Massive overhaul to updating Windows 7 – Service Pack 2, without the name

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Win 8.1 said to be next. It’s a REAL big deal. InfoWorld Woody on Windows. UPDATE: I know you folks tend to be cynical. So I just downloaded and i
[See the full post at: Massive overhaul to updating Windows 7 – Service Pack 2, without the name]

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where’s the info?

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Oops. Just updated the post. Thanks!

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All the telemetry and GWX garbage rolled into 1

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I don’t know about this. Going forward all non security updates will now be rolled up into one monthly update? Woody, you have been saying not to install the non security updates as a general rule. Does this mean, since we will not be able to pick and choose among the non security updates, we should “hide” the total rolled up update? As to the “convenience rollup” containing past updates both security and non security, I can guess your recommendation on this will be to pass on it as well since it will no doubt contain updates we purposedly did not install and/or hid for various reasons. This rollup will, I bet you, contain the Win 10 updates. This doesn’t sound good at all.

iPhone 13, 2019 iMac(SSD)

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@Woody,

And W7 users aren’t going to be extremely wary of a “rollup” that contains all security and non-security updates since SP1 was released??

C’mon, digging out of a 500mb “rollup” could be even a worse nightmare than the Windows Update process we are dealing with now.
I’m highly skeptical, to say the least.

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“Each month, we will release a single update containing all of the non-security fixes for that month. We are making this change — shifting to rollup updates, to improve the reliability and quality of our updates…”

He left out “… and so we can bundle spyware and nagware into the monthly updates.”

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Going to roll all the non-security updates in there too, huh? And release a single non-security rollup each month?

Better modify that MSU installer to give a menu of the rollups (and a description) and, for the user, the ability to deselect any or all of the includes updates.

Cannot tell whether monthly security updates are going to the bundle model.

Sounds like trying to “X-out” of a certain window, when “no” means “yes”.

GWX

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Woody,

Can you insert a MS Trustometer on the homepage? The first 4 comments tell it!

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If it’s a rollup of “all the security and non-security fixes released since the release of Windows 7 SP1 that are suitable for general distribution, up through April 2016…”, does that mean Microsoft is wrapping in the GWX updates as well? It leaves me a bit suspicious of Microsoft’s intent with this.

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“Trust us, we’re here to help.”

Yeah, sure you are.

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Predict (usually terrible at it) over 75 comments on this thread by tomorrow morning.

Where are the admins on this?

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Two questions:

1. Is Malwaresoft going to list all of the individual updates in each bundle so users can tell exactly what’s being inflicted upon them?

2. Can users decline or at least uninstall individual pieces of crapware/spyware from these bundles?

Without a clear, non-weasely “Yes” to both of these questions, I won’t be touching this stuff with a ten foot pole.

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“Convenience” (for Microsoft) rollup installs all the previous updates we’ve been avoiding (telemetry, Win10 compatibility, GWX, etc) and all the updates that have given us trouble (hangups, things that do not work, BSODs, bricked computers, etc) since SP1 in one humongous package.

NOT ON MY COMPUTERS.

Their posts and blogs twist the truth to make it sound wonderful, but I would’nt (to quote) “touch it with a barge pole.”

And isn’t the monthly rollup, where you can’t tell what causes a problem, the very thing everyone’s been ranting against in Windows 10?
Next we’ll have forced updates for Win7 and Win8.1 too.

Sounds like if they can’t force Win7/8.1 to upgrade to Win10, they’ll force Win10 to take over Win7/8.1.

Excuse me for not believing or trusting Microsoft.

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Nope, sticking with “WSUS Offline Update”.

Being forced to install an ActiveX-plugin in 2016 is the first show-stopper, bundling in the GWX-stuff is the second.

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I don’t see why I would want this. If it’s optional and I reject it, then moving forward I will still be able to pick and choose individual updates on my own schedule, right?

You talk about how great this is for people experiencing slow WU, but mine isn’t slow now that I’ve applied a May patch, KB3153199, and this massive rollup of updates only goes through April. And next month what will happen? Probably another slowdown and another patch.

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Thanks Woody. Just wondering how did you pick this up, especially as it does not seem to come on Windows Update, or at least not yet.
We haven’t had a major update of this size since the April 2014 Windows 8.1 and 2012 R2 Update 1.
It is not called Service Pack for reasons related to the new naming for the Windows roll-ups, otherwise it is exactly that. Weird enough, other major Microsoft products still get Service Packs.

