my start menu and file manager. I am hoping no issues. Nothing has ever stepped on them before. Using Classic Srtratr Menu and Classic Explorer and perhaps a touch of Ultimate Windows Tweaker. Will report if an issue. And if so, I hope it will show up right away.

Looking forward to the explanation on GPEDIT.

Thanks.

 

1 user thanked author for this post.

ejb

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You get the group policy once either the preview is installed on your machine, or next month when the update for Windows 10 includes it.

Susan Bradley Patch Lady/Prudent patcher

1 user thanked author for this post.

Coldheart9020

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Susan Bradley wrote:

You get the group policy once either the preview is installed on your machine, or next month when the update for Windows 10 includes it.

And by “next month” for Windows 10, do you mean the November patch or the December patch?

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The instructions in the newsletter on how to disable Windows Copilot in the Group Policy Editor seem to be backwards. According to the information in GPedit, the setting required to disable Copilot is “Enabled”—presumably because the entry is called “Turn off Copilot.”

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I am in the same boat because of the wording.  Did those nice people at MS cause even more confusion bu having it names “Turn off Windows Copilot” and then hitting disable in that so people would think they wanted to Enable that tab?

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This is nothing new, the GPedit settings have always been a giant pile of double-speak word salad.

To disable something you have to enable the setting that is named “disable (thing you want to disable).”

I guess they’re just trying to be incredibly explicit?  But it’s a mess to follow.

1 user thanked author for this post.

WCHS

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If Windows Copilot is installed while updating a Windows 10 PC can it be removed using Revo Uninstaller or a similar app?

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Apple is the world leader in planned obsolescence, all technologies, a role model for others to follow.

1 user thanked author for this post.

Cybertooth

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Under settings and to view update history. What is needing to be done to speed up the process for the updates. That I didn’t understand. Could someone please fill me in on what I should do under View update history??

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I have tried repeatedly to post this question when logged in but it will not upload, not even to await moderation, so I am posting as a guest. Is the reg. file to block Windows Copilot downloadable at:

https://www.askwoody.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/09/DisableWindowscopilot.reg

suitable fot installation on a Windows 10 22H2 PC, or is it only suitable for Windows 11?  With many thanks, The Surfing Pensioner

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Hello,

I started to follow the following procedure, but on my Windows 10 22H2 machine, there was no ‘Windows Copilot’ entry?

To use the local Group Policy editor to block Windows Copilot:

Search for “gpedit” and click the top result to open the Group Policy Editor;
Navigate to User Configuration | Administrative Templates | Windows Components | Windows Copilot;

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Just finished updating. Besides a 2 restart, I wait to hit the restart now till all updates are done installing, nothing out of the ordinary, well besides a 2023-10 Update for Windows 11 Version 22H2 for x64-based Systems (KB4023057). Normally updates don’t urk me, but that one does… Why an October update in November?

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Regarding blocking the installation of CoPilot, the link contained in the phrase” Registry file to block Windows Copilot” is broken. I get a notice Not Found
Sorry, but you are looking for something that is not here.

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Fixed.

Try it now.

Susan Bradley Patch Lady/Prudent patcher

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I’ve just tried it and it’s still not fixed. Sorry!

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Use your link in #2606165.

1 user thanked author for this post.

The Surfing Pensioner

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Thanks – I just needed to be sure this was the right reg. file for Windows 10 22H2, not just windows 11.

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Can  the .reg solution to block CoPilot be installed on Win 11 21H2, before CoPilot becomes available?

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Yes.

Susan Bradley Patch Lady/Prudent patcher

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The link has a typo afaik. It should read https://www.askwoody.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/09/DisableWindowscopilot.reg

 

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The .admx and .adml files are settings for Group Policy.
Group Policy is only available in Win10/11 Pro. They do not work in the Home Edition.
If you have Win10/11 Home, you will need to use the .reg solution to block CoPilot

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I’m confused by what you wrote. The newsletter says this:
“If you’d rather not be a participant in the AI revolution and want to wait for any bugs and issues to be resolved, remove Copilot from Windows (10 or 11) by downloading our Registry file to block Windows Copilot or by using our Group Policy files:

WindowsCopilot.admx
WindowsCopilot.adml

Note the above are for corporate patchers with a domain.”

You say they’re for anyone with Win 10 Pro. I have Win 10 pro but I’m not a corporate patcher and I don’t have my own domain.

How should I disable CoPilot?
(1) With the .reg file?
(2) With one of the Group Policy files? If so, which one?
(3) With both of the Group Policy files?
(4) Manually by going into Group Policy?

Thanks very much if you can clarify.

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If you have the Pro Edition, you can use one or both the Group Policy method and the Registry method. If you have the Home Edition, you can only use the Registry method.

If you use Group Policy, you need both the .admx and the .adml files. See #2606302 for instructions. Once you add the files, you have to open Group Policy and Enable the block.

If you use the Registry method, you have to download the .reg file and install it.

2 users thanked author for this post.

Perq, ejb

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[ejb]

For decades, I’ve been just one person on just one PC at home (but always using the PRO version of Windows). So I’ve always gone in and out of both Group Policy (“GP”) and .reg, doing whatever the instructions told me to do.

So when you give me the Pro-user’s choice of using one OR BOTH of the GP and .reg methods … I’ve never had a choice before.

What happens if I only use the .reg? What am I missing out on by not using the “GP” method? If I’m just a single person on a single PC, do “GP” and .reg accomplish the same thing?

Many thanks for your reply above, and even more thanks if you continue educating me!

• This reply was modified 1 year, 4 months ago by ejb. Reason: Clarify thanks

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The GP settings are for the Current User (under User Configuration not Computer Configuration).

