Memory bug in SP-1? (XPP SP-1)

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Slashdot reports that SP-1 has introduced a problem into the way XP handles programs loading memory.

Read all about it: XP damaged by SP-1?

It’s great to know about these things except I followed every link I could to find and download the indicated fix available but Microsoft has hidden it under Bill Gates’ pillow, I guess. Anyway if you can find it please tell me how you did it. I’ve been experiencing serious problems with Corel Draw, etc., and Netscape since installing SP-1 and maybe we’ve found out why.

Hawai`i Bill

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I followed one of the first links in the slashdot article, the one pointing to http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=815411%5B/url%5D and about half way down it says [indent]

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To resolve this problem immediately, contact Microsoft Product Support Services to obtain the fix.

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[/indent] So give MS a call and ask ’em for it. They’ll give you a password and a username to download it from one of their FTP servers.

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Bryan,

Yes, I’ve seen that link and I’ve been there, done that. We’re dealing with an old man here, however, and I am having no luck whatsoever figuring out which of the seventy gazillion phone numbers I’m supposed to twist to get some help from Microsoft. I have sent e-mail and called enough numbers which are not correct — where I’m not directed to a correct number, by the way — to think this is a process the name for which can not be used in proper company.

Thank you very much, however, for the assurance that somewhere there is a phone that will answer my question.

Hawai`i Bill

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Bill–
If you call 1-866-PC-Safety and hit “6”–you’ll get someone right away who can transfer you over to snag the hotfix. I hope it helps when you open your ‘graphics CPU intensive programs’, but keep in mind that hotfix is still in the context of a beta hotfix–it can have bugs so automatically resolving the slowing may not happen–but probably worth trying. You can always uninstall the hotfix at “add/remove” if it isn’t helpful.

It takes them a couple business days to email it out to you.If it does help you significantly, I’d like to know

SMBP

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Dear SMBP

Thank you very much for providing the number 1-866-727-2338 Ext.6 to get the hotfix for SP-1 that has many XP systems in trouble. I’ll give you my experience here so that others seeking to fix their systems will have an idea of what to expect and be cautioned.

A woman answered and after a few reasonable questions gave me a ‘case number’ and put me on a que for tech support. The woman was in Canada and Abdul, who came on for tech support, was a friendly gentleman in Tuscon. He said the current advice for this Microsoft-recognized problem is to re-install Windows XP (Professional in my case) and then install the full SP-1. Not knowing what else to do given the serious problems I’ve had since SP-1 came my way, he had me read him my XP Product Key and put the CD in the machine.

After re-install Abdul said he had already put the SP-1 in my email and, when downloaded, to select it to install the FULL NETWORK VERSION. though I am not on a network with that machine. That was it, I hoped.

Fact is my machine is working okay for apps but there seems to be no way to use my modem! This is a Dell Dimension 8200, P4 1.86gh, 256RAM and 80gig hard drive with only about 30 percent loaded with files. The modem came with the machine. Nothing happens with the old icon for “connect” though Control Panel says the modem is installed for COM3. Hmmm.

rundll or rundll32 is a factor here because the machine tells me at many points in my efforts to get the modem going that an “entry point” involving that file is not available. Same when I tried system restore. “Entry point” not found for that, either. More trouble than I knew.

This information on the SP-1 problems — there are several! — was first picked up at Slashdot on SP-1 problem where they have some 325 responses. That’s a serious computer information interchange slightly harder to navigate than Woody’s but they do recognize a serious issue — one that costs us money! — when they see it.

Abdul was very concerned about the issue. He gave the strong indication that they are NO LONGER recommending the hotfix — which is in accord with your caution though many Slashdot folks who have installed it claim their problems are solved.

Hope this is helpful to those who are having trouble with loading programs and files from complex apps such as Corel or Adobe graphics suites.

And, again, thank you for helping me!