For those who are not aware, we had in the past https://support.microsoft.com/en-au/kb/2775511 – An enterprise hotfix roll-up is available for Windows 7 SP1 and Windows Server 2008 R2 SP1 which was considered by some as Windows 7/2008 R2 Service Pack 2, but it was not and hopefully was not installed widely. That roll-up is rather a collection of hotfixes outside of the mainstream updates, put together by Microsoft Premier Field Engineers and released as such. KB2775511 is not to be considered “official” by anyone outside enteprise, and even there is not generally required. The name of hotfix refers to limited applicability updates which are rarely on Windows Update by themselves and generally need to be “requested” – those which are not recommended to be installed by general public, unless there are specific conditions requiring the hotfix.

It is too early to say what the current roll-up does. If it is what the documentation says, then it is very much what I said for the last few months on this site in order to fix slow behaviour of Windows Update, i.e install everything up to date, except for patches which are either known to cause breaking of the system (none not retired up to April 2016), and do not install without a reason (preparing to upgrade to Windows 10 now or in the near future) the well-known KB3035583.
I still have to test the new roll-up KB3125574 which probably will get updates, fixes and a final shape in the days/weeks/months to come.
Overall this is very good news if it behaves as documented and except for bugs, I don’t see it otherwise.

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Doubt that it’ll ever show up in Windows Update. I heard about it on Twitter – where I hear about most new stuff.

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Right. Could well be that next month will be slow again – guess we’ll have to wait and see…

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No idea.

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Just guessing on Woody’s behalf, I don’t think this one will be getting a miss, after a reasonable period will pass and all bugs will be sorted.
The main advantage in installing this roll-up would be to set a baseline for the installation, like a Service Pack would, if this one will behave like it is intended.
Again, this depends on what it does and needs to be tested thoroughly as it is likely that the roll-back in place would not be easy.

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Which admins? Windows sysadmins or web site admins?

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Max, what makes you believe that WSUS Offline will not include KB3125574 in due time?

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Here is the link to Malwaresoft’s explanation of these convenience rollups: https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/kb/3125574. Included in this post is a link to download a list of all included updates. Haven’t had time to review it yet but I’m betting virtually everything that enables a switch to Windows 10 is included.

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Too early to say, but I think if it is to behave as documented, you are right, this is just a bundle of what was previously offered.
Based on previous experience however, there may be few additional minor tweaks, so you may find it will not be a 1 to 1 equivalence to the existing releases as it may include few other hotfixes published or not to make the bundle install smoothly and “fit in” well.

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Tried to install it on one of my Win7 x86 VMware VMs that I use for patch testing. It installed, rebooted, and when almost to the login screen it failed and reverted, then rebooted and reverted again, then rebooted and got back to the login screen. I logged in and see no sign of it being installed. Snapshot ftw!

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I have to concur here. To me the telemetry spyware and ad serving is a no-go. I am concerned that this will actually be the foundation for enabling forced updates. I will wait and see.

Today, a friend asked if I would update her Win7-64 Home computer after 7 months of non-use, but added that she had used her daughters Win10 machine and to absolutely NOT allow it to update to Win10. I asked her how often she needed to use a PC (she does most surfing and email on an iPad), and she said not often, but when she did she required familiarity and a true keyboard and mouse and not a touch keypad or screen. I told her she should consider a MacBook or convert her laptop to a compatible Linux distro as Windows was not going to be a just forget it and use it solution. Fortunately, she is already a LibreOffice fan.

The sad part is her laptop is an 4 year old AMD budget laptop and I have been having some display or installer completion problems with newer Ubuntu-based Linux LTS installs on older AMD machines.

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I wouldn’t touch those non-security rollups with a 10-foot pole. The real reason for those is to get people to open wide and swallow everything that we’ve been resisting under the “Optional” label.

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From the Technet article:
…”This convenience update is completely optional; it doesn’t have to be installed and won’t even be offered via Windows Update – you can choose whether or not you want to use it.”

