Microsoft Critical Updates

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Not sure if this is the right lounge, but I’m hoping for some further clarification about MS security patches. Woody’s Office Watch, 8-35 and 8-36 talk about patches. Dutifully, I went to the sites to follow his advice. On the Windows Update site, the message said there were a selection of updates to install, but none of them seemed to match Woody’s numbers.

I was asked to decide to load:
1. Critical updates and Service packs (6)
2. Windows XP (10)
3. Driver Updates (1)

From Woody’s articles, I knew to say “no” to the driver install, but did go ahead with #1 (it’s currently downloading – slowly!). What do I do about #2? I could make no sense out of the list of patches – none of them matched Woody’s numbers and none seemed relevant to our small business. Would these be the “Optional Patches” Woody mentioned and advised us to stay clear of?

Oh, at the Office site, I was told just to dowload SP-1, which I did. Is that it for Office XP (purchased 3 weeks ago)?

Can anyone here help clear this up for me (I am totally new to this whole patches thing!). I don’t want to mess up our brand new system! (Windows and Office XP).

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Hi Linda,

From the masters latest Windows Watch

“I do NOT recommend that you install the optional updates (I’ll shoot Windows Update if it tries to stick Internet Explorer 6 on my Windows 98 system again). I do NOT recommend that you install driver updates (there’s a good explanation of why in “Windows XP Timesaving Techniques For Dummies”). I KNOW that at least one update – MS03-032 – doesn’t fix what it’s supposed to. But I DO think that now’s the time to get your system patched with all those security updates, through MS03-038/ 826292 / 826293.”

So JUST the Critical Updates please. The one’s you are downloading are all you want the others are optional (at your peril). Hope this helps clear the murky waters of MS updates a bit.

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Thank you! Yes, it does clear things up. The Woody quote you included was from the WOW I was trying to follow; I’d just got confused about terms (i.e., the Web site didn’t use the word “optional”). Now I know that I will stop right here, having installed the Critical Updates and Service Pack.

By the way, after the download finished a while ago, just before the computer restarted, a message came up – too quickly for me to read all of it – to say something about all the updates were not installed. Do you know anything about this – or where I might find out exactly what that page did say?

Thanks again for clearing up my confusion!

Linda

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Good Morning Linda,
I must confess to a less than trusting attitude when it come to Microsoft’s updates and patches (if you can’t find the time to do something right the first time, when are you going to find the time to fix it right in the future?????), and have only installed the updates that Woody assured us were OK. So far, so good. I had not, as of last night, downloaded and installed the latest critical updates that got Woody’s stamp of approval. I am in the process of doing that now and am using my kids machine for the next couple hours while they download. But now I’m gettin off point. Your question about the little blurb that flashed before your eyes about updates not being installed, was most likely referring to the “optional” updates that you chose not to install. Open Windows Explorer and navigate to the C:/Windows folder. All your installed updates should be listed there at the beginning before any other folders. Yes? No?? Maybe??

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Good morning to you! I share your frustration with having to patch brand new software and your feeling that what guarantee do we have that a patch will work when the original doesn’t! Such, however, is life – or, at least, Microsoft life!

Thanks for the reply. I feel less panicky now about the non-downloaded. I did look for the patches as you suggested, but could find nothing listed before the folders in C:Windows. Even checked inside a couple of likely sounding folders (AddIns and AppPatch), but their Properties boxes said they were all created years ago.

Is there another place they could be? Or another way I can check to ensure they are in here after all the time devoted to their acquisition!!?

Really appreciate your help so far and any more you can offer.

Linda

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I think at this point you shoud go back to Window Update and let them check your system for installed updates. It may be that your DL and install failed.

