Microsoft’s new anti-Chromebook ads show that you really need to consider buying a Chromebook

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I’ve been saying it for years now. Unless you have an overarching need for a specific Windows application, you should consider getting a Chromebook. T
[See the full post at: Microsoft’s new anti-Chromebook ads show that you really need to consider buying a Chromebook]

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Cascadian, JohnW

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OK … wow! Those marketing videos from MS were weird.  Desperation?

Once upon a time all computing power resided in the mainframe, and all that users had were dumb terminals connected to local controllers, that were networked back to the mainframe.  The mainframe ran the apps that gave the user all the functionality that they needed.  Corporate IT was in control of everything.

Then along came the client-server revolution.  Different groups within a large business could now set up their own feudal kingdoms, hire their own developers, buy servers, and tell corporate IT to kiss their a**.

This new lawlessness allowed business IT security standards and costs to spiral out of control.

But now the idea of cloud computing, and the “thin client” concept are appealing once again.  Come full circle, have we?

Corporate IT can now seize the day, and lock down security and control costs better, by issuing Chromebooks to all team members.  The potential power and flexibility of cloud computing makes a “thick client”, such as a traditional PC seem archaic.

Microsoft must be trembling …

Windows 10 Pro 22H2

1 user thanked author for this post.

DeWayne12

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An industry that that flouts science and fundamentals without any soundness and operates like the fashion industry is bound to move in circles. I mean, is there any progress in fashion? The same styles are being recycled over and over again.

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Elly, wdburt1, HiFlyer, Cybertooth

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HA HA
revealing isn’t it?
nowadays one dont even have to look closer… its just …. there… just look

back to fishing for better dreams

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Reality Is That Which, When You Stop Believing In It, Doesn’t Go Away!
-Philip K. Dick

question is what do you see when you look?

do you see –
what will become of M$…. and its millions of trusty ‘users’?
grp w? the better alt? the new frontier? the safer path? the designated future? the clouds?
how long will you not see it coming???

or do you see –
the compnay the system and the agenda is a stronghold for another thousand years?
“We are the Borg. Lower your shields and surrender your ships. We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own. Your culture will adapt to service us. Resistance is futile.”
— The Borg, Star Trek: First Contact

reality…. check-mate?!?

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That is an extremely good analogy!

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Interesting that you mention fashion.  The same fashions that were popular in the mainframe era have recently reemerged.  I’m seeing paisley again at work – mostly on dresses, but it’s there.  The dress styles are also similar to the late 1960s.

So when I start seeing women wear business suits again, we’ll know that the days of the Cloud are numbered, and it’s time to dust off my client-server books, except there will be a new name for it then.  I’m proposing Local Area Cloud in advance.

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I would qualify and say that all its problems notwithstanding, NT, XP and Win7 were acceptable. Techies had Unix and Linux, those who wanted to operate computers like toothbrushes–without any knowledge–had Apple to dump unjustifiable prices on. The average user who was neither had Windows. It carried me for decades since after DOS, warts and all.

The real problem is that monopoly leads to greed, incompetence and self destruction (ask IBM) and perfection does not earn money. When they lost the notion of what an OS is and started messing with it in Win10, the writing was on the wall. They went into it for tablets and phones, and dropped the phones–that should tell you something about their strategic thinking and competence.

A core reason going into devices, the cloud and Win monetization is because they realized it. And all the praise of their devices aside, dk if it’ll carry them. As usual the mgmt will manipulate things to make huge short term gains, maximize their own wealth and won’t care what happens to customers and the company. Ask Marissa Mayer — who needs success when you can get filthy rich from failing.

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DC, Elly, Bill C., DeWayne12, Cybertooth

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“When they lost the notion of what an OS is and started messing with it in Win10, the writing was on the wall.”

For me, the writing on the wall appeared when Windows 8 was released. Windows 10 just altered the writing from plain text to bold.

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DC, Bill C., thymej, MrJimPhelps, windows7wasthebest

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In fact, you could say it was even earlier: Vista. But in both cases you could overcome the nonsense: I skipped Vista altogether and underneath 8 was 7, so you could get rid of the UI.

But Win10 is different: Cortana, Edge, Store, Apps, spying, forced updates, forced features and changes every month/6 months, instability, bricking. Different kind of fish.

They saw at some point they’re losing control and are trying to regain it by force. This is usually how a monopolist tries to address the loss of monopoly because that’s about the only thing he knows by the time of the loss. They lost the understanding of the customer long ago and are clueless.