Link to the original article:
https://blogs.technet.microsoft.com/windowsitpro/2016/05/17/simplifying-updates-for-windows-7-and-8-1/

Link to the download (only works in IE, those sneaky b******d):
https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/kb/3125574

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At least it is in the Microsoft Catalog which means it can be imported to WSUS, so it can be installed “like” Windows Update to some extent. I am wondering what will be installed if all the other updates are already installed.
There are already known issues, outside of scope (App-V) for most readers of this site.
The pre-requisite KB3020369 is the servicing stack update for April 2015 which at least for 64-bit versions supersedes KB2533552 according to Microsoft. Even so, I still think it is good practice to install KB2533552 immediately after SP1 to avoid Windows Update detection issues, even if it may be just a cosmetic issue. After KB2533552, then KB3020369 should be installed and I think this is good practice for all new current installations of Windows 7 SP1 regardless of the new rollup.

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The GWX files are not included FYI.

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The only important telemetry one I think is included is KB3080149, and it does say that the new version “Reduces the network connections on a Windows system that doesn’t participate in the Windows Customer Experience Improvement Program (CEIP).”

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Assuming this would catch up on whatever fixes there were that I have rejected as part of my “security updates only” policy, and assuming further that the rollup does not attack GWX Control Panel, the questions remain whether (1) it re-installs the spyware that I have rejected since fall 2015, and (2) it lays other traps for users wishing to continue with Win7.

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Thanks. I’m eagerly waiting for your testing, comments and advice : should one take the plunge and install this W7 SP2, thus wiping all your previous MS-DEFCON advice painstakingly delivered month after month ? Are you going to do a reset and start MS-DEFCON all over again from an SP2 state ?

I see that MS has deliberately omitted several updates from this SP2, but there’s no way to know whether this is the right blacklist from a user’s point of view.

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Yup. Not believing a word of it.

And the timing is so convenient, just about two months before free-10 cutoff. One last push to get as many unwilling converts onto the OS while they’re cheering for faster running updates.

FFS, give us all the security fixes so far in a single roll-up, that’ll achieve much faster updates than the ones we don’t want.

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Yep, and the GWX registry settings are respected – nothing gets flipped, nothing untoward installed.

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But none of the GWX patches are there.

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I thought so, too – but was very surprised to discover that KB 3125574 appears as a single line in the “installed updates” list.

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Chalk up one small win for users.

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There is a huge list of superseded updates available in WSUS. I will check the list as much as I can in the next few days and complete testing for Windows 7 (64-bit only for me) and Windows 2008 R2. From this point of view, this update seems to behave like a regular roll-up update and not so much like a Service Pack. Which may mean that uninstalling it, would revert cleanly to the previous state, leaving in place what was installed in the past. This assumes that there are no additional steps taken post-install to remove older, superseded updates with Disk Cleanup or third-party tools like CCleaner.

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Do you have KB2533552 and KB3020369 installed? If not, you should install those 2 servicing stack updates before trying again, KB2533552 first and KB3020369 after the first one is installed.

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Just a couple of hours ago, I breathed a sigh of relief, thinking “Maybe today I can let down my guard a bit (regarding the constantly defensive pose one has had to assume for the last year on the battleground of one’s own computer) and maybe it would even be okay for me not to check Woody’s site at the end of the day, since things seem to be quite quiet and it doesn’t seem like any massively disruptive Windows 7 event is on the immediate horizon….”

Well, I pottered over here anyway, before settling down to sleep, just to make sure that everything was calm — AND!

NOOOOOOOOOOO! Bundled updates?

Convenient? A solution to windows updates problems? A technological advance? Efficient?
NOOOO!

Why are they being so devious? What a crock!

This is not gonna happen on my computer if I can help it, unless I absolutely MUST allow it for some reason.

…I do not even own a barge pole (or 10-foot pole of any variety).

Woody’s InfoWorld article was so breezy, upbeat, and welcoming about this development that after reading the article I had to mull the idea over for a minute to figure out if my innate reaction of HORROR was off the mark…
then I read the comments here under this blogpost and they reassured me that some others also were SCARED by this turn of events. Phew.

Oh, it’s all voluntary, oh it’s just to help people get up to date, oh it’s to save your losing in the future the same kind of stolen hours that we have deliberately ripped out of your life for the last few months, la-di-da!

And by the way, hi-di-hi, ho-de-ho,
(a future announcement might be) if you want to install any critical security updates at all ever again, you’ll have to accept our entire bundle of evil and move up to Windows 10 — gotcha! wee-hee, way-hey!

