Is there a USB 3.0 adapter for “ancient” x1 PCIe 1.0 expansion slots?

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I just tried a Highpoint RocketU 1022C in two PCIe 1.0 motherboards:

one detected that card in Device Manager, but I would not install a working device driver

the other never detected that card at all, despite being a more modern ASUS  workstation motherboard

I’m thinking that USB 3.0 AICs were NOT seriously contemplated until PCIe 2.0 increased the raw clock rate from 2.5G to 5G per x1 lane:

5G / 10 bits per byte  =  500 MB/second, using the former “legacy frame”:

1 start bit + 8 data bits + 1 stop bit.

5G is the standard clock rate for good ol’ USB 3.0 ports:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USB_3.0

“Transfer speed – USB 3.0 adds a new transfer type called SuperSpeed or SS, 5 Gbit/s“

 

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I remember having some in stock years ago in the shop I worked in. They were no-name cards but had NEC/Renesas chips on them.

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SupremeLaW

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Many thanks for that tip.

FYI:  I installed that Highpoint RocketU 1022C in an HP PCIe 2.0 SFF workstation, running Windows 10 x64, and Windows installed the device driver no problema.

I plugged a USB 3.0 flash drive into one of the USB 3.0 ports, and it worked perfectly.

So, I’m pretty sure the problem was the Gen1 PCIe chipset in those 2 older PCs.

I’ll shop around for that Renesas controller.

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I just recently installed this adapter from Amazon in two 2011/12 vintage machines w/o issue and no drivers required. Both were running Win 10 Home 22H2!

As always YMMV!

May the Forces of good computing be with you!

RG

PowerShell & VBA Rule!
Computer Specs

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SupremeLaW

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Many thanks for that tip.

I did see that card during my search for a Gen1 compatible version.

I clicked on your link and found this:  “Based on PCIE 2.0 standard”

Do you know for sure what PCIe Gen you are using with that card?

My surviving theory is that PCIe 1.0 pre-dated USB 3.0, and the raw bandwidth of an x1 PCIe 1.0 lane is only 2.5Gbps, as compared to 5.0Gbps for USB 3.0.

I also suspect a LOT depends on the OS version and the driver.

I’m encountering problems with 2 ancient PCs now running Windows 7 Ultimate x64.

As such, here is my goal, if technically possible, in flow order:

x1 PCIe 1.0 expansion slot –> USB 3.0 add-in card –> 2.5GbE Ethernet USB 3.0 dongle

 

p.s.  I’ve tried 2 x Rosewill brand RC-20001 2.5GbE AICs, but neither worked:

https://www.neweggbusiness.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9B-33-166-146

The ASUS motherboard did not recognize it at all (model P5W64WS Pro).

The Intel motherboard (D915PGN) activates an annoying Option ROM at POST e.g. for booting from a LAN, and there is no way around that Option ROM except to remove the card completely.

Thanks again.

Bleeding-Edge out .

 

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such combination in such old PCs are usually “hit or miss” (meaning it either works or it does not)

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SupremeLaW

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Because the ASUS motherboard did NOT recognize the Rosewill RC-20001, there was not much in the way of error messages to help isolate that problem

I did learn something about the BIOS in our Intel D915PGN:

the Rosewill RC-20001 did install and operate correctly PROVIDED that I responded to its Option ROM menu with the correct answers, chiefly “SKIP BOOT FROM LAN”

on closer examination, I found a list of BIOS updates for that motherboard, which helped because its BIOS version was OLDER than the latest version in that list

later BIOS versions added a feature to DISABLE the “Boot from LAN” option

in the best of circumstances, flashing the latest motherboard BIOS might have actually enabled that RC-20001 to inter-operate properly withOUT launching that Option ROM menu during POST

the issue of “upstream bandwidth” has been a technical interest of mine for many years e.g. I was a staunch advocate of “syncing” the clock rates and frame layouts of chipsets and storage devices:

that finally did happen in PCIe 3.0:  8G per x1 lane + 128b/130b “jumbo frame”

as such, in theory there was much to recommend a 2.5GbE AIC in an x1 PCIe 1.0 expansion slot: i.e. SAME RAW BANDWIDTH