The .reg file has settings for both HKCU (H_Key_Current_User) and HKLM (H_Key_Local_Machine), so it covers both the Current User and Local Machine=computer

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ejb

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Thanks very much!

PS – I remember the days when there were good, thick but very readable books about Windows that went into this kind of foundational stuff that taught some basic principles of how Windows was organized, so I could reason out these things for myself.

1 user thanked author for this post.

Cybertooth

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There’s a bit of a discrepancy between the registry entries the WindowsCopilot.admx can make and the ones the .reg file makes.

The WindowsCopilot.admx only sets the HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Policies\Microsoft\Windows\WindowsCopilot registry value, not the HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Policies\Microsoft\Windows\WindowsCopilot included in the .reg file.

This happens because line 16 in the WindowsCopilot.admx uses class=”User” which limits its effect User Configuration > Administrative Templates > … in Group Policy

Changing it to class=”Both” would also allow setting the HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE policy value using Group Policy via Computer Configuration > Administrative Templates > … just like the .reg file.

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Have you tried the “Both”? I couldn’t install it after I edited the .admx file.

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Yup!

I edited my version of WindowsCopilot.admx using notepad and changed class=”User” on line 16 to class=”Both” (note the B must be capitalized) and the option to “Turn off Windows Copilot” then appeared under both Computer Configuration and User Configuration.

And yes, I verified that enabling it under the Computer Configuration tree did set the appropriate registry value in HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE exactly like the .reg file.

PKCano wrote:

I couldn’t install it after I edited the .admx file.

Don’t understand?!?!

You don’t install .admx/adml files, you copy them to the appropriate locations in C:\Windows\PolicyDefinitions.

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ejb

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Capitalized “Both”.
Couldn’t copy it into the PolicyDefinition folder. As Admin.

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The owner of that folder is TrustedInstaller.

In order to copy new files into it you need to ensure the Administrators group has Modify and Full control access like this.

What I did to achieve this while still leaving TrustedInstaller as the owner was to “temporarily” change the owner to Administrators, select the Disable inheritance option, select convert inherited permissions to explicit permissions and, after it was done converting the permissions, I set the owner back to TrustedInstaller (NT Service\TrustedInstaller).

Still don’t really understand why some of the user groups have separate Modify permissions for just “This folder” and Full control for “Subfolders and files only” when the “This Folder, subfolders and files” setting can do both things with a single setting??

But hey… this is Microsoft we’re talking about.

1 user thanked author for this post.

PKCano

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Works!  I modified WindowsCopilot.admx per your posting (from “User” to “Both”) and it works.  Double checked via RegEdit and the settings are all there.  That said, if you don’t know what you are doing (with GP Edit) .. it’s better to download and use the .reg file.

2 users thanked author for this post.

ejb, opti1

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n0ads wrote:

There’s a bit of a discrepancy between the registry entries the WindowsCopilot.admx can make and the ones the .reg file makes.

Couldn’t the WindowsCopilot.admx file be rewritten so that there’s no discrepancy between the two?

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Experiment – can we cheat Mother Microsoft?

My Experiment:
I restored my Win11 VM on my laptop back to my backup of 10/4 Buiid 22621.2283, pre Copilot .admx.
I copied in the .admx file I had edited to “Both” and the original .adml file to the PolicyDefinitions. I checked to be sure that the “Both” was still there and  that there was a setting in Group Policy under “Windows Configuration.”

Then I ran the 2023-11 update to Build 22621.2715.

Guess what? The update overwrote the .admx file I had edited and it is back to Class = “User.”
It also removed the Group Policy setting under “Windows Configuration,” but left the setting under “User Configuration.” The Registry HKLM setting was not affected.

Seems it does no good to mess with Mother Microsoft.

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Ok, a simplified explanation of how the Group Policy Templates work and why you experienced what you did.

The .admx file contains the actual “policy settings” themselves while the .adml file only contains the “language-specific” text used for that specific policy (en-US = US English, en-GB = UK English, es-ES = Spain Spanish, es-MX = Mexico Spanish, etc, etc.)

FYI, those codes are referred to as LCID’s and Microsoft’s full list is available at 2.1.1907 Part 4 Section 7.6.2.39, LCID (Locale ID)

The class=”??” section in the admx file determines the “scope” the policy applies to and can be one of three different values:

Machine = it only shows under “Computer Configuration” in Group Policy and changes only apply to the HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE registry tree.

User = it only shows up under “User Configuration” in Group Policy and changes only apply to the HKEY_CURRENT_USER registry tree.

Both = it shows up under both sections in Group Policy and changes apply to both registry trees.

@PKCano

From what you experienced, it seems Microsoft intends for only individual users to be able to disable Windows Copilot rather than have it disabled on an entire PC (which doesn’t really make a lot of sense from an IT management perspective since, if we want to disable it via Group Policy, users shouldn’t be able to re-enable it by simply switching user accounts on their PC!)

BTW, for anyone interested a deeper explanation of admx/adml files, Microsoft’s Understanding ADMX policies page is a good place to start.

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Coldheart9020, WCHS

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n0ads wrote:

From what you experienced, it seems Microsoft intends for only individual users to be able to disable Windows Copilot and have {my bold} it disabled on the entire PC (which doesn’t really make a lot of sense from an IT management perspective since, if we want to disabled it, a user shouldn’t be able to re-enable it by simply switching to a different user account on their PC!)

I wondering if the “have” here should be “has”, i.e., Microsoft has it disabled on the entire PC. This seems to be the meaning here, not individual users have it disabled on the entire PC.

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My bad

It should have read “and not have it disabled on the entire PC”

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WCHS

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n0ads wrote:

It should have read “and not have it disabled on the entire PC

Thanks for editing it. It reads significantly differently now. It’s much clearer (and re-reminds me that the policy is “Turn off” and not “Turn on”).