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DC, Elly, Karlston, lurks about

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Losing sight of the customers’ needs and wants is a cardinal business sin. Personally I have a very limited use for a Chromebook but for many it is more than adequate. And for many more, they can use any OS that is installed. About the only group who needs Windows are businesses who have Windows only applications they rely on. Home users very rarely need a specific Windows only application.

Phones have opened the eyes of many that they really do not need Windows so they are less susceptible to MS’ typical FUD tactics. What MS needs to address is why would anyone want Windows and what does it truly bring to the table. The current ads seem to indicate that there really is nothing Windows brings to the table that will get users attention.

Modern OSes are mature products. Any new ‘features’ are mostly useless bloat that users really do not need or want. So the question is not releasing a new version but somehow monetizing current customers. With XP still being widely used, MS could offer a $25-50/year plan to anyone for updates; an idea they seem deaf to.

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Elly

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>About the only group who needs Windows are businesses who have Windows only applications they rely on.

You need to remember that the majority of business users who have been using Windows for decades are vested not only in apps, but also in familiarity with how to do things, where everything is, how to use everything, customization, configuration, optimization, freedom from bloatware and useless c..p, STABILITY and the look and feel that they perfected over the years.

There must be VERY good reasons to give that up and Win10 removes much of that for no discernible reason. That is the kiss of death for an OS.

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Hugo, Elly, jelson

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It could be a death knell. If the user were still presented with a fully available choice to stay with the familiar rather than advance.

But with the combined forces of ‘mature’ technology being so familiar it is now vulnerable; Microsoft’s own activities designed to evict users to new technology; and all competitive options continuing to require a very steep learning curve; then the choices become distasteful and the unhappy but viable option remains: Win10

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These videos feel desperate. Sadly I play a lot of games so I’m really reliant on Steam. But Microsoft Windows has competition now. Microsoft can’t seem to accept that their monopoly is coming to an end and the traditional PC is also dying out. Linux, Macs, ChromeOS, are providing good competition to Windows. Also with phones and tablets, it gives people less reason to use a PC. In a few years I feel Windows will be used in the enterprise world and gaming world but everything else will be on a phone, tablet, Mac, Chrome Book, or Linux.

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My older daughter is getting a Chromebook from the school this fall (starting 7th grade).
We personally own 2 Lenovo Ideapad 100S netbooks (Win10 Home x86) which are nice, but ultimately are very slow and basically completely filled on HD and RAM space/usage.

IOW, MS has already lost the classroom, and (if I knew 2 years ago what I know now) we’d have Chromebooks, not Ideapads.

In the enterprise, we don’t buy Chromebooks, we buy laptops or ultrabooks. Anything MS has to say in that regard will always fall on deaf ears. We have our ways, they work, we’re sticking to them. Upgrading to Win10 anytime soon, corporate-wide, is not currently a part of our plans. I don’t know what we’ll do, but it’s going to take a lot of changes and there will be a lot of teeth gnashing before we deploy Win10 to everyone at home office.

Thurrott’s article comes off as more of an MS advertisement than an unbiased piece, which is quite a change from what I usually see from Paul. (Unless my sarcasm meter is not working this morning.)

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Sarcasm meter is off today, “It kind of makes me wonder why anyone would consider Chrome OS. Cough.” – emphasis mine. Paul slyly indicates the ads are pure BS and total failures. I think anyone who is honest (Woody, Paul, and many others) will say consumers and organizations have many reasonable, readily available options that are not Windows based. The issue then becomes the specific user needs as to which option is the best. Personally, I am not currently interested in owning a Chromebook as they do not fit my needs well right now. In the future, it may be reasonable option; like most I like reasonable options.

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I really don’t pay much attention to the often repeated statement “for each task, the proper tools”. It provides no useful info.

In this particular case, unless it is stated for what 10S is better than other options, it means nothing. And I have yet to hear such a statement.

Chromebooks are are simple and cheap for users who want to know and understand nothing about computers. What does MS improve on that? They don’t say that because they don’t have what to say.

It seems to me that they are trying to emulate everybody  and doing a poor job of it. And it’s all because they don’t add value.

They want to create a “new category” for phones. How much you wanna bet that whatever they come up with, it’s not gonna satisfy user needs that Apple and Samsung don’t provide? It’ll probably be slick, even well designed, but without functionality that is truly needed.

 

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HiFlyer

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Yesterday, I had a request from that about 50 yo woman who bought her first computer a year ago and has found “Google disappeared” during the AU update. Now she said every time she starts her computer, it tells her something with Creative Update where she needs to either say later or answer plenty of questions about privacy she doesn’t understand. She is scared because it doesn’t go away and she wonders if she has been hacked. She has no idea what this update is, why she has to answer those scary questions she doesn’t understand and if it will break something.

