Image Backup / Portable Hard Drive

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Thanks to the suggestions here, I have purchased a Western Digital 2TB My Passport Portable Hard Drive (NTFS).  I obtained it to take an image of a computer I am planning to reluctantly upgrade from Windows 7 PRO to Windows 10 PRO.

Next I have to get software such as Macrium Reflect.

Questions:

Anyone have experience or suggestions on which software works better since I have never done this before?

Do I download and install the software on the Portable Hard Drive?

Do I have to partition the hard drive?  (Not even sure how I would do that or why).

Drive is only showing 1.81 TB available since I have “Install Discovery for Windows.exe” 1089 KB and “Install Discovery for Mac.dmg” 848 KB.  Not sure if I need these or if I could always download in the future if I did.  Should I remove them?

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Two of the recommended free backup software are Macrium Reflect and EaseUS Todo. Both are good.
You need to install the backup s/w on your PC, then create bootable Rescue Media, either CD or USB. You need to be sure you can boot from the Rescue Media.

To backup, you run the software on your PC and point it to save the image on your external HDD. You should backup your computer’s entire drive (all partitions).
I usually create a folder on the backup drive with the date of the backup, and have the backup save to that folder.

To restore an image, you have to boot from the Rescue Disk and point it to the backup on the external HDD you want to restore. You cannot restore from within the running PC.

1 user thanked author for this post.

Rush2112

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Thanks.  Will Macrium have instructions on how to create the Rescue Media?

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I am sure there is a manual on their site. And there is plenty of documentation on AskWoody if you use the Search box in the right woodgrain panel. A good place to start is the Tools Forum or the Windows Forums.

Or you can ask here

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ECWS

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Thanks.  What are your thoughts on this question:

Drive is only showing 1.81 TB available since I have “Install Discovery for Windows.exe” 1089 KB and “Install Discovery for Mac.dmg” 848 KB.  Not sure if I need these or if I could always download in the future if I did.  Should I remove them?

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I always create a CD or bootable USB.
You can leave those two programs on your drive. They take up very little space.

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ECWS

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Thanks PK for following up.

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[Bundaburra]

“To restore an image, you have to boot from the Rescue Disk …..”

You can also boot straight into the Macrium Rescue Environment, provided you have previously set it up (and provided your system is bootable).   Go to Other Tasks > Create Rescue Media, select “Windows Boot Menu” and follow the prompts.  It will create a kind of dual-boot situation, where you can either boot into Windows as normal (the default, in x seconds) or you can select the Recovery Environment.  Once this is set up, the value of x can be set in msconfig > boot > timeout.

If for some reason this does not work, then you can fall back to booting from the Rescue Disk.

Windows 10 Pro 64 bit 20H2

• This reply was modified 4 years, 8 months ago by Bundaburra.

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ECWS,

You can use Macrium Reflect Free, the best IMHO.

I’d recommend you install MR and on first run it will prompt you to make backup media. Just let it do it’s thing and point it to your portable drive.

When It’s done exit MR, reboot your machine and press what ever key you need to bring up the Windows Boot menu. Then select the portable HD and see if it boots. If it boots correctly, directly into MR you can close MR and it will automatically boot back into Windows.

Once Windows is loaded bring up File Explorer and create a directory/folder on the portable drive called MRImages or just Images. You’ll then direct all of your images to this directory. I’d suggest keeping at least three generations of images which is easy to setup in MR. Reference the MR support pages for details.

If you have any questions please post back.

HTH

May the Forces of good computing be with you!

RG

PowerShell & VBA Rule!
Computer Specs

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ECWS

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[ECWS]

Thanks for the detailed explanation.  Will I still need to create bootable Rescue Media on a USB drive or or will the Portable Hard Drive already have it following your instructions?

• This reply was modified 4 years, 8 months ago by ECWS.

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ECWS wrote:

Will I still need to create bootable Rescue Media on a USB drive or or will the Portable Hard Drive already have it following your instructions?

Yes, create the rescue media as well, belt and suspenders sort of thing.

Always create a fresh drive image before making system changes/Windows updates; you may need to start over!

We all have our own reasons for doing the things that we do with our systems; we don't need anyone's approval, and we don't all have to do the same things.

We were all once "Average Users".

Computer Specs

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johnf, Mr. Austin

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Thanks. If I create the bootable media on a USB drive, how big does it have to be? Drive is 250MB.  Should I have one of those for each computer?  Is that how the recovery partition is accessed?

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250MB is not big enough for a Rescue USB drive. Did you mean GB?

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My error – 250 GB SSD

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Yes, it will have the rescue bootable files. But like unbeaten says belt and suspenders!

May the Forces of good computing be with you!

RG

PowerShell & VBA Rule!
Computer Specs

2 users thanked author for this post.

johnf, ECWS

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ECWS wrote:

Will I still need to create bootable Rescue Media on a USB drive

Better create the bootable rescue media on a USB stick not the USB HDD.

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Alex, it works fine from a hard drive.

May the Forces of good computing be with you!