Man oh man.

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ch100,

What I meant to ask (and should have been more clear) is where do system administrators (and others responsible for their organizations’ system maintenance) figure into this?

If they are running Enterprise, are they spared this bundling and still get singles? An admin can’t roll out the SP (it is a service pack) without knowing precisely what’s in it and the issues to be addressed. I’d think sys admins have to be offered individual updates/fixes.

Or … what happens when the admin’s “help desk” gets flooded with, “Should I click on the red X in that Windows 10 thingy, like Woody talked about?” I’ll leave that there.

I do share the scepticism expressed by others here. MS is deflecting, part of the campaign.

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If EMET 5.5 is running, installing KB 3125574 fails because of the ASR mitigation in IEXPLORER.EXE!

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It all depends on what “bundled” means. I haven’t seen a definition – or an example.

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Also, how will these new rollups show up in WSUS? Under the Roll-up classification? For people who specifically block “Updates” and “Update Rollups” that would mean that we don’t get any updates for security any more. On the other hand, if they include the rollups in the “Security Updates” or “Critical Updates” classification, that would mean they contain stuff we DON’T want to install. How can we keep the stuff we don’t want out if they bundle it all together?

So it really does sound like those horrid Windows 10 update packs that everyone is having trouble with plus the added joy of GWX.

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That list isn’t really much, just think of it as a list of what was tried to install (and the exit code), not an installed update list. If you reset your windows update it blanks the list.

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I guess once we find the magic button for W7 Update issues, there should be a DVD/CD iso that combines all updates that are “safe” by woody’s standards and Call it Woodys W7 Pack Update (MS Unofficial SP2 for Dummies lol)

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So where is the direct download link? Where is the list of included updates?

Someone want to download this and list the KB numbers from the cab files?

This sounds like the final rollup for W2K.

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nice

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We have a sample of the Update Rollups to come in the form of KB3156417, which is Optional for now. I assume it will become Recommended or even Important (Critical Update) next regular Patch Tuesday (June 5 or 12).
KB3156417 May 2016 update rollup for Windows 7 SP1 and Windows 2008 R2 SP1 https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/kb/3156417

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Seriously, why now? Panic mode in Redmond with just 2 months to go before the ALLEGED end of the free downgrade to Windows 10 and the expected outcome failed in unprecedented spectacular fashion, that’s why. Not falling for this sugarcoated junk.

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Direct links:

Update for Windows 7 32bit:

http://download.windowsupdate.com/d/msdownload/update/software/updt/2016/05/windows6.1-kb3125574-v4-x86_ba1ff5537312561795cc04db0b02fbb0a74b2cbd.msu

Update for Windows 7 64bit & Update for Windows Server 2008 R2 64bit:

http://download.windowsupdate.com/d/msdownload/update/software/updt/2016/05/windows6.1-kb3125574-v4-x64_2dafb1d203c8964239af3048b5dd4b1264cd93b9.msu

Found on https://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread/?t=18731502

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Interesting. How do I reset Windows Update?

I’ve intentionally avoided uninstalling the patch. Not sure what will happen.

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That may well be the case. We now have a small test case.

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From the Infoworld-articel:

Mercer goes on to say:

Also today we are announcing that non-security updates for Windows 7 SP1 and Windows 8.1 (as well as Windows Server 2008 R2 SP1, Windows Server 2012 and Windows Server 2012 R2) will be available as a monthly rollup (fixes rolled up together into a single update). Each month, we will release a single update containing all of the non-security fixes for that month. We are making this change — shifting to rollup updates, to improve the reliability and quality of our updates…. These fixes will be available through Windows Update, WSUS, and SCCM as well as the Microsoft Update catalog. We hope this monthly rollup update simplifies your process of keeping Windows 7, and 8.1 up-to-date.

Would that mean you cannot choose what non-security fixes you want to apply, but it is either all or nothing? I mean: will MS ONLY offer the roll-up or give you a choice? (ie between roll-up and installing individual updates)?

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It is too complex to have an answer already. This should not be installed yet on a regular computer normally, although I tested the install/uninstall process and it worked correctly for me, except for a previous patch which was uninstalled too. That patch (KB2823180) needed to be reinstalled from Windows Update which is just a minor issue, compared to the complexity involved. This was tested on a virtual machine with nothing else than Windows 7 64 bit. Other installed software can add complexity which may create additional risks.

