Microsoft’s Win10 beneficence continues next year with a strong-arm upgrade for Windows 7 and 8.1

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Resistance may not be futile, but it’s sure getting tougher.InfoWorld Woody on Windows
[See the full post at: Microsoft’s Win10 beneficence continues next year with a strong-arm upgrade for Windows 7 and 8.1 ]

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Woody –

Based on your story, MS initially will make the Win-10 upgrade nags an “Optional Update”, and then in a few months they will be re-labeled as “Recommended”. Since these things are coming out of the Windows Update chute, it seems to me they should have a specific KB number and, hopefully, should be relatively easy to spot, though Myerson’s post does not address those points.

Do you know if they will have a KB number and some kind of descriptive label? Will you be able to warn us when you switch to Defcon 4 or 5 which of the patches/updates can safely be skipped if we don’t want to infect our machines with Win-10 nagware?

Thanks for all you do to help so many people survive (if not entirely enjoy) the MS experience.

Roger

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Words fail. Unbelievable.

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This is pushing me more and more toward Apple. Woody, I can see the need for detailed instructions in a later AskWoody column on how to avoid making a mistake and initiating the Win 10 upgrade process and then exactly how to roll back to Win 7 if necessary. I don’t know what “Settings” Microsoft is talking about. You can bet their instructions on how to roll back won’t be clear and designed to keep you on Win 10.

iPhone 13, 2019 iMac(SSD)

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@Roger –

It’s likely that there will be a KB number, or some other easily identified marking.

I hope.

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@Woody

Interesting to note that the latest GWX Control Panel software allows a setting so the OS cannot be upgraded. I wonder if we are going to see the battle of the OS Upgrade between GWX and W10?

I can’t even imagine what a rollback from W10 to W7 or W8.1 would be like. What a nightmare.

I also wonder if MSFT realizes they are going to be chasing Windows users to Apple? I guess they forgot how they once dominated internet browsers and became complacent about that and now…..

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Orwellian doubletalk.

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You can almost smell the desperation. I will make a modest prediction; many of the current players in this mess will not be around in a few years when the consumer backlash causes this all to unravel like a Hong Kong suit. Time will tell but it is clear that MS has become angry with its users and the struggle to acquire users more to their liking has fully commenced. Counter arguments are more than welcome!

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I don’t understand the focus on a KB number. If the past is any indicator of the future, the KB will say “Install this update to resolve issues in Windows.”

Resistance isn’t futile, its just exhausting.

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So let’s see. I’ve already had to stop allowing Microsoft to install any update to Win 7 automatically. I’ve had to stop installing virtually any Optional update. In light of this new policy, I’ll have to stop installing virtually any Recommended update. I’ll remember to not agree to any new EULA for any reason, since Microsoft is unlikely to upgrade me to Win 10 without my agreeing to that. At what point might they cross some line and face a class-action lawsuit from Win 7 owners for so degrading the Win 7 experience as to make it impossible to use Win 7 until the sunset date??

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Roger makes some good points. Was there a KB number on the ‘mistake’ that showed up as an optional update last time around?

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I installed the latest edition of Ubuntu recently in dual boot mode and find for almost everything I do thru my web browsers Firefox and Chrome the experience is identical.

The LibreOffice suite is familiar since I have been using it for years on Windows I haven’t installed Office on one of my PC’s since 2007.

I was abit worried that the UFEI on my Win 8.1 HP Laptop would cause problems but the install was fast and easy to do.

Of course Linux has recommended updates as well and I noticed I applied them without hesitation.

Maybe we are conditioned to suspect MS of all corporate maleficence complete with NSA back-doors and that makes all of Windows Update suspect.

Oh wait MS thru ample examples has proven they do not know how to run Windows Update in a responsible manner! Nor do they attach any importance to their customers PC experience or use of their machines.

With Linux I can always choose when and what is installed. No impact to my PC time with stealth downloads and theft of my ISP data service or spending hours figuring out why my PC is no longer “reliable” because of some new “feature update”

Its my Laptop not Microsoft’s.

My concerns here involve MY use of my PC’s not worries about privacy or snooping. I simply do not TRUST Microsoft to get it right in the foreseeable future.

Win8.1 is the last MS OS I will ever use.

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Oh dear.

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This doesn’t make me very happy!!! UGH! @Paul If i was rich i would buy an Apple Compture.

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@Leo –

I don’t recall one, but it was very clearly marked.

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I’m with @T. I have no idea where to start. When this begins, please keep us updated with the KB number each month so I can hide it. I might just stop updating my Win7 laptop completely. I believe that Win7 is the best operating system Microsoft ever developed. Everyone I know with Win8, 8.1 and 10 absolutely HATES it. I will continue to use by Win7 laptop until it dies a final death (I use a Chromebook for most of my web browsing; I use the laptop when I need to print or use an Office program), and then MAYBE I will purchase a Win10 machine, but only if the problems have been fixed. If not, I will bite the bullet and spend $2,000 for an Apple.