 

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just found this:

Sabrent CP-4PTU 4-Port USB 3.0 PCI Express Card

 

I’ll order one and try it:

https://sabrent.com/products/cp-4ptu

USB 3.0 interface (10X faster than USB 2.0)
Data transfer rate: up to 5Gbps
Supports 4-USB 3.0 Type A-ports
Compliant with PCI-Express revision 1.0a
Backward compatible to USB 2.0 & USB 1.1 specifications

more text from my hardware database:

Sabrent CP-4PTU 4-Port USB 3.0 PCI Express Card

The 4-Port USB 3.0 PCIe 1.0a Card from Sabrent is a host controller card
that upgrades your desktop PC to SuperSpeed USB 3.0.

The card has four USB 3.0 ports that are reverse compatible with USB 2.0 and USB 1.1 devices.

You can transfer files, photos, and videos at speeds of up to 5 Gb/s.

It is PCIe revision 1.0a compliant.

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several BAD reviews at Amazon:

https://www.amazon.com/Sabrent-USB-4-port-Express-Card/product-reviews/B0085IZU7C

e.g.

“Installed the card and driver in my Windows 7 x64 system. The card worked but I got the Blue Screen of Death from the driver every time I shut down my computer. I tried updating the driver, but that locked the computer up. I tried a bunch of other “tricks” to fix the problem, but those didn’t work either. I ended up throwing the card in the trash and restoring a previous backup of Windows.”

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I do have a Highpoint RocketU 1022C working correctly in an ASUS P5G41T-M LX motherboard, which has an Intel G41 chipset:

https://www.intel.com/content/dam/www/public/us/en/documents/product-briefs/g41-chipset-brief.pdf

see “500 MB/s each x1”

I believe that number “500” is total combined bandwidth, both directions.

Thus, 500 / 2  =  250 MB/second each x1

Consequently, 250 MB/second x 10 bits per byte (legacy frame)

=  2.5Gbps = PCIe Gen1

 

G41 chipset is PCIe 1.1

 

elsewhere, see:

“PCI Express* 1.1 interface provides 8 GB/s bandwidth“

assume x16 slot:  8 GB / 2  =  4 GB/s bandwidth, one direction

4 GB x 10 bits per byte  =  40 Gbps, one direction

x16 lanes x 2.5Gbps per lane  =  40 Gbps

 

Bottom Line:  motherboard chipset and BIOS version are important, controlling factors

 

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After many trials and many errors, too numerous to itemize here, I found a valuable tip on the Internet:

My “ancient” ASUS P5W64 WS Professional motherboard was expensive when purchased brand new, mainly because it has 4 x16 PCIe expansion slots:

either 16-0-8-0 or 8-8-4-8 lane assignments

If PCIe expansion slots are populated from “top-down” THEN not all slots will be recognized by the motherboard BIOS.

Here’s the TIP I found:

If PCIe expansion slots are populated from “bottom-up” then all slots will be recognized by the motherboard BIOS.

BUT, that PC must be RESTARTED after adding each additional card in that sequence.

So, we started with a GeForce GT 730 video card in the bottom x16 slot, and proceeded in that “bottom-up” sequence.

Now, a Vantec model UGT-PC345 USB 3.0 adapter is working, and it inter-operates just fine with a Sabrent NT-S25G 2.5GbE “dongle”.

That Vantec AIC also has one 20-pin USB 3.0 port, and EN LABS sell a Y-cable that terminates at 2 x USB 3.0 Type-A females:  so, this is a convenient and inexpensive way to add 2 more thumb drives inside a chassis e.g. for storage of OS drive images.