Hawai`i Bill

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Bill–

I hope you did not lose any serious files or documents when you reinstalled. The woman in Canada is probably a Convergys employee–Microsoft contracts with them to field their calls and channel to Tech Support who also are often Convergys–but Arizona is a Microsoft campus. I get the sense that this patch is exactly the way Charlotte contexted it–they have developed it enough to get tangible results, but they have work to do on it and it has some problems with some of the many third party applications with which Microsoft tries to run smoothly and some other issues.

I first learned about it when I saw your post–and since I have been having some similar problems–with say WMP9 running and a good number of applications open or web pages minimized–and not that often–I decided to give it a whirl. I feel like I have gotten into and out of enough situations with XP that I could handle the negative bugs it might throw at me–and after all, you can zap a hotfix easily at add/remove. I also don’t have the concern that people using it in a workplace tending to multiple computers with multiple users might have in applying a new hotfix/patch to a number of machines.

I called and discussed it and the Desk Specialist in Arizona consulted and told me that they are limiting the patch because it’s a work in progress, or sort of a “beta patch” and it still has bugs. I’m not sure what the bugs reported have been–I haven’t seen much about it on any of the MSN groups. I was emailed the hotfix and applied it. Things seem to be running well–and generally my system has been. After about a week I should be able to tell if it has made a significant difference or I have bugs.

What I’d do is if you aren’t noticing a difference in apps like Corel Draw and others you must use for your magazine, with your new install, is to call back and request the chance to try it. Slash/Dot is excellent, and I try to hit it every day.

On the modem issue, there are many others better equipped to advise–I would check that you have the newest 3 Com driver for your modem, available at 3Com and also many of the modems have a reset button on the back you can check. If it’s a cable/dsl you can also have the ISP ping/check it with their tools, “ipconfig/release/renew” and power cycle it–all things you’ve probably done. The lounge has had a number of good modem threads.

SMBP

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SMBP,

I’m in a ness because Abdul had me install Win XP Pro over the existing installation and that is a very large error, Dell’s people said. They couldn’t understand a Microsoft Tech doing it as it is very likely to cause the kind of problem I’ve developed — no modem — and worse. Device Manager shows the modem installed for COM3 and Dell’s handy Modem Helper which comes with the system goes right to it and you get a dial tone. But there is no way to do anything else. Bottom line is this message: “The procedure entry point RemoteAssistancePrepareSystemRestore could not be located in the dynamic link library WINSTA.dll”

Ain’t that a jaw breaker? You get to see this a lot with this particular one — when you try a System Restore –showing rstrui.exe – Entry Point Not Found on the title bar of the dialog box. Elsewhere the same message comes up with rundll32.exe as the culprit file in the title bar. Hmmm.

There is no dial-up networking connection on any of the pages it should appear. When attempting to create a new connection manually the ubiquitous “New Connection Wizard” treats you to greyed out “Connect using a dial-up modem” and “Connect using a broadband connection etc.” Just no way to do it and the Dell tech said nothing like that has been seen before. The system, in other words is fritzed.

Dell says they know of no way to fix the mess Microsoft caused short of f-disk and clean install. Hard to believe but Abdul disappeared from the scene after his hour with me so must continue my friendly little chat with Microsoft when they open tomorrow (*Monday*) morning. I’ve known about the dangers of installing over an XP install but here I am talking with a senior tech guy who seemed competent on the line. Looking back he had said a few things that should have raised my concern such as, “Maybe we should have tried some actions in Safe Mode first.” Okay.He wanted me to re-install to wipe out SP-1 and then download SP-1 and pretty much do the same thing again. He never offered me the hotfix.

This is more detail than you want but other readers may need this level of caution. It was very clear that Microsoft is getting sensitive to the damage this is causing. Too bad more folks aren’t alert to it but I think it is because most opt for the “express” install on their SP1 or SP1a. and perhaps that doesn’t destroy the very good memory mechanism that was already there. I’m in a severe jam because I had a lot of finished work to upload to a client’s web site and can’t use my Win98SE machines to do it. Rats.