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So, I’ve not installed an update since the first week in October (or perhaps even earlier–I can’t remember anymore). So far, I’ve been successful in keeping the Windows 10 updates off my 8.1 (originally 8) system. Can I at least trust the updates that start with the word “Security”? I have several of those waiting for my action whether to install or not. Also, I have no desire to upgrade to 10, as my upgrade to 8.1 was such a terrible experience, I’d almost rather be hacked than ever go through that again. Will Microsoft back off once a year has passed and I can be left in peace with my “antiquated” computer?

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Sorry, Woody, for two comments in a row, but I’m so annoyed with this whole Windows 10 debacle that I just sent an e-mail to one of the PR addresses at Microsoft. Here’s what I wrote:
To Whom It May Concern:
I am writing to you since the Microsoft website makes it virtually impossible to direct my complaint to your CEO. I doubt you will be considerate enough to forward this e-mail, so my correspondence to you will have to suffice.

As a longtime Microsoft customer, I am absolutely furious with your latest involuntary “upgrade” to Windows 10. I bought my laptop with Windows 8 loaded on it, and while I hated it, I got used to it. Then one of your stupid nagging upgrades eventually talked me into upgrading to 8.1. Boy, was that a mistake! It cost me about $150 to have a computer expert untangle the problems that created on my system. I will not make that mistake again. I don’t want Windows 10 and have been forced to turn automatic updates off to avoid accidentally receiving it.

I have worked with both the Microsoft and the Apple systems but have always found that Microsoft was a better system for writers, which is why I made that choice with my present laptop. However, since your corporate arrogance has led you down the path of forced upgrades whether your customers want them or not, I can assure you that my next purchase will be from Apple. Congratulations, your paranoia about losing market share has come to pass, and you did it to yourself.

Please do not respond with platitudes about how wonderful Windows 10 is or how much more secure it will make my operating system because no amount of PR will convince me. You have permanently lost a customer, and I’m sure I’m not the only one.

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By its tortiuous behavior with the Windows 10 upgrade, Microsoft has become the single greatest threat to the security and integrity of the computers on my home network and the information they contain. Windows Update has been and will remain disabled on all of my computers.

In the modern business paradigm, I am accustomed to being treated with indifference and scorn. But this level of abuse is still painfully surprising.

Is there any hope of relief other than walking away from Microsoft?

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@Teresa –

Hang on. I’m still sorting through the patches, seeing where they’re going.

To answer your question, though, yes it looks like the security bulletins are still security related. Whether you can trust specific security patches is an age-old question.

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I have a neighbor who thinks that the best thing Microsoft has ever done was the XBox 360.
He is leaning towards the XBox One if the price comes down to what he feels is an afforable price.
He has no desire to buy the Kinect accessory, He thinks that is a piece of junk!
The latest Foroza Auto Racing game is the only thing pushing him towards getting a XBox One.
He wishes Microsoft would offer that game to their XBox 360 customers.

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It’s not me I worry about, I can deal. It’s the general public. Most of the people I deal with have no clue as to what’s going on, will have no clue how to stop the upgrade or how to roll back when they get it. They will just wake up one morning with something alien on their computer – an operating system that I feel is still in Beta, that causes BSODs and hangups with forced updates, has inferior apps in the store that don’t work, and sends all their information to MSFT because they have no idea they can have a local ID only or how to turn off most/some of the data mining. MSFT has committed to support Win7 until 2020 and Win8 until 2023. Forcing Win10 on people is NOT support.

I can only hope there is a mass exodus from MSFT to Apple and Linux. I can only hope they do enough damage with their coercive tactics that the public will rise up and take legal action. But I suspect it will be too late for many, particularly the older generation, who will have no clue how to extricate themselves.

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I found a screen shot online of the ‘Upgrade to Windows 10’ update that was offered as a pre-selected optional update and I can confirm that it did not have a KB number.

I have my own script installed that prevents the known W10 KBs from installing (I know you recommend the GWX Control panel – it too does the check). Right now, Without the KB being identified, the update is still blocked.

As these updates were associated with the Reserve GWX campaign, which MS says has now ended, what are we to assume about KB3035583 – has this KB number been retired?

I do not like the decision that MS has made to remove the KB number on the ‘upgrade to W10’ update. It is obviously a deliberate attempt to prevent it from being identified.

Vigilance is still required or maybe even more so over the next few months as the W10 optional update MAY come in with a brand new KB#. I would not have even considered such a devious move in the past, but now I just expect it.

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Woody,

As I followed the comments it appears that some folks think that Apple might be the way to go in order to avoid Microsoft’s heavy handed update policies. However, everything that I have read seems to indicate that Apple’s policies regarding hardware/software updates and support are even more draconian than Microsoft’s. In fact, the “industry practices” excuse for Microsoft’s recent change in direction points to Apple and others as justification.

Can you (or anyone else) clarify the situation regarding Apple vs. Microsoft update/support policies?

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@Eric –

I’m no expert on Apple support and updating.

Anybody here care to chime in?

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@Leo –

Helluva good question, and one that I hope to nail down before I give the green light on October’s updates.