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Perfect idea. Microsoft don’t care about users; profit is in first place.

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Not in WSUS if not on Windows Update. Can be imported from Microsoft Catalog in WSUS and it behaves like an Update in the WSUS sense, not an Update Rollup, at least not for now.

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Michael, I used to ignore Updates (not Update Rollups) in WSUS and I found it not to be the best practice, especially in the last year or so. Now I install all updates if they are not causing any trouble and as such avoid completely the interdependencies issues causing slow Windows Update, including slow scanning in WSUS. KB3035583 is not available in WSUS.
You may have other requirements, like compliance requirements not allowing certain categories of updates, but from a purely technical perspective, you would be better off installing everything.

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This sounds like the final rollup for W2K.

This was exactly what my first thought was when I read Woody’s article few hours ago.
It’s all over for Windows 7, time to prepare for moving on – not immediately, but still the right time to start preparing. Either preparing for Windows 10 or for something else.

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John in Mtl: Well, that link works fine with my Firefox 46.0.1 – try again?

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First bundled rollup update is here. Got it this morning. KB3156417. Optional and unchecked. Unchecked means do not install I assume?

iPhone 13, 2019 iMac(SSD)

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Enough (plenty!) concerns logged here to make me keep my hairy ol’ eyeball on AskWoody here for a long time until the corporate sysadmins and other experts test and re-test this likely Trojan horse of an update/dis-service pack.

– Leaving M/S in charge of updates is like putting the fox in charge of the hen house. No thanks. Thank goodness M/S is not in charge of any pharmaceutical production/marketing or most of us would be dead by now.

– Would switch to non m/s s/w but have also seen plenty of confusing info on too many flavours of Linux/Ubuntu s/w o/s. Sigh; so am stuck with the devil I know, for the moment.

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It’s confirmed.
I’m going to start accelerating my move to Chromebook.
After 30+ years with Windows, I’ve had enough of Redmond forcing me to jump through hoops.
And if you can make a loyal 30+ year customer leave, as Al Pacino once said, “Something is really, really, wrong here.”

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Trying to download via FireFox produces this…

Thank you for visiting the Microsoft Update Catalog To use this Web site’s full functionality, you must be running Microsoft Internet Explorer 6.0 or later. To upgrade to the latest version of the browser, go to the Internet Explorer Downloads Website. If you prefer to use a different Web browser, you can get updates from the Microsoft Download Center.

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I love my Chromebook! Really, really.

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Correct. See http://www.infoworld.com/article/3071689/microsoft-windows/new-windows-7-and-81-patches-usher-in-the-future-of-rollup-updating.html

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The more I think and reflect upon the whole windows 7 update mess, the more I see Microsoft as having dug its own hole and put itself in the crapper all by itself by not issuing an SP2 (and an SP3, etc.) early on in the first place. When you cut corners or costs, these things have a way to come back to byte (excuse the pun) your a** when you least expect it -;)

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Well Louis, I feel **exactly** the same way. It was a good ride for 30 years but no more.

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All or nothing. Like in Windows 10.

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The Update History list can be reset by deleting the C:WindowsSoftwareDistributionDataStore folder after stopping Windows Update and BITS services and while having the right credentials. That list is stored in the database, but the actual updates installed are shown in Control Panel/Programs and Features/Installed Updates

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It is about a different list, the one of superseded updates in WSUS, which is the small/medium business updating software from Microsoft, an equivalent to an in-house Windows Update.

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Jim, Enterprise is getting exactly the same updates like everyone else. The method of updating may be different. One way is via WSUS which is mainly targeted to small/medium businesses or another common way is via System Center Configuration Manager (SCCM) which contains the same WSUS in a so-called Enteprise Version which is essentially the same with the stand-alone product. The products mentioned are the equivalent to an in-house Windows (or Microsoft) Update and not related to WSUS Offline which is a third party (non-Microsoft) product not for enterprise.
The only patch that Enteprise version is not getting and does not come in the products mentioned above is KB3035583. Even installing KB3035583 is not so damaging, as its nagware functionality in Pro can be blocked by setting documented Group Policies in KB3080351 which is the same thing with what Gwx Control Panel does.
There is nothing mysterious happening here or hard to configure. It is all documented and working as documented. Woody mentioned a while ago that the documentation was incorrect in the early stages, but has been rectified and is correct now.
If the admins get the “Windows 10 thingy” in their environment, then sorry, I would say that they are less prepared than many of the readers of this site.
What is rolled out and what is not rolled out depends very much on the internal policies of the organisation, its “agility” in term of IT and other factors.