Thank you very much for your attention and sharing your far superior understanding. I’m uncertain why my posts were received by two in the manner we saw but there has been a lot of good help from others.

Aloha from the middle of the Pacific Ocean,

Bill Eger

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SMBP,

Microsoft in Tuscon got my system scotch-taped back together but we are all waiting to see if it holds. The problem with the modem was in registry. We deleted files 25 and 26 from the EAP folder and re-booted. Worked as evidenced from me being online here. Tech support said this loss is well known in re-installing XP over XP but said such action — a repair install — is necessary and warranted IF the tech support stays with the caller and checks these known problems with the procedure.

Other problems required various solutions to rebuild System Restore (re-install sp.sys from XP CD) and fix inability to set folder characteristics (by changing winsta.dll to winsta.123 and re-booting). Tech support said to be watchful for other problems that may present and will keep this case number open to help if that happens. So Microsoft has apparently fixed the damage from SP-1 and I’m very glad to report that to you.

The tech support gentleman strongly recommends that SP-1 NOT be re-installed. He doesn’t have it on his machine because of the problems. The tech person yesterday had my other system running all night to download SP1a and said it was necessary to use it. It made no sense in the cold light of day that I would re-install am SP that has caused so much trouble. I note that this morning’s Woody’s Windows XP newsletter is on this topic, by the way.

Thank you again for your help and understanding,

Hawai`i Bill

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Thanks for the F/U. I hope your system does well. I had been trying to sort out the implications of installing SP1 over SP1 which is, I think, what happened. I’m not sure about that causing the need for the reg hack connected to the modem problem or if that caused the modem problem. Installing the full larger 134MB SP1 version that has network/multiple computer application in a system that isn’t networked, doesn’t have any downsides that I know of and could be advantageous if you decide to create a network. I couldn’t find info on your error message. Microsoft is sticking with you and keeping the case open which is helpful to you. Good luck.

SMBP

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the 134MB SP-1 is just the full service pack. Nothing special about networking. It just means you can install from your local network as opposed to using the MS installer. The big advantage is you can update several systems from the same download. You can also make changes as needed to your system, reinstall from scratch, apply SP-1 without another download.

Joe

--Joe

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Joe–
If you have any SP1 in, doesn’t it stop you from dirty installing another or give you a dialogue box that says you have this–do you want to replace it? Do you think Bill’s error and need for the regedits came from a dirty install?

SMBP

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Hi SMBP, I think you can still install SP-1 again. With all the problems Bill has had I don’t know that a re-install of SP-1 will fix anything. At this point I’d recommend a complete re-install of everything. Make sure there is a full backup first – especially the data part. Have up to date XP drivers for all hardware avilable on CD. Then Install XP reformatting the HD as part of the install. Then install SP-1. Update all drivers. Make sure everything is working. Then install AV & firewall. Make sure all is OK. Then install nothing else for a few days. Use the PC to surf the Net. Read e-mail with web interface. If still OK start installing applications one at a time. If he has Office 2k or XP I’d install all that at once. And then install all the service packs and hotfixes. Once again use the PC for a few days to make sure all is working OK. Then install other applications one at a time, testing that they are functioning correctly and the whole PC is OK before proceeding to the next. I know this drags things out but it is the safest way to get things going and the easiest way to isolate a problem application. It sure seems like something Bill installed or reinstalled or updated wreaked havoc with his system.

Joe

--Joe

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Hello, folks

I, too, recently experienced the loss of Modem/PPPoE in the wizard. KB articles 320558 and 312369 give a fairly accurate overview of cause and how to fix it.

Greg (Newbie)

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As MS Tech Support suggested, more problems may manifest themselves. The “Problem of the Day” is that Start | Search doesn’t function.

Joe, I don’t know about your plans for the month but I can’t afford that time. With clients waiting for work, etc.

Thank you for the good advice on what should be done, however. I recognize that it’s correct in the best of all possible worlds.