I always find it interesting to hear about the real world experience of a diversity of users. For her, computers are really stressful and they keep changing all the time and she doesn’t understand what is going on. That kind of user is not served well at all by WaaSNSS (Windows as a Sweet New Slick Suit) every 4 months.

Windows is more secure than Chrome “because Windows 10 is the most secure Windows ever”? Hmmm… Yeah, just like plastified straw armor is more secure than plate armor because it is the most secure straw armor. At least gets your logic right, marketers.

Windows is still the best OS for me, but increasingly not for a lot of people.

 

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Karlston

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I think that may be why the “user experience” team at Apple is winning with casual users.

Traditional Windows PCs are not “appliances”.  They are great for computer enthusiasts, hobbyists, geeks, experts, and business IT.  There is quite a learning curve to become self sufficient with these devices.

But for everyone else, it needs to be kept as simple as possible.  I think that is why smartphones and tablets are really eating into PC sales.

I also think that the Chromebook offers a good alternative for the casual user.  I would put it into the appliance category, but for the keyboard and mouse type user, rather than the touchscreen, download every app from the app store user.

The Chromebook would be more useful for using cloud office productivity apps, web browsing, and email.  Very low maintenance and little user knowledge required to keep it running.  Secure?  Yup!

Windows 10 Pro 22H2

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AlexEiffel, Bill C.

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Apple may win with casual users, but the users spit a great deal of money for the luxury.

Somebody who has used computers for an extended time needs much more control and the lack of it can drive you nuts.

Windows has a GUI but you can go underneath it for control when you need it. No such lack with Apple — its casual users wouldn’t know how even if it were possible.

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JohnW wrote:

The Chromebook would be more useful for using cloud office productivity apps, web browsing, and email. Very low maintenance and little user knowledge required to keep it running. Secure? Yup!

Easy? Yup! Secure? Nope! Google is watching everything you do, continually gathering every bit of information they can and assembling a very accurate and detailed dossier (profile) on you. They then “monetize” (sell) that information. That’s basically their entire business model. I suppose you could call it “secure” if you don’t mind being continually spied on.

Group "L" (Linux Mint)
with Windows 10 running in a remote session on my file server

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Elly, Bill C.

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Hey Dude!  I clearly said “secure”, and not “private”.   Those words have different connotations.  Data security and personal privacy are two different matters, requiring individual approaches.

And it is possible to use a Chromebook without ever signing on to a Google account, or using a Google website.  Just use it as a perpetual “Guest” and the profile is reset every time you power it on.

I know this because I set one up for my Dad to use for online banking, and he was worried about spyware …

 

Windows 10 Pro 22H2

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Who isn’t? Everyone seems to be at it whether it’s through the operating system or the website or the software. It just seems to be a question of degree or admission of the fact that separates them.

I’m genuinely interested. For those of us who use laptops because we need to but don’t have any wizarding skills in the area of tech, what would the sages recommend we use in order to minimise our exposure to snoops?

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anonymous wrote:

what would the sages recommend we use in order to minimise our exposure to snoops?

1. Use Linux.

2. Avoid Google like the plague, using it only if you must.

3. Avoid free email. With free email (or anything else that is free), the app you are using is the bait, and you are the product. They earn money by scanning, packaging, and selling your personal information as you use their app.

4. Don’t click on a link or open an attachment, unless you are sure about it.

5. Minimize the amount of links that you have to other thing — the less links there are, the less detailed of a profile can be built on you. For example, if you are in Facebook, and you want to share a story that is posted, rather than clicking Share, create a new post and put the web address for the story. This prevents a link from being created between you and whoever posted the story originally.

6. Don’t live your life on your smartphone (banking, shopping, Facebook, etc.). If you do, there are two dangers to your privacy:
* If they can identify the phone, they can then gather your surfing history and build a dossier on you.
* If your phone is compromised, they will have everything.

There are other steps you can take. Basically, minimize your exposure, and use common sense when you are surfing the web.

Group "L" (Linux Mint)
with Windows 10 running in a remote session on my file server

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AlexEiffel, David F, Elly, Bill C.

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The PRIMARY reason I bought an iPhone was the customer service in the Apple Store. They actually knew what they were selling, listened to your needs and were honest about it. That is rare online or in a major “Phone Store” where selling the newest case and screen protector were king.

I would get a Mac, but the Price : Performance : Hardware ratios are not favorable. Their screens are incredible, though.

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AlexEiffel

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Isn’t choice Great! The pro’s and cons of rival hardware/software.