One of the reasons why Microsoft has started aggressively pushing forced updates to non-managed end-users is that the statistics show that a lot of users have malware installed without being aware of it and their computers are used as source for various types of distributed attacks against certain targets or to spread malware to other computers on the Internet at random.

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New test here. Installed Windows 7 64 bit with Service Pack 1 integrated, installed the servicing stack update KB3020369 and running Windows Update scanning. Nothing else installed.
Windows Update scanning has been running for about 1 hour and not completed yet.
It looks to me like the bundled update is not the answer to the slow Windows Update. This issue will be resolved with a high degree of certainty only after installing the remaining updates left out on purpose from this rollup.

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> it lays other traps for users wishing to continue with Win7.

That cuts to the core of it.

IF you’re one who wants to continue to run an older system and who cares about privacy, this may be the time to decide if you want to either:

A) continue to follow Microsoft or
B) drop out of the update process entirely.

The efficacy of stringing along an older system with a mix/match set of some individual updates and not others – in order to avoid the changes you don’t want – may have just evaporated.

This definitely requires further study and sensible thinking.

-Noel

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“too many flavours of Linux/Ubuntu s/w o/s”

I recommend Fedora (a cut-down version of Red Hat’s enterprise Linux) and Zorin OS (a spin of Ubuntu which resembles Windows, in both paid and free versions). Try it on an old hard drive to play around with it (format it and delete all partitions before you start), or use it as a LiveUSB or LiveCD, but disconnect your Windows hard drive before you start. VLC will play all varieties of WMA. LibreOffice is a substitute for Microsoft Office. Firefox browser is standard, but you can add Opera, Chrome, Icecat, Qupzilla, and many others.

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Uh… so:
https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/kb/3156417

links to (at least describes before linking):

https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/3155039
https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/3155218

Both say “Try searching for what you need” (microsoft hasn’t heard of these updates yet…)

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I assume then that the main “convenience roll-up” is simply an aid to installing or re-installing Windows 7 in that it means no long lists of individual updates, just install the OS plus SP1 and the new roll-up, and you’re up to April 2016 and only need to install any separate updates from then onwards. It seems designed to make installing/re-installing a lot easier provided you don’t mind having all the updates rather than cherry-picking them individually.

If, however, you have the OS already installed and up-to-date then this roll-up is of no relevance to you and won’t be offered through Windows Updates which should be run as normal.

As for the non-security updates, I thought we weren’t supposed to be getting them for Windows 7 anymore anyway? In so far as they are still released, however, they will be bundled as a single monthly update and it doesn’t look like they’ll be available separately which is a drag. Install all, or hide all, those seem to be the coming options.

I don’t see any of this as another nail in the coffin of Windows 7, but rather as a clear step towards applying the rigid forced updating we associate with Windows 10 to both 7 and 8.1 – which was always on the cards.

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Yes, both of those are already installed on all Win7 machines here. Going to do some more testing today.

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“Later this (Northern hemisphere) summer, we will be updating MU to eliminate the ActiveX control in order to support other browsers.”

https://blogs.technet.microsoft.com/windowsitpro/2016/05/17/simplifying-updates-for-windows-7-and-8-1/#comment-2256

Expect it in autumn.

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Beware M$ Geeks bearing gifts.

Gift (German) = Poison (English)

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There’s a middle way – install security patches, pass on the non-security. More about that next week.

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That’s the list I’ve been working with – Control Panel Programs and Features applet, Installed Updates.

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@Seff

“I assume then that the main “convenience roll-up” is simply an aid to installing or re-installing Windows 7 in that it means no long lists of individual updates, just install the OS plus SP1 and the new roll-up, and you’re up to April 2016 and only need to install any separate updates from then onwards. It seems designed to make installing/re-installing a lot easier provided you don’t mind having all the updates rather than cherry-picking them individually.”

I think you nailed it.