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I was well aware of the use of the .admx and .adml – certainly not the first time I have dealt with them. Only the first time I have tried to edit them to produce different results. Evidently, it seems MS will overwrite changes.

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I updated with the following and it took 12 minutes from start to finish with 2 restarts.

2023-11 Cumulative Update for Windows 11 Version 22H2 for x64-based Systems (KB5032190)
2023-10 Update for Windows 11 Version 22H2 for x64-based Systems (KB4023057)- this was already installed 9/14/23
2023-11 Cumulative Update for .NET Framework 3.5 and 4.8.1 for Windows 11, version 22H2 for x64 (KB5032007)
Windows Malicious Software Removal Tool x64 – v5.119 (KB890830)

I cleaned up a few things and went back to pause updates and there was another update.
Windows Configuration Update (KB5030509)

I got the Copilot preview in the taskbar but I turned it off so it wasn’t staring at me. I’ll decide later if I want to remove it completely.

Windows 11 Pro
Version 23H2
OS build 22631.5189

3 users thanked author for this post.

jburk07, MrToad28, SteveIT

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Win 10, Pro.  With each months update it changes my  START to the new version.  But since I still like the WIN 7  START look  I just click on the power shell and it reverts back to  the WIN 7  START .

1 user thanked author for this post.

Cybertooth

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This is interesting! Are you using an alternative Start menu like Classic Shell, or does the original native Start menu still exist in the Windows code base? What Power Shell command(s) do you use to bring back the Win7 Start menu?

Keep Running Windows 7 Safely for Years to Come  
Make Windows 10 look and work like Windows 7

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I use the latest Openshell 4.4.191 for both W10 and 11, and now disable openshell prior to patching, as I have encountered strange start menu behaviour post monthly patching since October. Otherwise, openshell works well here.
Just another routine to add to the endless patching routines /sigh

Windows - commercial by definition and now function...

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Cybertooth

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I use http://www.classicshell.net    They give 3 choices  one on the right marked Windows 7

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Cybertooth

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I recall that Openshell  replaced Classic Menu when CM development stopped. OS contains CM and mods to Explorer

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In OpenShell (replaced Classic Menu) there remains a the original Windows Start Menu. Click on Start (Windows icon) and “Start Menu (Windows)” is near the top (see screen shot – above the Start Menu are recently used apps). Click on “Start Menu (Windows)” and the original WSM appears – see 2nd screen shot.

 

 

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I managed to get CoPilot turned off for my Win 11 Machine. I do not have pro on my desktop and unsure where the .reg file is to disable CoPilot from my Windows 10 desktop.

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https://www.askwoody.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/09/DisableWindowscopilot.reg

Use that registry key.

Susan Bradley Patch Lady/Prudent patcher

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fernlady wrote:

I’ll decide later if I want to remove it completely.

Copilot can’t be removed, only disabled.

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Alex5723 wrote:

Copilot can’t be removed, only disabled.

For now..where there’s a will, there’s a way!

Having typed that, ChrEdge is still nowhere to be seen on three W10 Pro devices here, and hasn’t been reintroduced since removal for over a year on W10 22H2.

Windows - commercial by definition and now function...

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That’s what I was wondering. I have it disabled on my laptop since I have win 11 pro. I just have win 10 home on my desktop. I see there is a solution posted by Susan. I’ll tackle that later today or tomorrow.

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More confused than I was.

I do not yet have CoPilot. Would like not to. I thought the GPEDIT was to prevent that. I prefer policy to registry. So is that correct? And if so, how does one use those two files for GPEDIT in Susan’s newsletter.

I KNOW what GPEDIT is. I have used it. I am PRO Windows 10. I am ADMIN. Only need to know how to prevent copilot and what those files are for.

1 user thanked author for this post.

ejb

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Put the .admx file in C:\Windows\PolicyDefinitions.
Put the .adml file in the en-US folder underneath.

5 users thanked author for this post.

jburk07, ejb, Mark, Chris B, opti1

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Thanks. Now, do I need do anything after that? And does this prevent a copilot installation?

 

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It does not prevent installation.
It only disables it.
And it cannot be uninstalled.

1 user thanked author for this post.

jburk07

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[ejb]

Me too. Following.
Edit: Following #2606299

• This reply was modified 1 year, 4 months ago by ejb. Reason: Clarify who I was following. Indentation is not informative with intervening threads

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You have to open Group Policy and “Enable” the block.

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If I understand this correctly, Windows 10 users will only get Copilot if they use Windows Update, and we don’t know when that will be for most. So if you don’t use Windows Update then there is nothing to worry about since Copilot simply won’t be installed and you don’t need to worry about doing anything with the registry to block it. Am I correct about that? Of course, this presupposes that Copilot will have its own update file that you will only be offered through Windows Update and that it will not be embedded in a regular monthly Cumulative Update.

I no longer use Windows Update. I just wait for the go-ahead here on AskWoody and then manually download and install the updates I need that are listed in the current Master Patch List. I have not had any problems doing it that way. But I would not care for Copilot to sneak in through a manually downloaded Cumulative Update.

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I use Win 10 Pro.  Never got last month’s update to work due to the missing files.  It worked this month, but talk about slow.  It took over an hour to download and install the main update, but at least it worked this month.

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“There does seem to be a smattering of problems with File Explorer and Start menus. We continue to examine this and will have a further report soon, but here’s some guidance. For Windows 11 22H2 and 23H2, keep KB5032190: <https://askwoody.us19.list-manage.com/track/click?u=589ef6d038a469ebdf98dc000&id=b79bedec77&e=0af8e79f38&gt; in mind. For Windows 10, look for KB5032189: <https://askwoody.us19.list-manage.com/track/click?u=589ef6d038a469ebdf98dc000&id=722113d26c&e=0af8e79f38&gt;. Though these problems are not widespread, anyone using third-party tools for file management or replacement start menus should make sure the tools are completely up to date. If there are still problems, uninstall these two updates.”