I just finished the process and was away from my desk for awhile during the DL phase. Upon returning Zone Alarm was asking if I wanted to allow a Microsoft Update setup program to access the internet. This was after the DL and during the install phase of the process. I said yes and it took another 10-15 minutes for thi install to complete. At that time I was told the install was successful and that I had to restart my computer to complete the process. I did and all “appears” to be OK at this point. So follow our fearless leaders instructions “to get at Windows Update: Click Start | Windows Update or Start | All Programs | Windows Update.” and see what you’ve got. Then let us know what the gremlins in Redmond have done for you lately.

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I think at this point you shoud go back to Window Update and let them check your system for installed updates. It may be that your DL and install failed.

I just finished the process and was away from my desk for awhile during the DL phase. Upon returning Zone Alarm was asking if I wanted to allow a Microsoft Update setup program to access the internet. This was after the DL and during the install phase of the process. I said yes and it took another 10-15 minutes for thi install to complete. At that time I was told the install was successful and that I had to restart my computer to complete the process. I did and all “appears” to be OK at this point. So follow our fearless leaders instructions “to get at Windows Update: Click Start | Windows Update or Start | All Programs | Windows Update.” and see what you’ve got. Then let us know what the gremlins in Redmond have done for you lately.

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Linda,
If you don’t have AIDA32, get it from this link. Besides telling you just what Windows updates are installed correctly on your machine, it will also tell you everything else about it but were afraid to ask. ( as the old saying goes )

It gives you a VERY detailed account of exactly what else is installed and types of hardware, software versions, etc, etc. Very good utility to have available and it’s .

Bob

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Linda,
If you don’t have AIDA32, get it from this link. Besides telling you just what Windows updates are installed correctly on your machine, it will also tell you everything else about it but were afraid to ask. ( as the old saying goes )

It gives you a VERY detailed account of exactly what else is installed and types of hardware, software versions, etc, etc. Very good utility to have available and it’s .

Bob

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Almost forgot, another good one is Belarc Advisor Also

BOb

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Almost forgot, another good one is Belarc Advisor Also

BOb

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Good morning to you! I share your frustration with having to patch brand new software and your feeling that what guarantee do we have that a patch will work when the original doesn’t! Such, however, is life – or, at least, Microsoft life!

Thanks for the reply. I feel less panicky now about the non-downloaded. I did look for the patches as you suggested, but could find nothing listed before the folders in C:Windows. Even checked inside a couple of likely sounding folders (AddIns and AppPatch), but their Properties boxes said they were all created years ago.

Is there another place they could be? Or another way I can check to ensure they are in here after all the time devoted to their acquisition!!?

Really appreciate your help so far and any more you can offer.

Linda

Reply | Quote

Good Morning Linda,
I must confess to a less than trusting attitude when it come to Microsoft’s updates and patches (if you can’t find the time to do something right the first time, when are you going to find the time to fix it right in the future?????), and have only installed the updates that Woody assured us were OK. So far, so good. I had not, as of last night, downloaded and installed the latest critical updates that got Woody’s stamp of approval. I am in the process of doing that now and am using my kids machine for the next couple hours while they download. But now I’m gettin off point. Your question about the little blurb that flashed before your eyes about updates not being installed, was most likely referring to the “optional” updates that you chose not to install. Open Windows Explorer and navigate to the C:/Windows folder. All your installed updates should be listed there at the beginning before any other folders. Yes? No?? Maybe??

Reply | Quote

Thank you! Yes, it does clear things up. The Woody quote you included was from the WOW I was trying to follow; I’d just got confused about terms (i.e., the Web site didn’t use the word “optional”). Now I know that I will stop right here, having installed the Critical Updates and Service Pack.

By the way, after the download finished a while ago, just before the computer restarted, a message came up – too quickly for me to read all of it – to say something about all the updates were not installed. Do you know anything about this – or where I might find out exactly what that page did say?

Thanks again for clearing up my confusion!