“If, however, you have the OS already installed and up-to-date then this roll-up is of no relevance to you and won’t be offered through Windows Updates which should be run as normal.”

That would explain why I haven’t seen it in my Windows Update.

Nice work, Seff.

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Been doing that for several months now, with no issues so far. Look forward to your thoughts on the pros and cons.

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Exactly so. However it does not cover all updates post-SP1 and until April 2016. There are few others missed and Windows Update still takes a very long time to scan until the remainder of the updates is installed. WSUS managed correctly by declining superseded updates is scanning fine.
The only Critical Update which comes after installing the rollup is the March Windows Update Client KB3138612 which may change the slow Windows Update behaviour. Still testing and this takes time.

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It is not in Windows Update because it is not meant to be. It is specified in the Microsoft documentation associated with the rollup and Woody explained it too in his article on InfoWorld.
However I am expecting Microsoft to push the rollup to Windows Update for everyone once the update is confirmed to be reliable in the next few weeks or even months.

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@ch100

Then you need to explain how it showed up on Woody’s Windows Update this morning.

“woody says:
May 18, 2016 at 3:19 pm
Interesting! I have no idea – but it was on one of my machines this morning….”

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Steve, I am not experiencing any problems and testing in various configuration, it is true that I am only testing on 64-bit version with 2 (virtual) CPUs (based on i7 quad-core, Gen 2) and 6 GB (virtual) RAM. What is the amount of RAM on your machines? What about CPU? There is a requirement for available space too which is documented in the Microsoft KB.

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I think for reliable operation while accepting some security risks, Noel’s approach is the correct one. There is no reliable way as far as I can tell other than:

1. Dropping from updates entirely (not recommended, it involves a degree of risk)
2. Updating in full and using the system as designed for today, while accepting the perceived or real privacy issues. I am all in favour of the second option, but each user is free to use their own judgment and any other reference available and choose one way or the other.

The middle way is possible, however there would be ongoing issues related to the reliability of the updating and instead of using the computer for productivity, a lot of time would be wasted with issues with which only the IT Pros should be concerned.

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I cannot. I don’t have access to Woody’s computer.
Seriously, it is very easy to get confused by the large amount of patches released lately and their numbers. Waiting for confirmation if this is the case that the new rollup appears on Windows Update, by accident or otherwise.
I cannot see it and I have few other ways to confirm if it was meant to be released or not elsewhere than on Microsoft Catalog.

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Noel Carboni wrote — “The efficacy of stringing along an older system with a mix/match set of some individual updates and not others – in order to avoid the changes you don’t want – may have just evaporated.”

However, the new bundling/roll-up seems to be only on non-security patches.

Most of us (=the people who contribute in the discussion sections here, who have been mixing and matching, picking and choosing, as best we can to keep our systems updated while avoiding telemetry and/or Get-Win-10) have not been installing the non-security patches for the last year, anyway.

It won’t be a new thing for most of us (=the mix/match people) to avoid the non-security patches. Whether the non-security patches now come bundled or are still available separately, we probably wouldn’t want them anyway.

The possible (likely?) future development of Microsoft’s bundling the _security_ patches for Windows 7 and 8, now THAT would be a game-changer for us (=the mix/match people)!

My take, at the moment, from what Woody has written in the past couple of days,
is that I won’t worry too much now,
because this bundling of non-security patches isn’t much going to change what I do regarding patches anyway,
but I will remain vigilant in case they take that next, horrifying step into bundling the critical security patches with the desperately-unwanted telemetry and get-Win-10 stuff.

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I’ve seen some reports that it appears in the optional section, unchecked. I saw it myself on one machine. No idea why or how – or if it’s a mirage.

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@Yan: Do you mean Iexplore.exe OR Explorer.exe?

Fortunately I do not use EMET at all.

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@ch100: Windows Update scanning is slow because KB3125574 does NOT contain the latest win32k.sys fix. It’s now KB3153199 which was not included in the big update rollup.

You still have to install the May 2016 win32k.sys security update to cure the WU scan problem – at least until mid-June 2016. If that problem comes back on June 14, 2016 (the next patch Tuesday), then Win7 users will have to keep installing another new & future win32k.sys update when available in June.

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I won’t be following ch100’s A/B scenario:

“1. Dropping from updates entirely…
2. Updating in full and using the system as designed for today, while accepting the perceived or real privacy issues.
…[E]ach user is free to choose one way or the other.
The middle way is possible, however… a lot of time would be wasted with issues with which only the IT Pros should be concerned.”