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Woody,
My experience with Apple is solely from the iPhone world, however, I can say I was never confronted with a “silent download” of an updated iOS version. Every OS update I ever completed was initiated by me after the OS version was released by Apple. The only examples of silent download examples that come to mind for me are the way Firefox and the Chrome browsers update. Maybe it is just me but I am really getting tired of MS trying to “wordsmith” these activities to cover the basic truth that much of what is going on is pretty crappy and not what one would hope for or expect from a company of this size and stature.

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In two adjoining paragraphs, Terry Myerson says [1] We will soon be publishing Windows 10 as an “Optional Update” in Windows Update”, and [2] Early next year, we expect to be re-categorizing Windows 10 as a “Recommended Update”.

This is far less clear than it might seem, since Microsoft appears to use the terms “optional” and “recommended” interchangeably in Windows Update. If you look at the Windows Update settings screen, you’ll notice that there’s an option labeled “Give me recommended updates the same way I receive important updates”. The word “optional” does not appear there. However, on the main WU page, there are two categories of updates: “optional” and “important”. So, on one screen, the contrast is between “optional and “recommended”, whereas on the other, the contrast is between “important” and “recommended”. Does this mean that “optional” and “recommended are the same thing?

It would appear so, since I have found that NOT checking the “Give me recommended updates the same way I receive important updates” box will prevent optional updates from being installed (again, note the conflation of “important” and “optional”).

Although we can safely take Myerson’s words as a promise to broaden the assault on Windows 7 & 8 users, M$’s vehicle for accomplishing that is certainly not clarified by the muddled distinction between “optional” and “recommended”.

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I have four Macs. I have been using them for the last four-five years (starting with Lion, Mountain Lion, Maverics, Yosemite and now El Capitan) with Parallels Virtual Machines running Windows XP, 7, 8.1 and 10 Tech Preview. I have never had a FORCED upgrade, it’s always been a CHOICE.

I find that I can run most of the same software I run in Windows – Office, Firefox, Thunderbird, VLC Player, Kindle, CCleaner, and many others. I use the Windows VMs for things I cannot use OS X (MeetControl software to run run Daktronics equipment for diving scoreing, and a few legacy apps that don’t even run on Win7 and 8.1)

I was a die-hard MS fan from the time of MS DOS until Win8. I support the Windows community around me – family, friends, neighbors, my club members, and anyone who has my phone number. Although I keep my finger in the pie, I’ve found an alternative that I trust.

Get a Mac. You’ll never go back!

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@Marty –

This is very, very confusing.

At this point, if you have “Give me recommended updates the same way I receive important updates” is checked – true for almost everybody, when Microsoft releases a “recommended” patch — even if it’s “optional” (!) — the checkbox in Windows Update is checked. And that means it’ll be installed automatically unless you specifically uncheck to box, whenever updates get installed.

Clear as mud, right?

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@Frank –

Yep, my experiences with iOS are basically the same, except the updated versions are the numbered ones (e.g., 9.1). You have control over those – take ’em, leave ’em, or wait for others to howl. That’s why I haven’t upgraded my iPhone or iPads to 9.1 yet – and why I’m concerned that, as of yesterday, I can’t go back from 9.1 to 9.0.2. See http://www.macrumors.com/2015/10/29/apple-stops-signing-ios-9-0-2/

I’m not so sure if I’ve ever had control over my iOS security updates. Not even sure what an iOS security update looks like.

And I don’t know much at all about OS X updates.

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@DeWayne, re. Ubuntu privacy:

Ubuntu Linux does spy on us, in a way, at least as of 2012:
http://www.neowin.net/news/richard-stallman-accuses-ubuntu-of-spying-on-users

Current Ubuntu Privacy Policy Statement:
http://www.ubuntu.com/legal/terms-and-policies/privacy-policy

It isn’t just Microsoft, and fleeing to Apple or Linux will not necessarily solve the privacy problem.

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@Woody

That’s why I leave “Give me recommended updates the same way I receive important updates” UNchecked. But on the main WU screen, there’s no such thing as a “recommended” update; the distinction there is between “important” and “optional”. So unchecking the “recommended” box prevents “optional” updates from being pre-checked.

Mud is clearer than that.

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@Marty –

That would make perfect sense, BUT….

I have a machine with “Give me recommended updates…” unchecked that fell victim to the madness a couple of weeks ago where the optional update was checked. Microsoft says, “Ooops.” I say I don’t trust ’em.

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@Woody,

I don’t trust ’em either. Unchecking the “Give me recommended updates…” box is (IMHO) the best route to follow, and it usually works, but it’s no guarantee. Gotta watch it like a hawk.

At this point, I don’t expects M$ to make even imperfect sense.

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It’s mindboggling that both users and media flayed Windows 8 for two easily fixable problems (no Start button and no way to boot to desktop mode), yet they largely ignore this thoroughly repugnant and despicable Microsoft thuggery and bullying.
The media, apart from Woody and a few others seem to have been drugged or paid off to ignore such glaringly obvious deplorable behaviour.

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RC yes I noticed the prompt during install “..you want to allow Ubuntu to gather anonymous information?” and assumed it was exactly the same thing as MS sending telemetry or whatever I do on the pc to Canonical.

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