Reminds me of the dilema I had with 3DFX, nvidia, PowerVR, ATI and Matrox graphics cards days of old..just to run games but, for me the allure of visual candy swayed me to the most expensive, 3DFX Voodoo II PCI, only to find that the games were still the same and would run on all the cards, albeit not so shiny on some.

I tend to be on the side of Woody, who states that it is all dependant on what Programs/Applications you need to use, personally, the rest is all bells and whistles.

Windows - commercial by definition and now function...

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That’s a rather trivial statement that obscures more than enlightens.

The point is that the three platforms are not equivalent to all users–just choose the apps. They require different levels of knowledge and applications.

 

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Just recently had a conversation that included many of the highlights seen here. It started from me making the same suggestion to a social user, that Woody started this thread with.

My only warning for that user was to emphasize the frequent contact required for a cloud-based application suite. Excellent backups and sharing features that require large, reliable data connection. Unlimited contract with infrequent and short lived outages? Great. Metered connection with spotty coverage? Not so good, frustration levels make blood-pressure rise.

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If it were practical, I would not put ANYTHING in the cloud. Nothing and nobody can be trusted not to exploit it, protect it, and guarantee continuous access to it. And if you paid any attention, there are examples of bait and switch: they get you in for free and then start charging you or raise their rates.

I need to keep 2 laptops in perfect and constant sync. I could do it locally, but I looked into it and it’s more of a hassle than the free cloud solution I use at the cost of the above concerns. But the minute they start playing games with it, or one of the concerns materializes, goodbye.

That’s why I also take frequent local backups.

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I use Dropbox to sync files between systems.  If I feel that the data needs protection, I just encrypt it before copying to a Dropbox sync folder.  Done.

Windows 10 Pro 22H2

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I helped a friend join a Dropbox group once. She was logged into Windows with basic, not admin, rights. During the process, Dropbox asked for the admin username and password. I wondered why, if all she was doing was sharing a cloud folder with the group. It occurred to me that if any group member knew what he was doing, he could easily take over her computer with admin rights.

By the way, although she was joining a specific group, Dropbox looked in her hard drive, found her pictures, and shared them to the Dropbox folder. I never told it to do that, it did that on its own.

I no longer have any trust in Dropbox.

Group "L" (Linux Mint)
with Windows 10 running in a remote session on my file server

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JohnW

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I never share with my Dropbox.  It is 100% private.  I just use it to move files between my own systems.  It is also handy if you save your current daily project files to a sync folder, they are automatically backed up to the cloud, with every save you make.

If you configure your folders correctly, it will only sync the folders that you explicitly specified. RTM.

For sharing files, I would probably use Google Drive or MS OneDrive, if that were ever necessary.

Windows 10 Pro 22H2

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Dropbox is not private.  All data can and is monitored by them and their “third-parties”.

From DropBox Terms –

” These and other features may require our systems to access, store and scan Your Stuff. You give us permission to do those things, and this permission extends to our affiliates and trusted third parties we work with.”

If you want zero-knowledge cloud storage there is SpiderOak.

I use SyncThing and my own NAS.

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I said it was “private” in the context of “not shared”, or otherwise used for collaboration with other users.

I am aware of the possibility of any cloud provider accessing the contents of cloud storage, or the service getting hacked.  I HIGHLY recommend encrypting any files that you want to lock down.  Easily done with 7zip before placing the file in a sync folder.

Or better yet, check out Boxcryptor.  Free account for basic version.
End-to-end encryption “Made in Germany” for Dropbox & Co.
https://www.boxcryptor.com/en/

 

Windows 10 Pro 22H2

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HiFlyer

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JohnW wrote:

I said it was “private” in the context of “not shared”, or otherwise used for collaboration with other users. I am aware of the possibility of any cloud provider accessing the contents of cloud storage, or the service getting hacked. I HIGHLY recommend encrypting any files that you want to lock down. Easily done with 7zip before placing the file in a sync folder. Or better yet, check out Boxcryptor. Free account for basic version. End-to-end encryption “Made in Germany” for Dropbox & Co. https://www.boxcryptor.com/en/

Check this offer for cloud service (servers only in Germany with stricter EU privacy laws).  Strato is daughter firm of Telekom.  Use Chrome browser if translation needed.  1 Terabyte.  Special offer only till 10 July.

https://www.strato.de/online-speicher/leser-aktion/

 

 

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That is one of the main reasons that I fully support Avira as my go-to antivirus solution.

In addition to their consistently high scores in 3rd party tests, they are based in Germany. 

Gotta trust your AV company as much as your OS company, right???