Aloha,

Bill

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Bill, Even if it is not the best of all worlds I’d still recommend that. Maybe just compressing the time. I wrestle with time constraints every day at work and at home with PC related issues. You can do the reinstall pretty quickly if you wish. Just don’t wait long between steps. Make sure eveything is working OK with a few tries at normal activities then go ahead to the next piece to install. I’ll bet if you talked to almost any different MS rep they’d say yes you should install SP-1. Your remark about MS releasing something that they know has problems applies to every software vendor. They all release software with known bugs. It is just that at some point you have to say enough is enough and get it out the door.

Joe

--Joe

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At the recommendation of the second MS Tech I did not even finish the download of SP1a. There was never the case that SP1 was installed again, that is to say over an existing SP1. The re-install of XP-Pro at the recommendation of the first MS Tech was to get rid of SP1 in the system. That seems to have worked. Tech #2 said the difficulties with the modem in a re-install is a ‘known problem.’ That’s why Tech #1 should have had me check the system for errors before he closed the file, errors that became evident after he logged off. He was, after all, at the end of his day so I can understand how that happens. No problem. It was surprising to Tech #2 that Dell did not know of this relatively easy fix for the re-install problem but, again, it was late Sunday and their main folks had gone for the day.

At the end of the day it is clear to me that this should not have happened. But MS did stay with me to get my system okay again. They never asked me what my estimate of the cost of the damage might be. I put it at about $1,000 for lost work and time. I think MS should care about that on their errors and failure to warn of potential problems with Service Packs or other fixes….. or, at least, pretend to care.

Mahalo plenty to everyone here to pitched in to help!

Bill

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Bill

A typical MS trick – the patch is only available “on request” which means you have to contact Microsoft product support directly and ask for the fix – it’s not downloadable.

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No, it *is* downloadable, but they are restricting access to it. That usually means that the patch is slated to be included in a future service pack rather than being a hot patch for everyone who thinks they might need it. They go slow with patches like that because there are ramifications for other programs and because not everyone needs it. We’ve never seen a slowdown like that on our WinXP machines, so there is no need for us to apply an unnecessary patch.

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Charlotte,

Thank you for the comment. It’s good to know that you are not affected — or, at least, think not. May that continue. This problem, however, is real for those of us who run applications such as graphics where there is a lot of memory activity. That may not be true with all graphics apps but it is clearly a problem with Corel and I have the new Suite 11 especially suited for XP! XP Pro was working fine and Corel was really fine until I installed SP-1. So Microsoft violated a cardinal rule, they broke something that wasn’t in need of patch or fix and now delay or make difficult the availability of a repair for their shoddy work. As I’ve been researching this many are reporting serious delay in simply launching XP. Microsoft itself says there can be a delay of ten times the previous load time for some apps.

Though there have been some reassurances here and elsewhere that the patch is, indeed, available and some words of understanding for Microsoft’s not wanting to make amends for their error, I still can’t find the phone number I’m supposed to call for the secret code ring to get the download. What kind of children run Microsoft, anyway? XP Pro was an expensive upgrade to a new computer for this old cowboy and I don’t like the ho-hum attitude continuing from Microsoft. They are costing me money because in addition to the app launch delay, there is new instability in Corel files that has cost me loss of completed work.My clients don’t seem as patient with me as you indicate we should be with Microsoft. I can’t afford that.

Hawai`i Bill

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>> …their shoddy work
>> What kind of children run Microsoft, anyway?
And re: Movie Maker
>> All I can figure is that Bill Gates saw it by accident one day, noticed that it was imminently easy to use and effective and ordered it destroyed.
>> How in the world could a company be so dumb to mess up one of the few things they have done right?

Bill,
Continually running down Microsoft – here or anywhere else – is not going to help. We all have problems with software from all sources, and that is just part of life. We here in the Lounge are trying to assist you and just telling us that you have difficulty “figuring out which of the seventy gazillion phone numbers” you should call doesn’t exactly endear you to someone voluntarily giving up their Sunday to try and find what you need.
Can you be a little more explicit? Assuming you followed the linkPhone Numbers, Support Options and Pricing – what selections did you make and to which support option?