Now that you mention it, I noticed a while ago (but after Nov 14th) that I’d lost the entries in my old-style start menu, which I think is from a 3rd party.

I tried your guidance, but didn’t see anything in the link for Win 10 about interaction with 3rd party file explorer-related software.

I don’t think uninstalling the Nov 14th update will give me back all of my previous “previously used” start menu items, will it?

Also, why is it still so hard to find my list of restore points in Win 10? Searching for it doesn’t bring up anything useful. In fact, one of the top “hits” in Settings is “Recovery Options”, but none of them tell how to get back to an earlier restore point. And the top item one can carelessly click on is the most drastic – RESET THIS PC. Why would they put that one first??

The more I struggle with getting used to Win 10 (over 2 years now), the more I hate it and wish I could leave MS Windows behind, or at least stay with a stable version of Win 7 or even Win XP, the last 2 Windows versions that didn’t interfere with my daily tasks.

1 user thanked author for this post.

Cybertooth

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I’m confused over blocking Copilot for Windows 10.  Susan’s Alert letters says:

If you’d rather not be a participant in the AI revolution and want to wait for any bugs and issues to be resolved, remove Copilot from Windows (10 or 11) by downloading our Registry file to block Windows Copilot or by using our Group Policy files:

• WindowsCopilot.admx
• WindowsCopilot.adml

Note the above are for corporate patchers with a domain.

” For Corporate Patchers” with a domain??  What does that mean, not consumers?

Then:

Susan Bradley wrote:

You get the group policy once either the preview is installed on your machine, or next month when the update for Windows 10 includes it.

Does “next month” update mean the December CU, or November CU when installed next month?

Then:

PKCano wrote:

Put the .admx file in C:\Windows\PolicyDefinitions. Put the .adml file in the en-US folder underneath.

So Consumers can use the Group Policy files?  But their content will already be included in the November Cu? or December CU? or Neither one?

Then there’s:

“There’s a bit of a discrepancy between the registry entries the WindowsCopilot.admx can make and the ones the .reg file makes.”  at #2606244 above.

 

Windows 10 Pro x64 v22H2 and Windows 7 Pro SP1 x64 (RIP)

2 users thanked author for this post.

WCHS, Cybertooth

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Thanks for that post. At least I am not the only one that feels the posts and intructions need to be dumbed down one level so all can understand and more step by step complete so we do not have to ask each newsletter what is meant.

I’d appreciate it. As you can see from my posts, I am still confused. And questions only seem to get partially answered. Do not assume what I (we) know and do not please.

Thanks~

2 users thanked author for this post.

WCHS, Cybertooth

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Well my bad for being brain dead this week and flipping the instructions.

What do you need help with?

Susan Bradley Patch Lady/Prudent patcher

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I still belivee youhave said this will block copilot while PK has said it will not. Can we clarify that for sure?

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PKCano wrote:

It does not prevent installation. It only disables it. And it cannot be uninstalled.

I said it doesn’t block/prevent install.
It WILL block/disable CoPilot after it installs.

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I know you did and said so with typos But I was sure Susan said it did in the newsletter. Hence I want a definitive. If I have to find her quote I will. If I misinterpreted it, my bad. But if I am right you two do not agree.

Perhaps she uses the word “remove”, which it has also said cannot be uninstalled which is how I interpret “remove”. So point is PK, I don’t feel clear on what is going on.

If you are correct, should we even be installing these until copilot shows up? Especially if this is not preventative?

 

 

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Susan and I agree. It’s your interpretation that’s off.

Makes no difference before of after, the setings are there either way.

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Cool. Don’t you think it might have been nice to say that?

These files for GPEDIT and/or Registry keys will not prevent co-pilot from being installed but will disable it when it is. It makes no difference whether you install your choice of these now or wait until copilot is installed.

For those using GPEDIT in a PRO Windows computer, place these files here______ then enable the new settings under——————.

I would not have had confusion or questions if something similar was done. And it would have saved you folks a bunch of time in replying to confusion.

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WCHS

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https://www.askwoody.com/forums/topic/ms-defcon-3-a-slightly-bumpy-november/#post-2606244

https://www.askwoody.com/forums/topic/ms-defcon-3-a-slightly-bumpy-november/#post-2606302

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Just wish to say how much I personally appreciate all the help I get at Askwoody. Big thank you to everyone.

2 users thanked author for this post.

jburk07, opti1

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Group policy is for Windows 10 pro.  They won’t work on Home computers.  I recommend the registry key which is effective as is.

Susan Bradley Patch Lady/Prudent patcher

2 users thanked author for this post.

opti1, The Surfing Pensioner

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……and so simple to use!

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I will repeat my earlier question.

If Windows Copilot is installed while updating a Windows 10 PC can it be removed using Revo Uninstaller or a similar app?

1 user thanked author for this post.

MrToad28

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It’s not uninstallable.  It can be blocked.  But it’s not a separate item that can be removed.

Susan Bradley Patch Lady/Prudent patcher

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MrToad28, opti1, Kathy Stevens

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Kathy Stevens wrote:

If Windows Copilot is installed while updating a Windows 10 PC can it be removed using Revo Uninstaller or a similar app?

I have not yet found a way to uninstall it (still searching), but completely removing Edge and Bing renders it impotent.

Always create a fresh drive image before making system changes/Windows updates; you may need to start over!

We all have our own reasons for doing the things that we do with our systems; we don't need anyone's approval, and we don't all have to do the same things.