Linda

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[indent]

---

I do NOT recommend that you install driver updates…

---

[/indent]I’ll second that one. Yesterday Windows Update told me it had an Intel video driver update for my Dell 4500S running Win2K. It installed fine, up until the time it was coming back up from its required reboot, at which time it gave me a never-before-seen blue screen of death: “KMODE_EXCEPTION_NOT_HANDLED… If a driver is identified in the Stop message, disable the driver or check with the manufacturer for driver updates. Try changing video adapters.” Duh! Wasn’t this supposed to be a “manufacturer’s driver update” that caused the error to begin with? I couldn’t do a ‘roll-back’ on the driver, so it took deleting the driver to be able to get back up and sort of running in VGA mode only. I so love throwing away a couple of hours trying to fix something that Microsoft fouled up.

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I’ve never had a good video driver from Windows Update. Other drivers have worked fine, even fixed a problem on occasion – but don’t touch those video drivers. They always seem to lead to system instability and there always seems to be a newer one at the manufacturers website.

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Patrick,

That sure seems to be true about Nvidia drivers. We discussed this in a past thread as to how Nvidia had a more current driver available, then when you went to WinUpdate, it said it had a “new” driver available, but it was an OLDER version than the one from VNvidia. The worst part was that WinUpdate wouldn’t let go and insisted you install the newold version. You couldn’t even hide the driver in WinUpdate, like you once could do in Win98.

Bob

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Patrick,

That sure seems to be true about Nvidia drivers. We discussed this in a past thread as to how Nvidia had a more current driver available, then when you went to WinUpdate, it said it had a “new” driver available, but it was an OLDER version than the one from VNvidia. The worst part was that WinUpdate wouldn’t let go and insisted you install the newold version. You couldn’t even hide the driver in WinUpdate, like you once could do in Win98.

Bob

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I’ve never had a good video driver from Windows Update. Other drivers have worked fine, even fixed a problem on occasion – but don’t touch those video drivers. They always seem to lead to system instability and there always seems to be a newer one at the manufacturers website.

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David–

You just pointed out very well a good reason not to use the driver updates from Windows Update. In that thread Bob mentions, I searched out and found on Technet or MSDN somewhere (I’ll find it and link it) the mechanism that Windows Update uses for drivers and why it can fail some kind of alogrithm they scan with–and it’s prone to fail. Sorry about the wasted time. Microsoft also because they try to do it as a convenience has some of the original drivers in certain situations as far back as the XP launch, and they tend to have less quality drivers sometimes.

People who go way back and know Invidia well tell me that Invidia drivers themselves and their downloads used to be problematic, but they have fixed this–if you can wade through the myriad of choices, and for the last few months going to Invidia for the newest video drivers has been working well.

MS announced at a meeting yesterday that they are revamping Windows Update–hopefully they’ll address driver problems and many others and it will be called Microsoft Update and offer every kind of update for their software in one site format–they plan to have this available within 12 months from today. They are pulling newsgroup problems including there own update newsgroup, and attempting to address them as well as the problems somewhat addressed on the Windows Update Troubleshooter and hope to fix them, but they often say that.

SMBP

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SMBP and fellow loungers, you sure did make a case for NOT downloading drivers from Windows Update – ever! Once again, Woody’s saved me hours of frustration and time.

Before going ahead with advice re. downloading patches, could you clarify the SR1 – SR2 thing for me. When first going to MS’ site, their analysis told me I needed “SR1” and it is now installed. Nowhere was there an SR2 mentioned. Or will this all be clarified if I go to the sites SMBP has suggested? Just want to make sure before I go ahead.

LInda

PS SMBP, thanks for your good wishes re. my bug (now gone, thank goodness) and positive assertions that we will get a clean and complete XP install into this machine!! You give me the hope to forge ahead, despite my technological newbie-ness!!

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Linda–

I think what you’re referring to is SP1 and SP2–Microsoft often bundles a group of Hotfixes into a Service Pack for the convenience of someone who say loads XP today or Office (they have Service Packs for the operating systems, Office, the servers, and for other software–for example with Windows 2000 they are up to Service Pack 4–for older versions of IE they are up to service pack 2 –for Office XP–they are up to Service Pack 2–for OE6 Service Pack 1 and IE Service Pack 1 but if you have XP Service Pack 1 it includes IE Service Pack 1 but not OE 6 Service Pack 1.