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Bill,
MS did not “Microsoft violated a cardinal rule”, it was the vender’s that are just meeting the requirements of the OS, to get their package Windows Approved, then then blaming MS when things go wrong.
If you are having so much problems, why don’t you go to that other OS and then use StarOffice and then Corel to run on that OS.

DaveA I am so far behind, I think I am First
Genealogy....confusing the dead and annoying the living

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Dave,

Please see my response above. This has nothing to do with vendors passing blame and the tone of your comments is unusual here. Microsoft acknowledges it as a serious problem and maybe you should also. I just hope more folks aren’t affected which is why I’m entering the information.

Bill

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Bill,

While I am running xp home with all the sp’s MS throws at it, with seemingly no problems, I have been interested in your informative thread here, and am also a bit surprised by the venom with which it has been received. Oh well, whatever. So noted. Now on to your modem… I might try this: uninstall the driver, turn off the machine, unplug the modem, reboot, turn off, plug the modem back in, and reboot again. All this of course in an effort to get windows to “plug n play” your modem anew. Actually it may not be necessary to unplug it, so you might start with just uninstalling the driver and refiring. I would think that you should have a phone line plugged in, but I haven’t dealt with modems in a long while (TGFC = Thank God For Cable!!!) Good luck and keep plugging away. Too bad you can’t send somebody a bill…….

kip

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Kip,
Thank you very much for the suggestion and I wish this problem could be solved that way. If you will note the detailed response above it will become apparent that it is not a modem/driver problem. XP has been dazzled by extremely irresponsible behavior from MS. Like it or not, it’s as simple as that and I’m not the only victim by far. The difficulties seem to gather around XPP, by the way.

Aloha from the middle of the Pacific Ocean,

Bill

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Bill, sounds like you are up and running now, right? Hope so and glad to hear it. By the way the sp1 problem made Woody’s Watch today. You’ve hit the big time!!!! Congrats for hanging in there. I’m almost glad that this fix was a little over my head. Sounds like more than I want to tackle!

good luck,
greetings from Seattle (practically the next town over from you!)

kip

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Hey Hawai Bill. Don’t you know better then to talk about that poor, poor, poor Bill Gates and his empire. I mean let’s not blame poor ole Bill Gates for any of our problems. After all the money we spend on his products we shouldn’t have the right to blame him , right. Lets see, if you have to have a trillion Fixes for a product, that tells me there might just be a slight chance we might have a small right to complain and place a little blame on MICROSOFT, don’t ya think!!!!

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Now Cowboy, us unpolished Texas folks are not supposed to upset the gentry.

Hawai`i Bill

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The truth will set you free. And the truth is what I told. It doesn’t take a rocket scientist to figure out, several fixes+SP1+SP2= Problems With Microsoft Software.
Not to mention that there is a trillion fixes in each Service Pack .

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Just possibly the most important lesson in all this was then the gen-you-wine MS Tech Support fellow said he doesn’t have SP-1 on HIS XP! And he doesn’t intend to. And he is the one who told me to NOT re-install it. Indicates to me that MS knew there were problems in this thing when they released it but didn’t warn us poor cowboys..

Hawai`i Bill

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Gee, and we all can’t wait for you to release your superior O/S which will be bug free and compatible with the 1000’s of applications out there that people will be installing on their machines. MS isn’t perfect by any stretch, but unless you have something better to offer, why the constant berating of a company which put a PC in the hands of millions who otherwise wouldn’t have one? And lastly, its not as if Linux is bug free or doesn’t have security issues. They might not be as publicized (its only politically correct to bash MS it seems) as Microsoft’s problems, but they do exist.

Personally, I’m indebted to Bill Gates, warts and all and will continue to both support his company as well as point out the flaws for future improvement.

There…. I feel much better now!

BTW……. you can download the “patch” here directly if needed: MS PATCH

Jeff

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For what it’s worth – the PC on which I am typing this is running XP Pro SP1 with CorelDraw 11 and I haven’t noticed any significant memory issues.