We were all once "Average Users".

Computer Specs

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https://community.intel.com/t5/Intel-NUCs/NUC8i7BEH-Thunderbolt-problem-with-Windows-11-Pro-KB5032190/m-p/1547384#M104542

Seeing new reports of USB C issues.

Susan Bradley Patch Lady/Prudent patcher

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Hee Haw I used the group policy editor and copilot is no where to be found.

I’m so proud of myself!

Windows 11 Pro
Version 23H2
OS build 22631.5189

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opti1

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W 10 Pro, Got MSRT, KB5032339 .net, KB5032189 cum 22H2, SSU 10.0.19041.3684.

1-The .NET update took over 2 1/2 hrs to install. It stopped at 44% and again at 75%.                 Update: That was on my AMD computer, on my intel computer .net installed in normal time. Not sure why the difference between computers.

2- I can find NO CoPilot on my system. I opened gpedit and there is no listing for it in user config>Admin Templates>Windows Components. So far it hasn’t shown up on either of my computers. I use Windows Update to update my computers.

Don't take yourself so seriously, no one else does
All W10 Pro at 22H2,(2 Desktops, 1 Laptop).

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opti1

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Window 10 Pro x64 22H2 on AMD Ryzen 7 3800X 8-Core Processor 3.90 GHz 16GB SSD+HD

Just ran Windows Update (took an hour + 1/2 hr for 500GB of image backups). No signs of CoPilot. I have Open Shell menu system and despite not updating that s/w haven’t found any real issues. Only small issue was initially the bottom Start/Programs entry was hidden by the task bar but then appeared a bit later.

 

 

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Can I assume that if I use the reg file, then at a later date care to try copilot, I change the dword from ending in 1 to ending in 0? Or something else?

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opti1

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Yes.
Same with changing the GP setting to Disabled.
If you use both Registry and GP settings, you should turn off both disablements.
See GP setting:

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And why would one want to use boththe reg and gpedit solutions?

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Choice. See #2606380

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opti1

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Yourlink says:

 

“The GP settings are for the Current User (under User Configuration not Computer Configuration).

The .reg file has settings for both HKCU (H_Key_Current_User) and HKLM (H_Key_Local_Machine), so it covers both the Current User and Local Machine=computer”

So that still does not explain why anyone would want to use BOTH. Seems to be an either or. “Choice” implies one or the other.  Let’s assume its my misunderstanding. Why would I want both?

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I have already done both, several weeks ago.
I have also uninstalled Edge and disabled Bing.
I have also uninstalled and deprovisioned all the UWP Apps that are uninstallable.
Does that explain where I’m coming form??

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You don’t have to.  I also wouldn’t manually add the ADMX/ADML files.  That group policy will be installed to Pro machines once the December patches get installed.  I only uploade ADMX and ADML for corporate patches using group policy in a domain.

Susan Bradley Patch Lady/Prudent patcher

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Susan, If I read you correctly, I should do nothing about copilot until next month Updates since I have W10 Pro 22H2 and nothing showed up for copilot in the November update.

Don't take yourself so seriously, no one else does
All W10 Pro at 22H2,(2 Desktops, 1 Laptop).

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CADesertRat wrote:

Susan, If I read you correctly, I should do nothing about copilot until next month Updates since I have W10 Pro 22H2 and nothing showed up for copilot in the November update.

After reading and re-reading and piecing and re-piecing all of the posts about Copilot here, this is the conclusion I come away with, too …

to which could be added :
if we have Win10/Pro: after the December update is installed, we can use the Group Editor to turn Copilot off for both the User Configuration and the Computer Configuration

if we don’t have Win10/Pro: we can run the .reg file to do the same thing that the GP edits do.

Unfortunately, there is more than enough confusion stemming from the Alert info about measures for turning off/disabling Copilot, especially for those who don’t have the background knowledge to fill in the lacunae.

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I recommend doing the registry key now so you don’t have to worry about it in December.  I’m a proactive person and don’t like to wait for the icons to show up.

Susan Bradley Patch Lady/Prudent patcher

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Ok, I did the reg file that was linked in the “latest” newsletter on 2 of my computers and still need to do it to my laptop so I should be good to go.

Will I still need to edit Group Policy in December? Thanks

Don't take yourself so seriously, no one else does
All W10 Pro at 22H2,(2 Desktops, 1 Laptop).

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jburk07, WCHS

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Oh, THAT’S what you meant by only for corporate users in a domain. Not that the files COULDN’T work, just that they were unnecessary if you can wait until December.

I remember when I used to be able to follow everything you wrote! Now so much of it deals with Windows for Workmobs and Groups and Teams and Corporations and Conglomerates and Governments and Interplanetary Federations. I wish MS could fork off (so to speak) a stable, simpler version of Windows for One on One. (One person on One machine.) But not with all the compromises of the Home version.

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That’s why I say use the registry key if you are a Home/Consumer user.

Susan Bradley Patch Lady/Prudent patcher

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I take “a Home/Consumer user” to include me, who
(1) uses Win 10 Pro in my home (lower case, i.e. my place of residence), AND
(2) is just myself, not part of any group (or Group, except the kind of Group that involves only one person on one PC on a home wifi network with no other PCs on it)

Geez, this is so confusing and hard to express precisely when MS has incorporated common English words into its product definitions!

Susan, not to beat this to death, but pow pow: when you say “Consumer”, I hope you mean it in the “lower case” sense, someone like me as described in item (2) above; I hope that you’re not referring to any MS product called “Consumer”!

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You, as a home (small case h) User, are “Consumer” (as opposed to Business).