You have been using SR for SP–maybe in your mind you’re thinking service release.

What they do is say since October 25, 2001 the launch of Windows XP they began to learn of security holes or vulnerabilities from all over. They respond by writing code to make a patch. Since the launch they have had over 100 patches, but I don’t think those are just the XP patches–but say they had 100–someone who loads XP that doesn’t have SP1 “slipstreamed” or included in it, could then download SP1 that would spell all the hotfixes included.

Now since they rolled out SP1 back I think on September 9, 2002, they have released a number of hotfixes for Windows XP. What might have confused you is that in security bulletins or in articles about them by newsletters or KB’s these post SP1 patches have been called SP2 by some people in recognition that when they make a package to bundle the ones after SP1–it’ll be SP2. There is no SP2 for Windows XP yet Linda. Now you might say well if I’m concientious, and I’d had XP since SP1 or I go out and get every patch since SP1, then I won’t need SP2.

That’s not the case usually, because what happens is they take the opportunity in a Service Pack to add additional hotfixes in the bundle. For example they had a huge security vulnerability to fix in the PC Health file so they released the hotfix in XP SP1 for this.

It’s going to get easier because people from Microsoft have sworn to me they are revamping Windows Update. Personally, I think it’s easier to use the security bulletins. With drivers, you’re always better on going to a hardware manufacturer’s site or there are excellent sites that are driver banks–Cowboydawg will tell you gamers are all over the latest video drivers–they want the best color and the ability to see the game the best. I’ll PM you a good driver site.

I tend to catch up with Woody’s newsletters a few at a time or through the Archives, but I try to read every one and others that you’ll see mentioned from time to time or you can just google for Windows or XP or Office newsletters and many will come up.

BTW–Woody’s new book will help you a lot–it’s got great diagrams and screen shots all over the place almost every couple paragraphs–here’s

links to its table of contents on this Ezine thread

Any questions just put them up.

hth,

SMBP

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Linda–

I think what you’re referring to is SP1 and SP2–Microsoft often bundles a group of Hotfixes into a Service Pack for the convenience of someone who say loads XP today or Office (they have Service Packs for the operating systems, Office, the servers, and for other software–for example with Windows 2000 they are up to Service Pack 4–for older versions of IE they are up to service pack 2 –for Office XP–they are up to Service Pack 2–for OE6 Service Pack 1 and IE Service Pack 1 but if you have XP Service Pack 1 it includes IE Service Pack 1 but not OE 6 Service Pack 1.

You have been using SR for SP–maybe in your mind you’re thinking service release.

What they do is say since October 25, 2001 the launch of Windows XP they began to learn of security holes or vulnerabilities from all over. They respond by writing code to make a patch. Since the launch they have had over 100 patches, but I don’t think those are just the XP patches–but say they had 100–someone who loads XP that doesn’t have SP1 “slipstreamed” or included in it, could then download SP1 that would spell all the hotfixes included.

Now since they rolled out SP1 back I think on September 9, 2002, they have released a number of hotfixes for Windows XP. What might have confused you is that in security bulletins or in articles about them by newsletters or KB’s these post SP1 patches have been called SP2 by some people in recognition that when they make a package to bundle the ones after SP1–it’ll be SP2. There is no SP2 for Windows XP yet Linda. Now you might say well if I’m concientious, and I’d had XP since SP1 or I go out and get every patch since SP1, then I won’t need SP2.

That’s not the case usually, because what happens is they take the opportunity in a Service Pack to add additional hotfixes in the bundle. For example they had a huge security vulnerability to fix in the PC Health file so they released the hotfix in XP SP1 for this.