StuartR

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Hey Pilgrim, cool Pic. I was just haven a little fun. I know that WinXP is the best OS out there. Heck I love it. It’s kind of like our wives, we don’t always like what they say or do but we love um anyway. Been married 17 yrs. Beside’s some times we just like to complain cause were bored or upset and it makes us feel better. I feel much better already. Hugs and kisses to Bill Gates!! YUK

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cowboy,

Gee, now you went and made me feel bad for putting up a weak defense for Microsoft. No they are far from being the most ethical company around or one that produces perfect software, but there sure are others far worse. I’ve seen the alternatives to Windows and frankly, XP is light years ahead of them all, IMHO. It sure has been good to me, although not without its problems. Hey, I’m still breathin’ in spite of the quirks!!

Which “pic” were you referring to? If it was my userpic, then as you can now see, I changed it just before returning to this thread. The original pic I scanned off a birthday card my wife gave me about 6 years ago and really got a kick out of it. My “normal” userpic that I use everywhere else doesn’t meet the file size requirements here (cheapskates) so I decided to go with something a little more novel.

Jeff

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Yeah to be honest I haven’t had any problems with WinXP, and I game with it and everything. I suppose I must be one of the lucky ones, but XP is the best OS I have ever used and I don’t see any competition out there anywhere that can even come close to touching it. Bill had a legit complaint because the 1st guy that helped him at Microsoft did not give him all the information needed for finishing up the job or doing it correctly. But thats the way it is just about anywhere you go. There is always that one person that just falls a little short on his job or his desire to do his job right the 1st time. Hopefully we can get Bill up and running again and back to normal.

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Cowboy,

You got it right in a welter of confusion.

To recap, SP-1 doesn’t affect every system. My XPP and Corel 11 were just fine thanks but SP-1 did have the affect on me that Microsoft acknowledged could occur. At that point MS offered a hot fix.(You can find that link at the top of this thread) I learned this on slashdot.org, remember, and a number of users there had good results with the hotfix. So I requested it as MS recommended. The trouble wasn’t XP which I continue to appreciate. The trouble, as you noted, was wrong advice from a campus-located tech specialist who, it turns out, should have just given me the hotfix and said goodnight.

What ticked me off was that nowhere along the line did anyone at MS wonder about the impact on my economics. Good MS helpers made me whole again, however, in getting my machine back to where it was before this started. I’ve adknowledged that.

For Pilgrim and others it may be that taking a week out of your business life has no affect on your income. In my case it’s a big hit `cause I’m the only cowboy on this outfit sitting in front of this computer.

Bottom Line: If I were to treat my customers like Microsoft treats theirs, day in and day out, I would have no customers. If one of those here — defending poor old Microsoft because of their success — were one of my customers and treated a la Microsoft, the shoe would be on another foot. Right?

Every American expects responsibility for corporate actions when they are injured by foolish or wrongful actions.That’s the key to American success! How did it come to be that we are giving free passes for irresponsibility to a company that has developed and uses bad business practices to such a high degree? For many the answer is they have no choice and the reason they have no choice is the known monopolisitc practice –, many identified and punished — on the part of Microsoft.

This is the only forum and the only group including the tech folks at MS where anyone has berated me for being a messenger. Think about that.

Hawai`i Bill

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You have every right to be upset Bill. I have owned my on Business for 13 years and I know what it’s like to lose Money because someone is not doing the job they were hired to do. I lost $ 26,000.00 on one job because of one guys bone headed ignorance. So believe me I know what your talking about. And yes it is sad that our choices are so few when it comes to Operating Systems. Monopoly is the perfect word for the Richest Man on the Earth. But what ya gonna do.

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Well, Cowboy, you and I are from Texas and within my lifetime folks there knew what to do. Sometimes we did it, too. Back then, at least.

Aloha and thank you for your understanding, Enuf of this so we can move on. Giddy yup~!

Bill

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