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jburk07

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Add me to the list of folks that have been totally confused by the numerous Q and A about what a simple consumer (eg grandpa, grandma, etc) needs to do to disable Windows CoPilot. As per CADesertRat, I need do nothing (no reg updates, no ADMX/ADML adds) for install of the November updates for Windows 10.

Somebody please correct me if that is not correct.

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opti1

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Just use the registry key.  Ignore the ADMX, ADML files.

Susan Bradley Patch Lady/Prudent patcher

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Downloaded the reg key…now what? Using Win 10 Home.

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Put it on your Desktop. Double click on it. Give it peermission.

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45 minutes
4 reboots
5 restore points auto created
no changes to File Manager or Start menu
no copilot
USB C still works

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jburk07, MrToad28

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I wish I had seen this article a week ago. I thought I had updates paused for another several weeks, but one morning (last week) I found that I had been updated to (Win 11), build 22H2, and immediately saw that file explorer wasn’t responding properly. I couldn’t open many system folders – including my external drives where my backups are stored. File explorer would freeze or crash attempting to open these folders. I didn’t know about KB5032190, and I couldn’t restore a system backup because file explorer couldn’t access the backups. Installing 23H2 didn’t help. I eventually found a way to go back to 21H2 while trying to boot into safe mode,and immediately thereafter, the crisis passed. I was/am using a third-party tool for file management/replacement of my start menu. Now I need to keep in mind about what to do (based on your suggestions in the article) to prevent a recurrence when i eventually run out of options to pause updating to 22H2 or 23H2.
Thanks for the info … I though maybe it was just me/my system causing the problem. FWIW, this is the first time in almost 30 years that I have encountered an issue after installing updates … they used to be so much easier (prior to Win 10), to monitor update installs and to remove them if needed. Thanks, again.

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EricB wrote:

FYI the link to the registry blocker file is broken at this writing.

The online edition of the alert was corrected yesterday. A corrected version was emailed to Plus members a few moments ago.

I take full responsibility for this error and apologize for any inconvenience. On the other hand, my inbox exploded. It’s always gratifying to know our readership is not only intensely interested in our content but also sophisticated enough to spot our mistakes. Keeps us on our toes. We appreciate it.

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3 is the lucky number

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Will Fastie

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I’m a ‘consumer’ running vanilla Win 10 Pro 22H2 with default Start menu but with Directory Opus file manager in place of Windows file manager. I update via Windows Update but I hide and then unhide updates each month before updating based on Susan’s recommendations here.

After sipping through two full cups of coffee and wearing out the ‘Thanks’ link on both questions and responses as I worked my way down this long list of messages my takeaway for my situation (and others like me) is:

Go ahead and install the November updates, check to verify that Directory Opus (or other third party file manager) is still behaving, check to see if USB-C is still working. Come back here for more help if needed.

My still open questions are:

I’ll follow Susan’s advice to use the .reg file to disable CoPilot. Should I do that preemptively now or wait until after the December updates?

Given the apparently messy update situation for November does it make sense to skip the November updates altogether and just wait for the December updates? Those typically are pretty benign because of the holidays, right?

Thanks!

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LHiggins

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Kathy Stevens wrote:

I will repeat my earlier question.

If Windows Copilot is installed while updating a Windows 10 PC can it be removed using Revo Uninstaller or a similar app?

Windows CoPilot cannot be uninstalled with Revo Uninstaller but Dev Home can.

Mark

 

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I’m using MS Windows 10 Pro 22H2. I have not installed any of the November 2023
updates so far. On my desktop PC, using GPEDIT.MSC, there is no listing at all
for Copilot. And the search dialog box from the Start Menu does not list
anything about Copilot. Not sure if its relevant, but I am using Open-Shell
since I don’t like how the start menu looks like in normal Windows 10.

Since Windows Copilot is not in my Group Policy Editor, does that mean that in
Win10 it only appears if one installs one or more of the Nov-2023 system updates that are for Win10? Even if we hide the Nov-2023 windows update patches, using
WUSHOWHIDE.DIAGCAB, the December updates probably will still install Windows
Copilot on my Win10 PC. Personally, I don’t care about copilot whatsoever, and
don’t want it on my system permanently. I just HATE how Microsoft seems determined
to shove Copilot into our lives and our computers.

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For WIN10 – Copilot will not arrive to at least the Dec 2023 update.

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Does anyone know what happened to 2023-11 .NET 6.0.25 Security Update for x64 Client (KB5032883) for Windows 10 22H2? I had it in my Windows Update queue up until around 23rd November, after which time it has since disappeared and has not returned, and nor can be found in wushowhide. Was it pulled like before? I expected it to reappear within a few days, but almost a week now and it’s yet to return.

It’s not installed on my system either; the latest .NET security update I have installed is 6.0.24 which I installed with the October updates.

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Still shows up in the Microsoft Update Catalog with last updated as 11/14/2023 so it doesn’t appear to have been “official” pulled by Microsoft.

You could always manually download and install it instead of waiting to see if it reappears.

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Yeah, I checked the MS Update Catalog earlier and saw it was still available there – all 1.3GB of it. Kind of surprised at the size to be honest, but yeah I’ll download the .msu from there if it’s not back in the WU queue when I come to install the November updates.

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Coldheart9020 wrote:

Does anyone know what happened to 2023-11 .NET 6.0.25 Security Update for x64 Client (KB5032883) for Windows 10 22H2?

I hid my 2023-11 .NET 6.0.25 x64 Windows 10 22H2 (KB5032883) with WUSHOWHIDE when it came down the pike on Nov’s Patch Tuesday and it’s still there today.

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Why did you hide it? It does contain security fixes as well as non-security ones. Just curious

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I always hide the Patch Tuesday patches until the MS-DEFCON is 3+. That happened yesterday and I haven’t gotten around to unhiding them and installing them yet.