We like the SanDisk 256GB USB 3.0 models, because they always work out of the box, and the cost per gigabyte is incredibly low now.

I have one more test to perform:  upgrading to a QNAP 2.5GbE unmanaged switch.

The Sabrent NT-S25G allows auto-detection of the speed, and the speed can also be fixed with the CONFIGURE button in Network Connections.

Sabrent Tech Support also provided us with a link to the latest device driver, which installed with no further problems.

 

Bottom Line:  my theory about PCIe 1.0a bandwidth being equal to 2.5GbE adapters was mostly correct, EXCEPT FOR very peculiar obstacles caused by an “ancient” motherboard BIOS.

It’s also highly recommended to contact third-party adapter manufacturers to confirm that their adapters will inter-operate in PCIe 1.0a expansion slots.

 

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USB Type-A / Type-C to 2.5 Gigabit Ethernet Adapter

https://sabrent.com/products/nt-s25g

 

USB Type-A or Type-C to 5-Gigabit Ethernet Adapter

https://sabrent.com/products/nt-ss5g

 

4-Port Super Speed USB 3.0 PCIe Host Card w/ Internal 20-Pin Connector

Model <span class=”color04″>UGT-PC345</span>

https://vantecusa.com/products_detail.php?p_id=125&p_name=+4-Port+Super+Speed+USB+3.0+PCIe+Host+Card+w%2F+Internal+20-Pin+Connector&pc_id=16&pc_name=USB&pt_id=4&pt_name=Add-on+Cards

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Here’s another option for adding two more USB 3.0 thumb drives to that Vantec adapter:

Dual Port USB 3.0 to Motherboard Mainboard Internal 20pin /19pin Header Adapter ,20-pins to 2 X USB A Female Connector

https://www.newegg.com/black-en-labs-n-a-adapter/p/181-00WC-00003?Item=9SIACJF5AS7676

 

However, the housings on our SanDisk USB 3.0 thumb drives are too wide for two to fit comfortably in the latter 20-pin adapter.

Here’s the Y-cable that solves the latter problem:

Enlabs MB20P22U310IN 2 Port Internal USB 3.0 Motherboard 20-Pin Header to 2x USB 3.0 A 10-Inch Female Adapter Cable,USB 20pin to 2 x USB 3.0 Splitter Cable -Black

https://www.newegg.com/black-en-lab-10-inch-25cm-usb-cable/p/181-01CY-00002?Item=9SIACJF78J3081

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RESOLUTION SUMMARY:

BIOS in ASUS P5W64 WS Professional motherboard requires AICs to be installed “bottom-up” and not in any other sequence e.g. “top-down” does NOT work!

If “bottom-up” sequence is NOT followed, one or more expansion slots will disappear.

The required sequence is NOT documented, however.

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Hi SupremeLaW,

I’m wondering if you’ve done the following experiment with the USB 3.0 adapter attached to your computer with PCIe 1.1 revision hardware:

On a newer computer compute the MD5 hash (for the purposes of a checksum) of a large file that’s a few hundred (or few thousand!) megabytes. Copy that file to a USB thumb drive. Then plug that thumb drive into your older computer with USB 3.0 ports and copy the large file over to the hard drive, SSD, etc. Compute the MD5 hash. Does the hash on one computer match the hash on the other?

Like you I have an older computer that runs well enough to keep around, but I haven’t found a USB 3.0 card that works (the above test always fails — however files transferred via the USB 2.0 ports on the old computer are fine). I’ve read posts online that indicate signaling between current USB 3.0 add-in cards and older computers doesn’t match up, i.e. with cards built on a base of the PCIe 2.0 standard, or later. It’s interesting you came upon an order in which to plug-in add-in cards for proper functioning. In the past that’s something I haven’t considered.

For large file transfers I’ve been using a network transfer that works just fine, but properly functioning USB 3.0 would be nice to have as well.

Best Regards!

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