I’m not an IT pro but nonetheless I’m going to stay with my “middle way” which I’ve been doing for over a year now, during which time I’ve managed to protect my computer as well as could be expected, IT pro or not.

Although the new Win 7/8 non-security-update-bundling idea is menacing, the options that MS customers *currently* have are not simply either “give in” or “give up”.

They would have to threaten me harder than that, before I would admit defeat!

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Anyone do a clean install from 7_SP1x64 (the last ISO released) and looked at the installed updates list?

I would hope after using this one can uninstall junk updates, otherwise it is just totally useless.

Also, what happens if you install this on a fully updated system? Does it say “unneeded”? What happens if you have an update installed already that supersedes one included with this update?

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Not my scenario, just elaborating on Noel’s
Not being mine, that does not stop me to agree with Noel.

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Can we have that in English please?

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I installed a “virgin” Win7 Pro SP1 into a virtual machine.

During the install process, I told it NOT to do any auto updates – I wanted to get to the desktop without any updates being done automatically.

Once I got to the desktop, I started a check for updates. It took about 1 minute for it to get the newer updater, which installed and re-launched.

Now the fun. It started checking for updates and it took… (drum roll) 9 hours for it to show 166 updates and 69 optional updates. Surprisingly KB3125574 was NOT in the list.

After that test I restored the VM to the virgin installed state (before updates). This time, I MANUALLY installed KB3153199 first – this is supposed to be a recent update that fixes SLOW checking for updates.

After installing KB3153199, I have now started the check for updates again to see how long it’s going to take. So far it’s been checking for 30 minutes – I’ll post an update when the checking is done (but I’m skeptical it’ll be any better). I might need to manually install some other KBs in addition to KB3153199 to speed it up.

Right now I’m seeing the same thing as before, svchost using 100% of one core and it’s eating up about 2/3 of RAM (about 2gig in use by it). I have a feeling this is a serious bug in the updater service going 100% CPU and the updating application (check for updates) is trying to get work done but the update service is “busy” basically doing nothing so the application’s requests are handled r-e-a-l-l-y-s-l-o-w-l-y.

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It does not show unneeded on a fully patched system with May 2016 updates.
It shows as a single update but it does not replace everything already installed. It is very much like the November 2014 Update KB3000850 for 8.1/2012 R2. It replaces a lot, but not everything and is not mandatory.

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Hmmm, well surprise, surprise.

After installing KB3153199 manually, the check for updates took “only” *cough* 2.75 hours (not 9 hours)!

So now I wonder, did KB3153199 actually help or could the MS update servers be faster today (less bogged down than yesterday)?

Still, almost 3 hours to check for updates is not speedy-fast either.

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Is the list you’re referring to the “3125574.csv” file?

If so, then I wouldn’t call that a list of the included updates, per se, but rather a list of the actual files that are updated within the operating system. Sure, in a purely literal sense, it *is* a “list” and it *does* include the files that are being “updated”, so you *could* call it that, but doing so is rather misleading in a practical sense.

No one is going to go through the tedious process of connecting the dots to match what files are being updated to their respective KB numbers. Although in their defense, they may have just unknowingly came up with a great way to get the truth out of suspected terrorists. Only DOJ would never sanction it.

A list of included updates, at the very least, would be a list of the itemized KB numbers. And if Microsoft is feeling a little adventurous, maybe even a short description of each update? And if they’re REALLY feeling risqué, they could even make each KB number a hyperlink to the corresponding KB article!

All jokes aside though, they’ve done it for other updates and it’s honestly sad (though not shocking) and somewhat concerning that they didn’t do it for this rollup. Woody blogged about this on May 23rd. And hey, maybe the comments here are what prompted him to do so. The individual updates aren’t itemized in “Installed Updates” or in the “Update History.” Kinda makes you wonder if it was intentional, especially with all their underhanded snooping practices. Because let’s be honest, if Microsoft REALLY wanted to force telemetry on us, we would be none the wiser.

Yeah, I said it.

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Hey, they snuck that changed GWX dialog in under the wire. You’re right, they could slip in anything. Worse, since the telemetry’s encrypted (as it should be) we’d never know.

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