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abbodi86 wrote:

3 is the lucky number

Maybe, but I’m paid for 1.

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abbodi86

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I am a little confused.

Winver shows I am at the November build for Win 11 22H2 but I don’t see in the Windows Update/Update History applying that cumulative update. I went from Win 10 22H2 to Win 11 22H2 on the 25th of September and in the history it doesn’t show under Feature Updates. I do see KB4023057 on September 25th and again when I updated to this month on November 27th plus the Net Framework KB5032007.

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My start menu was broken when KB5032190 installed.  I had to uninstall it to get start working again.  For some reason, incontrol did not stop this update from installing.  It happened again at a later time and I had to uninstall it a second time.  Also the link for the registry change to block copilot does not seem to work.  Thanks.

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InControl does not block monthly updates!

See PKCano’s Nov 18 post-2603756.

 

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For me its been a bit rough, for the first time ever my Login Profile has been corrupted, not erased but just unusable. I have been able to return back to original but only after regedit reversals of profile .baks. I thought it was my uninstall of Commodo and or ASUS Armoury Crate that did this, but it seemed to be fine for a few days, now every other day it keeps reverting to default admin account or sometimes it creates a quick refresh install of windows but with minimal desktop content.
Then discovered a couple of years ago that a windows update (KB4532693) corrupted a few things including the profile setup, have there been any reports that the latest update has performed these corruptions ?
Thanks

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Jubbahey wrote:

For me its been a bit rough, for the first time ever my Login Profile has been corrupted, not erased but just unusable. I have been able to return back to original but only after regedit reversals of profile .baks. I thought it was my uninstall of Commodo and or ASUS Armoury Crate that did this, but it seemed to be fine for a few days, now every other day it keeps reverting to default admin account or sometimes it creates a quick refresh install of windows but with minimal desktop content.
Then discovered a couple of years ago that a windows update (KB4532693) corrupted a few things including the profile setup, have there been any reports that the latest update has performed these corruptions ?
Thanks

EDIT, sorted.

Both commands

DISM.exe /Online /Cleanup-image /Restorehealth

and then

sfc /scannow

reset my system files and now it all works, but then most of you knew that :))

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Cybertooth

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sheldon wrote:

For WIN10 – Copilot will not arrive to at least the Dec 2023 update.

no, it already arrived in one of the late November 2023 preview updates like the newly released KB5032278 update for Windows 10 22H2 (at least for some people but not yet for a wide audience)

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I’ve been informed by your many articles and I follow your patching information diligently for longer than I want to think about.

You made two oops in this one article and you published corrections immediately. There’s a first (and second) time for everything,

Your record for getting it right the first time is FAR better than Redmond’s and your record for correcting is immeasurably better than Redmind’s..

But next year, go a little easier on the turkey! 

 

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EP wrote:

it already arrived in one of the late November 2023 preview updates

November Preview updates will become December updates.

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MHCLV941 wrote:

But next year, go a little easier on the turkey!

Cut back on dinner to achieve AskWoody perfection? You raise a deep philosophical conundrum.

I’m going with food.

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jburk07, Cybertooth

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Fastie food!

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Will Fastie

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Well then at least go easy on the … (wait for it) … cookies.

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Will Fastie

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So I updated and it went mostly normal but after updating I get distributed com event 10010 errors in event log that say :

“The server Windows.Gaming.Gamebar.PresenceServer.Internal.PresenceWriter did not register with DCOM within the required timeout”

whenever I launch a game. Everything seems to work normally otherwise.

Seems to be an MS muddle of somekind: https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/all/getting-event-10010-errors-since-update-of/f6dcbbe6-6021-49e8-8424-06793a7c526f?page=1

Jim.

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COM errors are often ones you just have to ignore until they fix them.  As long as it doesn’t cause issues otherwise, MS considers it cosmetic.

Susan Bradley Patch Lady/Prudent patcher

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Ahh, I see. Thank  you very much.

Jim.

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Having followed the Group Policy Editor instructions to stop CoPilot by setting to Enabled, even after a Restart I can still use CoPilot and it still appears top right-hand corner of Edge.
I am new to this, so what have I done wrong ?

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Nothing.  There is copilot in the OS, there is copilot in Edge.  I’ll put up info on how to block all of it in a master KB post.  I’ll be working on it this weekend.

Susan Bradley Patch Lady/Prudent patcher

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ejb wrote:

… cookies.

Browser cookies? Absolutely – not nibbling.

Actual cookies? Let’s see, old, diabetic … yup, I’ll take one.

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Updated both my Windows 11 Pro 22H2 and Windows 10 Home 22H2 machines with November patches (except the latest, boring version of KB4023057) using WUMgr. No issues to report, installation did seem to take a bit longer than usual, specifically in the reboot stage, but we are talking about just a few extra minutes than usual, nothing enormous.

Still no sign of Copilot on the Windows 11 machine (not bad news): just wondering if that’s because EU policies continue to keep that thing from being unleashed on users this side of the Atlantic…

Also, I noticed the Windows 11 machine now has a bell-shaped icon for notifications on the taskbar: I don’t need it, but can’t find any obvious way to get rid of it. I have tried also to entirely disable notifications, but the bell icon stubbornly refuses to disappear even when resorting to that option. Does anyone have suggestions to get rid of the bell icon?

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Thanks for all the information so far. At this point, I think I understand that if I, a Windows 10 Home user, want to “disable” Copilot I have to do something with the registry. (Maybe before I update this week, maybe after, I’m not sure.)

However, I also know that if I do anything even slightly wrong with the registry, I can severely and possibly permanently make my computer inoperable.

Is there anything this Copilot does that would be worse than that? I’m just trying to decide whether it’s worth it. Thanks to anyone who can provide any guidance.