Windows 10 Pro 22H2

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HiFlyer

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And, fp and JohnW, You both have excellent reasons for, and great implementations in, your systems. Huge fan of current backups, even if mine are not always current. Having my stuff where I can get it without having to knock on my neighbors door is why I go grocery shopping. I treat my computer with the same regard.

But that social person I spoke with, and the hypothetical person in Woody’s thread starter, are not like you. Their simpler needs are met by the Alphabet Inc. way of doing things. And if they can powerwash their troubles away without bugging me to fix their broken system, while sitting there all embarrassed because they need help, blessings be on them.

If I don’t get as many free dinners, I’ll deal with it. Maybe hike more in my new found free time.

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Well, yes, but it should be obvious that when you give up knowledge and understanding you open yourself to all sorts of problems, not the least of which high costs and the risk of being exploited in various ways.

That’s because it disables your judgment ability and when you suspend judgment you’re fodder. Ignorance may be bliss but only because you’re not aware of the risks.

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fp, I am told I use analogies and metaphors too often, but I am honestly trying to communicate to you an idea.

I did not need to glue together my own pencil to do homework in elementary school. In high school, I could change the typewriter ribbon and properly insert a page, but did not need to forge the typeset. If I had to rebuild a carburetor twice a year to keep my car, I probably would not drive. There are many people that just want to use technology, without spending the time and attention that you do. All of these items are very simple things, to the people who know how to do them.

And those people make life easier for the rest of us.

To your point, yes, I am at the mercy of my hired mechanic and trust him to repair my car when needed. That fact is obvious to me, high cost and the risk of exploitation included. I really hope my mechanic does not think of me as fodder. If I were to overhear him say such a thing, I would have a new mechanic. (my mechanic happens to be a man, his boss is a woman, promoted from within after years in the trade)

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You’re entitled to trust all you want. I don’t. Not for a moment. There is absolutely nothing to suggest it’s a good idea and everything to prove that it’s not.

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HiFlyer

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lurks about wrote:

<snip …> About the only group who needs Windows are businesses who have Windows only applications they rely on. Home users very rarely need a specific Windows only application.

Were that that were true. Many, many home owners get beyond Facebook, browsing and email. Photographers, hobby and pro, need editing and processing programs, stargazers need software, GPS uses beyond car use need the mapping software. Managing your home economy needs accounting software or at least a spreadsheet. Plus many of us want privacy doing it and do NOT want the cloud. Unfortunately Windows applications are often the most developed and refined. Try finding a Canon SLR interface for Linux – it is Windows and Mac. I can find GPS programs on Linux, but not easy to use or ready to go without compiling.

Additionally many like desktops with large monitors without touchscreen fingerprints and full key keyboards and a multi-button mouse.

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HiFlyer, AlexEiffel, Elly

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Hey, I feel your pain.  I am also a photography hobbyist, and that also ties me into a few Adobe products that I have invested in, as well a few others, and some camera vendor supplied stuff.

We clearly don’t fall into the casual home user camp.  I think that the term “enthusiast” or “serious hobbyist” is more to the point.  That pretty much rules out Linux or Chromebooks for the applications we depend on.

If privacy is a concern, my recommendation would be to spread your info around and not let it gather all in one place.

Use a Linux or “other” OS for your online activities, personal accounts, email, etc.

Just use Windows for the applications and activities that require Windows.  Keep it separate and the data miners should have a h*lluva time piecing it all together! 

Windows 10 Pro 22H2

2 users thanked author for this post.

HiFlyer, Cascadian

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I’m coming to the conclusion that the only way you can hide yourself these days is to get some sort of random web surfing app, which would generate a lot of meaningless, patternless web surfing, so that it would be impossible to generate an accurate profile of you.

Group "L" (Linux Mint)
with Windows 10 running in a remote session on my file server

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HiFlyer

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If you really want to “hide”, you can always use a VPN that allows anonymous membership and payment methods.  Then avoid logging in to any sites with any of your credentials and avoid social networks.  Only browse in private mode.  Etc.  https://thatoneprivacysite.net/vpn-section/

Of course that is extreme, and unnecessary in my opinion, to completely hide (unless you really have something to hide from).

But there are also many other measures that you can establish in your ordinary routine to reduce the info that you freely give away to marketers.  For example, use a public DNS, not your ISP DNS servers.  Use HTTPS as much as possible.  Use a local Windows PC account, not a Microsoft account to login to your PC.  Don’t stay logged into social networks (they can share your tracks).  Use browser extensions to block ads and trackers.  Delete your cache and cookies daily.  There’s probably a few other things like browser fingerprinting, but that may not be a big deal.  Check out browserleaks.com

Most of the personally identifiable information that marketers can collect is that which you choose to share.  Just don’t, or minimize it to only companies that you trust.  Ha!  Good luck with that last one, right?