It’s going to get easier because people from Microsoft have sworn to me they are revamping Windows Update. Personally, I think it’s easier to use the security bulletins. With drivers, you’re always better on going to a hardware manufacturer’s site or there are excellent sites that are driver banks–Cowboydawg will tell you gamers are all over the latest video drivers–they want the best color and the ability to see the game the best. I’ll PM you a good driver site.

I tend to catch up with Woody’s newsletters a few at a time or through the Archives, but I try to read every one and others that you’ll see mentioned from time to time or you can just google for Windows or XP or Office newsletters and many will come up.

BTW–Woody’s new book will help you a lot–it’s got great diagrams and screen shots all over the place almost every couple paragraphs–here’s

links to its table of contents on this Ezine thread

Any questions just put them up.

hth,

SMBP

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SMBP and fellow loungers, you sure did make a case for NOT downloading drivers from Windows Update – ever! Once again, Woody’s saved me hours of frustration and time.

Before going ahead with advice re. downloading patches, could you clarify the SR1 – SR2 thing for me. When first going to MS’ site, their analysis told me I needed “SR1” and it is now installed. Nowhere was there an SR2 mentioned. Or will this all be clarified if I go to the sites SMBP has suggested? Just want to make sure before I go ahead.

LInda

PS SMBP, thanks for your good wishes re. my bug (now gone, thank goodness) and positive assertions that we will get a clean and complete XP install into this machine!! You give me the hope to forge ahead, despite my technological newbie-ness!!

Reply | Quote

David–

You just pointed out very well a good reason not to use the driver updates from Windows Update. In that thread Bob mentions, I searched out and found on Technet or MSDN somewhere (I’ll find it and link it) the mechanism that Windows Update uses for drivers and why it can fail some kind of alogrithm they scan with–and it’s prone to fail. Sorry about the wasted time. Microsoft also because they try to do it as a convenience has some of the original drivers in certain situations as far back as the XP launch, and they tend to have less quality drivers sometimes.

People who go way back and know Invidia well tell me that Invidia drivers themselves and their downloads used to be problematic, but they have fixed this–if you can wade through the myriad of choices, and for the last few months going to Invidia for the newest video drivers has been working well.

MS announced at a meeting yesterday that they are revamping Windows Update–hopefully they’ll address driver problems and many others and it will be called Microsoft Update and offer every kind of update for their software in one site format–they plan to have this available within 12 months from today. They are pulling newsgroup problems including there own update newsgroup, and attempting to address them as well as the problems somewhat addressed on the Windows Update Troubleshooter and hope to fix them, but they often say that.

SMBP

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[indent]

---

I do NOT recommend that you install driver updates…

---

[/indent]I’ll second that one. Yesterday Windows Update told me it had an Intel video driver update for my Dell 4500S running Win2K. It installed fine, up until the time it was coming back up from its required reboot, at which time it gave me a never-before-seen blue screen of death: “KMODE_EXCEPTION_NOT_HANDLED… If a driver is identified in the Stop message, disable the driver or check with the manufacturer for driver updates. Try changing video adapters.” Duh! Wasn’t this supposed to be a “manufacturer’s driver update” that caused the error to begin with? I couldn’t do a ‘roll-back’ on the driver, so it took deleting the driver to be able to get back up and sort of running in VGA mode only. I so love throwing away a couple of hours trying to fix something that Microsoft fouled up.

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Hi Linda,

From the masters latest Windows Watch

“I do NOT recommend that you install the optional updates (I’ll shoot Windows Update if it tries to stick Internet Explorer 6 on my Windows 98 system again). I do NOT recommend that you install driver updates (there’s a good explanation of why in “Windows XP Timesaving Techniques For Dummies”). I KNOW that at least one update – MS03-032 – doesn’t fix what it’s supposed to. But I DO think that now’s the time to get your system patched with all those security updates, through MS03-038/ 826292 / 826293.”

So JUST the Critical Updates please. The one’s you are downloading are all you want the others are optional (at your peril). Hope this helps clear the murky waters of MS updates a bit.