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Eric wrote:

Is there anything this Copilot does that would be worse than that?

No. Copilot doesn’t do anything you don’t ask it to do.

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I wouldn’t normally make any changes to my PC’s registry, but I do trust Susan’s little .reg files. And I had enough problems with the Copilot added to my Bing search bar a little while ago; every time I wanted to check something out quickly online, it tried desperately to engage me in meaningless philosophical conversation. It took me about a week to find out how to shut it up. There’s no way I want that AI on my computer, which is after all an extension of my brain (or it feels like it!).

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Eric wrote:

However, I also know that if I do anything even slightly wrong with the registry, I can severely and possibly permanently make my computer inoperable.

Not if you regularly create (very much recommended) image copies before any system changes.

You can also export the registry before committing any changes, and restore if needed.

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Do you have easy instructions/links for how to back up/restore registry in laymen’s terms? Must be rote to you! Local admin, local user accts only, Win 10 22H2.  Thank you in advance:)

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When they intend to release the optional update KB5032288 for public?

https://blogs.windows.com/windows-insider/2023/11/16/releasing-windows-11-builds-22621-2787-and-22631-2787-to-the-release-preview-channel/

[ADDED 12/1] New! This update starts the roll out of account-related notifications for Microsoft accounts on the Settings homepage. A Microsoft account connects Windows to your Microsoft apps.

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Published at last
now the users and entities have a “whole” week to test the new changes

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IMPORTANT Because of minimal operations during the Western holidays and the upcoming new year, there won’t be a non-security preview release for the month of December 2023.

December 4, 2023—KB5032288 (OS Builds 22621.2792 and 22631.2792) Preview

EXCEPT THIS ONE!

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You know that we know it’s delayed November Preview

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b

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Windows 11, version 23H2 known issues and notifications | Microsoft Learn

Not related to patching but side effects nonetheless

Some issues related to printer configurations are being observed on Windows devices which have access to the Microsoft Store. Microsoft is investigating this issue and coordinating with partners on a solution.

Symptoms can include the following:

Some Windows 10 and Windows11 devices are installing the HP Smart App.
Printers are renamed as HP printers regardless of their manufacturer. Most are being named as the HP LaserJet M101-M106 model. Printer icons might also be changed.
Double clicking on a printer displays the on-screen error “No tasks are available for this page”.
Note: Printing processes are not expected to be affected by this issue. It should be possible to queue printing jobs as usual, as well as other features such as copying or scanning. Printers on the device will continue to use the expected drivers for printer operations.

As the symptoms are related to the automatic installation of the HP Smart app, Windows devices which do not have access to the Microsoft Store are not expected to be affected by this issue.

Next steps: We are investigating this issue and will provide an update when more information is available. If you need support for this issue, go to https://support.microsoft.com/contactus, and select Windows.

Affected platforms:

Client: Windows 11, version 23H2; Windows 11, version 22H2; Windows 11, version 21H2; Windows 10, version 22H2; Windows 10, version 21H2; Windows 10, version 1809; Windows 10 Enterprise LTSC 2019; Windows 10 Enterprise LTSC 2016; Windows 10, version 1607; Windows 10 Enterprise 2015 LTSB
Server: Windows Server 2022; Windows Server, version 1809; Windows Server 2019; Windows Server 2016; Windows Server 2012 R2; Windows Server 2012

Susan Bradley Patch Lady/Prudent patcher

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Printer names and icons might be changed and HP Smart app automatically installs

..Note: Our investigations indicate that this issue is not caused by an HP update. In most cases, it should be possible to use the printer as expected, including queueing printing jobs, as well as other features such as copy, scan, or fax. Printers on the device will continue to use the expected drivers for printer operations. However, this issue might affect associations with other manufacturer-supplied printer apps used to extend basic printer capabilities. If this is the case, some or all of those extended functions might not work…

Next steps: We are investigating this issue and will provide an update when more information is available..

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Just noticed two apps that were not on one of our computers prior to the November update:

• Thumbnails Setup and
• Mixed Reality Portal

Never saw them before and no idea how they made it onto the computer.

The only change that we made to the system since the update was the installation of an old copy of TurboCAD Designer 19.

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Kathy Stevens wrote:

Just noticed two apps that were not on one of our computers prior to the November update…

Hi Kathy Stevens:

What is the OS, and was the computer re-imaged with a custom image after purchase?  The Mixed Reality Portal UWP (Microsoft Store) app was bundled with my Win 10 v22H2 OS and was installed on my computer when it shipped from the factory.  Mine is currently at version 2000.21051.1282.0, but I don’t need it and just haven’t bothered uninstalling it.

I can’t find an app or widget on my computer (or on the Microsoft Store) called Thumbnails Setup.
————
Dell Inspiron 5584 * 64-bit Win 10 Pro v22H2 build 19045.3693 * Firefox v120.0.1 * Microsoft Defender v4.18.23110.3-1.1.23110.2 * Malwarebytes Premium v4.6.6.294-1.0.2201 * Macrium Reflect Free v8.0.7690

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Imacri

The computer in question (an HP ENVY Desktop 795-0050) is currently running Windows 10 Pro 22H2, OS build 19045.3693, Windows Feature Experience Pack 1000.19053.1000.0.

It was last updated on ‎11/‎28/‎2023.

The workstation was originally setup on 2/26/2019 and apparently re-imaged on 2/‎7/‎2023.

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Thumbnails Setup is a part of TurboCAD.

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Kathy Stevens

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Thank you b

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Deo wrote:

Do you have easy instructions/links for how to back up/restore registry in laymen’s terms? Must be rote to you! Local admin, local user accts only, Win 10 22H2.  Thank you in advance:)

You just select Export in Regedit and restore by Import

You can export/import a single key

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