Windows 10 Pro 22H2

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HiFlyer

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I use AdNauseum on Firefox, with no adverse effects, other than getting more diverse advertising.

However, AdNauseum was banned by Google from the Chrome store… I guess it works too well

https://adnauseam.io/free-adnauseam.html

Non-techy Win 10 Pro and Linux Mint experimenter

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HiFlyer

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For those who are unfamiliar with the AdNauseum Extension, it is not an ad blocker. While it does do this, it also clicks on *every ad* which it finds. This is clearly an attempt to generate false click-throughs, and to disrupt Google Ad Sense and other ways advertisers get paid for click-throughs. In short, they got banned (legitimately) for click fraud.

No amount of obfuscating about “fighting malware” can overcome the basic fact that this extension is fraudulent in its intent and its execution.

-- rc primak

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So… as someone who doesn’t want to be profiled and tracked and sold like some commodity… AdNauseum is doing exactly what I want it to. I don’t mind advertising to pay for a site. I mind being the thing marketed, and my personal data should not be for sale, especially since there is no “legitimate” way to not be tracked. Since I don’t want to be bought and sold, and the whole system is imposed without my consent, disrupting it is a legitimate way to make my disent and noncompliance known. If tracking required consent, I would have a way out. The Do Not Track option gives a false sense of not being tracked, and isn’t effective. It is as stupid as selecting an option to have non-targeted advertising while the data continues to be collected. I do want to disrupt advertisers getting paid for my clicks, and I do want to make my browsing habits obtuse. No advertiser or Google Adsense is entitled to see what I am doing, let alone collect the information and use it, so it isn’t fraudulent in intent. It is doing exactly what it says, and what I want it to, making the information that is collected useless and valueless. The fact that anyone or any corporation thinks there is an entitlement to my personal info, or that I have to provide accurate information for advertising abuse, is the problem in the first place. Hurrah click-fraud!!!! I’m all for it.

More than willing to hear other points of view… or even other ways of keeping my info private… but this is a perfect solution for me, someone who doesn’t want to be absorbed into the corporate marketing machine. Actually, I think it could be improved by only clicking a randomly generated percentage of ads on a particular page, so it won’t be so easily screened out by the tracking companies. Just saying…

Non-techy Win 10 Pro and Linux Mint experimenter

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HiFlyer

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A few suggestions:  uBlock Origin, Privacy Badger, and Disconnect. 

uBlock Origin – An efficient blocker: easy on memory and CPU footprint, and yet can load and enforce thousands more filters than other popular blockers out there.  https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/ublock-origin/

Privacy Badger – Blocks spying ads and invisible trackers.  A Project of the Electronic Frontier Foundation   https://www.eff.org/privacybadger

Disconnect – Visualize and block the otherwise invisible websites that track your search and browsing history.

Disconnect was named the best privacy tool by the New York Times (2016), Innovation Award winner for Best Privacy and Security software at South by Southwest (2015), listed as one of the 100 best innovations of the year by Popular Science and one of the 20 best Chrome extensions by Lifehacker.  https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/disconnect/

Windows 10 Pro 22H2

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AlexEiffel, HiFlyer

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Elly,

I don’t know much about that program, but from what RC Primak said, I am not sure it does what you need. I think I understand why you use it, the frustration of being tracked without consent and the desire to mess up with marketers data. However, if the extension only clicks on every link on a page and then stops there, to me, it just signals your presence to more places where they track you. Yes, you might receive a more diverse set of ads, but I don’t think it would prevent trackers from tracking where you really click anyway and the path you end up following. I’m anot sure the obfuscation is very effective. Plus, you also indirectly contribute (when not detected) to add clicks to bad ads that you “encourage” this way. Marketers can sell their ads based on a number of clicks that you didn’t do and it raises the value of their work.

For these reasons, I would favor other means, maybe those suggested by JohnW, to avoid being tracked in the first place and to prevent bad ads from showing.

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JohnW

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Comparing apples to apples/oranges to oranges for Education (K-12) we have the Chromebook versus the $189 Windows 10 S systems. Chromebooks are off the shelf whereas the Windows 10 S systems are not for individual sale – they arrive on new devices issued to IT administrators in education.

The Microsoft ad is targeting the buyers in Ed, not the potential users (the kids). When September 2017 rolls around we should have some market numbers from the Education Sector on W10S versus the 2017 Chromebooks.