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Linda–

You asked about updates on your recent XP thread, so I put up links to help you with Windows Update and an alternative I think is a lot easier to get patches for IE, Windows XP and Windows related problems. All the updates are listed for these and for Office in separate links to Office Update and a master list of all the patches for Office XP. Any patches for Office will come through either the Security Bulletins or through the Office update site. It runs a progress bar that checks your system and also lists the updates. The thread and the links are here in Post 293066. I don’t know if you saw it or not.

Woody’s Office Watch V8N35
Woody’s Office Watch V8N3610 September 2003

Much of the objection Woody voiced to optional updates has to do with his irritation at the bugs in Windows Update. That’s why I linked you to every helpful list of Updates at the Microsoft Security Site–Woody’s frustration (and mine too) at Update wouldn’t have occured had he used the Security Site. Either way, whichever you choose, I’d recommend to do this:

1) Drivers–don’t get the from update–get them from the manufacturer–your video card, y our sound card, ect. Sometimes the manufacture stops providing them and then gives them over to the OEM. There are a million and one sites that list all the drivers you need–latest and best.

2) I gave you an Office Link on the other thread to list all the Office Updates–you should as Joe said, get Office SP1 then Office SP2, and as to the ancillary ones, I haven’t had any problem but at least as Doc said, get the critical ones for Office SP1 and SP2 and the ones last week for Office that are critical listed at

This Office Site. It’s very straightforward. You have two boxes there. The ones under “New Updates” are critical. Download them now. Then click on Check for Updates and you can decide whether to download the optional ones or not. If a spellchecker doesn’t seem essential, then you can forgo it.

SMBP

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SMBP et al,

Thanks for all your advice! Have been sidelined with a bug lately (biological rather than electronic!), but will be back trying all your suggestions and sites and downloads soon. Once I do, will get back to this lounge with an update.

Many thanks.

Linda

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I hope you’re better. Whatever it takes we’ll try to get you an intact XP.

SMBP

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I hope you’re better. Whatever it takes we’ll try to get you an intact XP.

SMBP

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SMBP et al,

Thanks for all your advice! Have been sidelined with a bug lately (biological rather than electronic!), but will be back trying all your suggestions and sites and downloads soon. Once I do, will get back to this lounge with an update.

Many thanks.

Linda

Reply | Quote

Linda–

You asked about updates on your recent XP thread, so I put up links to help you with Windows Update and an alternative I think is a lot easier to get patches for IE, Windows XP and Windows related problems. All the updates are listed for these and for Office in separate links to Office Update and a master list of all the patches for Office XP. Any patches for Office will come through either the Security Bulletins or through the Office update site. It runs a progress bar that checks your system and also lists the updates. The thread and the links are here in Post 293066. I don’t know if you saw it or not.

Woody’s Office Watch V8N35
Woody’s Office Watch V8N3610 September 2003

Much of the objection Woody voiced to optional updates has to do with his irritation at the bugs in Windows Update. That’s why I linked you to every helpful list of Updates at the Microsoft Security Site–Woody’s frustration (and mine too) at Update wouldn’t have occured had he used the Security Site. Either way, whichever you choose, I’d recommend to do this:

1) Drivers–don’t get the from update–get them from the manufacturer–your video card, y our sound card, ect. Sometimes the manufacture stops providing them and then gives them over to the OEM. There are a million and one sites that list all the drivers you need–latest and best.

2) I gave you an Office Link on the other thread to list all the Office Updates–you should as Joe said, get Office SP1 then Office SP2, and as to the ancillary ones, I haven’t had any problem but at least as Doc said, get the critical ones for Office SP1 and SP2 and the ones last week for Office that are critical listed at

This Office Site. It’s very straightforward. You have two boxes there. The ones under “New Updates” are critical. Download them now. Then click on Check for Updates and you can decide whether to download the optional ones or not. If a spellchecker doesn’t seem essential, then you can forgo it.

SMBP

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