For businesses choosing a Chromebook or Windows Pro system, the Microsoft ad may have more influence. Businesses today are very concerned about privacy, security and recoverability. Google and Microsoft are equally derelict at privacy and both are reasonably conscientious with security. The Cloud is still very cloudy, so recoverability remains an issue (it comes down to service agreements and costs). As for the device, I think it would be easier to recover from a Chromebook disaster that a W10 system disaster.

I’d be very interested in seeing Chromebook market numbers for businesses (especially y/e 2019).

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HiFlyer

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Let’s be honest.   If it weren’t for the large base of applications to draw from, Windows would have been dead a decade ago.

No one really WANTS a Windows-based OS — you want the programs that run on it.   [edit]   As more things move to cloud-based designs, these programs become less and less important.

This is also where Apple’s been missing the boat.  Apple should be pushing (read:paying) to get those Windows-only programs ported over to OS X.  Apple also needs to understand that selling expensive, limited hardware will generate sales, but won’t kill MS or rule the workplace.

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lurks about

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Between moving to the cloud and that OSes and applications are mature products software sales will soft. Mature applications means there is also little need to update the hardware when a new version comes out. The version is probably not really worth the effort or money to most users. Moving to the cloud means the underlying OS is much less relevant as the key bit is the browser. With Chrome and Firefox combined market share it means public facing websites should be standards compliant.

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That was the idea behind netbooks, which failed miserably.

The cloud is nothing but a return to the mainframe concept of computing: centralized control. Except in a much worse version: at least with mainframes, the control was within the organization by technically knowledgeable people and it did not include individual users.

The cloud version is controlled by an uncontrolled oligopoly of tech corps and now includes the individual users without sufficient technical knowledge to defend themselves.

It may look attractive, but it won’t end well.

 

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HiFlyer, radosuaf

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anonymous wrote:

No one really WANTS a Windows-based OS — you want the programs that run on it.

The function of the OS is to enable those apps to work. That is why it must be stable and transparent. So yes, you don’t want a specific OS per se, but apps are written FOR a particular OS, so if you’re partial to those apps, you’re also partial to the OS they were written for.

And partiality to a OS is not limited to the apps. It’s also to familiarity, which almost always has historical roots. After using Windows for decades, having to switch to iOS or Linux for NO REASON just because MS wants you do is unjustifiable.

OS vendors should distinguish between new users and long-term users and have more respect for the latter which kept them in business.

 

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What business applications? What school? In the not so distance future, AI will do most of the work. I am not sure about the timeline of other professions, but I bet within five years most of the tax accountants will be gone. Eventually, all you need is your phone.

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I doubt it.

But if it does happen, you cannot imagine the problems that AI will generate. You will be nostalgic about these days.

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Can you foresee a time when AI will not only do your taxes for you, but will also reach into your bank account and pay your taxes? Imagine a bug or virus in that program.

Before we ever get to that point, they will need to greatly simplify the tax laws.

Group "L" (Linux Mint)
with Windows 10 running in a remote session on my file server

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I too have recommended tablets and Chromebooks as better options for many home users. Especially now since Microsoft has tried to make Windows 10 its own personal billboard. No doubt with 10s windows Microsoft is working on its own closed system. Chromebooks aren’t for everyone especially if you like iTunes or use a Windows based app that Chrome OS doesn’t have. But Microsoft is having less and less success making the point you need Windows.

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HiFlyer, AlanH

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Plus you can use Microsoft Office Online for free from any browser now.

Free Office Online apps
Create, share, and collaborate from anywhere.

All you need is a desktop browser. Select a tile below to get started. It’s free.

https://products.office.com/en-us/office-online/documents-spreadsheets-presentations-office-online

Windows 10 Pro 22H2

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You don’t need to accept Google’s snooping either…

I personally wholeheartedly agree that a Chromebook is all most people need, the only thing missing from most Chromebooks is a big enough hard drive, which of course is all about assimilating the user into the Google-plex.

For Christmas last year I gave my septuagenarian parents a 14″ Acer Chromebook on which I installed Gallium OS (a version of Xubuntu customized for the Chromebook hardware.)  It’s been an incredibly stable, functional, easy to use platform for them, so much that their old Win 7 laptop gathers dust.  With the addition of a USB portable HDD, it’s all the computer they need.

My parents are actually quite power users too, not just net surfing and shopping.  My dad does a lot with spreadsheets, and they both are very into digital photography.  But Moore’s law has finally given us low-speed, low-power processors which can do about any job anyone but a weather forecaster needs to do.

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AlanH, HiFlyer, MrJimPhelps

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I take it most or all of the Ubuntu software will work on it?

Group "L" (Linux Mint)
with Windows 10 running in a remote session on my file server

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HiFlyer

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Why not just load Ubuntu on a regular laptop?  I don’t see any advantage to buying a Chromebook, and then paving over the ChromeOS.

Windows 10 Pro 22H2

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HiFlyer

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Yes, the Ubuntu repositories are available, and everything I’ve tried works.

Why not install Ubuntu on a regular laptop?  The Chromebook was $200, substantially less than most Windows laptops with an 8+ hour battery and a good 1080p screen.

I see that recently there are some Windows notebooks with similar specs but with a larger hard drive for a bit more $$$ .  When I bought the machine for my parents eight months ago I didn’t see any Windows machines which fit the bill, but maybe I didn’t look hard enough.

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HiFlyer

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The best laptops under $200 of 2017

http://laptops.reviewed.com/best-right-now/best-laptops-under-200

The only thing about the Windows laptops here, is that the battery life will not be as long as the Chromebooks.  But for the other specs, this HP 14″ looks pretty good.

https://www.amazon.com/HP-14-inch-E2-7110-Windows-14-an013nr/dp/B01F4ZG68A?psc=1&SubscriptionId=AKIAJIYMMIJN7RU7KVJQ&tag=reviewedcom03-20&linkCode=xm2&camp=2025&creative=165953&creativeASIN=B01F4ZG68A

Windows 10 Pro 22H2

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HiFlyer

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Here is a good overview of Chromebook choices:

Should I Buy a Chromebook? Buying Guide and Advice

https://www.laptopmag.com/articles/chromebook-buying-advice

And if the mini-laptop form factor isn’t for you, consider the Chromebox at 5×5″.  Internally, it functions like a Chromebook, but if you have no need to be mobile, you can set up a full size monitor, keyboard, and mouse.

https://www.asus.com/us/Chrome-Devices/Chromebox/

It has a similar form factor to a Mac Mini,or an Intel NUC.  I set one up for my Dad a couple years ago to replace an end-of-life Mac Mini.  It was a simple drop in replacement, with the addition of a DVI/HDMI adapter (monitor had been connected to the Mac via DVI).

 

Windows 10 Pro 22H2

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HiFlyer

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Chromebook keyboard is different than Windows. Parent have any problems with that?

Nope.  The only difference of any consequence within Xubuntu/GalliumOS is there’s no “Delete” key, which can take a bit of getting used to.  Other than that, the function keys are multimedia and browser functions (“back”, audio volume, screen brightness) which are usually more useful than “F” keys with no standard function.  I haven’t found any software which is highly compromised by the lack of F keys.  Libre Office may require a bit more use of the touchpad, but it just hasn’t been a problem.  I used the computer myself for a couple weeks’ testing before gifting it to my parents.

As to the processor not being fast enough for local programs, I’d have to disagree.  Web apps have gotten preposterously bloated and resource intensive.  Judging by the amount the fan runs on my 2013 vintage i5 ultrabook when just using e-mail and other web content vs Libre Office and other standard local content, I’d say the web apps require a faster processor for snappy responsiveness than the local apps.   It’s only heavy duty tasks like photo de-noising or video transcoding where the local apps out-pull the web apps, and those tasks I expect to see a progress bar and wait for completion.

In Linux I think applications are generally better optimized for use on slower hardware than on Windows.  That’s my general impression after making the switch any way.

I’ve now built several desktop machines using low-power hardware similar to the Chromebooks, and they are all very usable as general purpose computers.  My current desktop is a Celeron J3455 with an 8w TDP.  It runs Linux Mint on twin 1080p monitors very responsively.  Prior to that I had a J1900 which ran Win 8.1 very responsively before I dumped Windows.  Even the dual core version (J1800, I think) which is now a NAS box worked fine for desktop tasks under Ubuntu in my testing.  I just don’t think processor power is determintivie of usability in very many contexts these days.  Quantity of RAM and HDD speed (SSD!) are much more likely to be the limiting factors.

Taking the philosophy to extremes, I’ve even tried a Raspberry Pi 3 as a desktop machine.  It’s too slow, but interestingly it seems like the SD card as a hard drive is more limiting than the processor, though the processor is clearly too slow also.

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I doubt it.  The CPU in the HP is a quad core AMD, not a lite Celeron.  Plus the Chrome OS is only available pre-installed on a Chromebook/box.  You probably could install a popular Linux distro such as Ubuntu, though.

The advantage here with a laptop is that you get more performance, which is important if you want to run locally installed apps.

The Chromebook hardware was optimized for using a web browser, and low energy consumption for longer battery life.  There are trade-offs and compromises with both approaches. 

Windows 10 Pro 22H2

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HiFlyer

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