RG

PowerShell & VBA Rule!
Computer Specs

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I have a portable dvd player and keep all my rescue media on dvd disks one per backup system that I have , plus have iso files with the install disks and rescue media on them as well just in case.

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RetiredGeek wrote:

Alex, it works fine from a hard drive.

It does but in my opinion turning a data HDD into a bootable drive is not wise.
A dedicated USB stick is preferable.

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What is the minimum size for the USB or is a DVD better?

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ECWS wrote:

What is the minimum size for the USB or is a DVD better?

I would go with USB stick. 4GB is more then enough.
If I am not mistaken the rescue files are about 500-600 MB is size.

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Alex5723 wrote:

in my opinion turning a data HDD into a bootable drive is not wise. A dedicated USB stick is preferable

Having your portable disk bootable is really handy and does not prevent it being used for other things.

I used to set up bootable disks for the installers to image new PCs.
Boot PC to ext disk.
Run command to image PC.
Return in 10 minutes and reboot. All done.

cheers, Paul

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And it can be VERY handy to have ones backup disk bootable to the imaging s/w used

Just because you don't know where you are going doesn't mean any road will get you there.

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Would it make sense to have a bootable image as (I think) was suggested by Retired Geek and have a separate USB drive that I can boot from?  I guess this means I could boot from the USB drive in case I could not boot my computer.  Or – I could restore the image and then boot from there?

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It doesn’t matter which device is bootable, as long as you have one that runs the backup software so you can restore.

3rd party backup software has an option to create a bootable device, but it usually deletes existing data on the device first, so a separate USB stick makes it easy to update the image if required.

cheers, Paul

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Thanks.  Does this mean if I try to set up the 2TB Portable Hard Drive as bootable, it will wipe out the contents of the drive – even if I have images from other computers on it?

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Maybe! Depends on the image creation utility.

Put some files on a USB stick and create the backup recovery on that stick. Does it retain the files?

cheers, Paul

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I use Macrium Reflect, and I had to restore the image to my desktop about a month ago, just a few weeks after I installed Macrium Reflect.  All went well.

That said, let me tell you my earlier disaster with Macrium Reflect.  About a year ago, I installed Macrium Reflect and THOUGHT that I had installed everything and set it up correctly.  However, when the computer would not boot, I tried to install my backup image.  It turned out that I had not made a proper backup, and all that work was for nought.  Through the good graces of Ask Woody users, I was able to get back in the business anyway.

Do I recommend Macrium Reflect?  Yes.  However, its interface with a first-time user can be complicated.  Within the program, there is a feature that allows you to check the integrity of the backup.  It is important that you check that first backup, and also that you look at the contents of the backup USB drive periodically.  That will let you know that the backups it schedules ARE being properly handled.

THE IMPORTANT THING IS THAT YOU HAVE A BACKUP USING SOME SOFTWARE.

Macrium Free is a good way to do that.  After using it, you can decide whether the advanced features in the paid version are what you need.

 

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johnf

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Thanks for the warning.  Is the media you are using for backup (thinking that it is a Portable Hard Drive?) bootable or are you booting from a separate small (say 4GB) USB drive (instead of the PHD)?

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I am using a Seagate USB hard drive for the backups.  Macrium Reflect has a way, when you install it, to make a bootable USB stick.  I believe they said it should be at least 4 GB.  When you make the bootable USB stick, it deletes anything already on the stick.

When I had my crash, the problem was not the hard drive, but the computer would not boot.  Without the rescue media on the stick (or on a DVD), I would have been in trouble.

The computer in question is a Dell.  When I booted from the Macrium Reflect rescue stick, the computer kept trying to boot from the hard disk itself, but the Windows files were corrupted, and the  computer would not boot.  I discovered that I had to tell the computer to boot from USB as one of the choices on booting.  It was necessary to keep pressing the proper function key while the computer attempts to boot.  That brought up the screen that lets you list the boot sequence.  I added the USB stick option to the boot sequence.  The next time I tried booting, it went to the stick.  Then Macrium Reflect gave me a choice of installing the backup image on the computer.  That solved all my problems.

For your computer brand, you must determine the function key that brings up the boot choices.  I Googled it for the Dell.  (Someone on Ask Woody may know what it is for your computer.)

I thoroughly checked out the hard drive after I could successfully boot.  There was NOTHING wrong with the drive.  I still do not know how the Windows files got corrupted, but everyting is working well.

One final thought:  One feature of the paid version of Macrium Reflect is that it would allow you to put the backup on another machine, for example, another hard drive.  If my drive had been the culprit, I don’t believe Macrium Reflect free would have let me put it on a new drive.  That said, it is important that you have a backup, and Macrium Reflect is a great way to start.

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After I sent the above message, I learned that my computer problem (not booting) occurred right after a Windows 10 update.  The backup allegedly made by Windows to revert to the previous version failed.  The Windows update was the root cause of all my problems.

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Thanks for the detail and followup.  How did you make the bootable (rescue) USB stick and do you have one for each computer?  All of my computers are Dell Laptops E6540.  When I googled it, it said the function key was F12.  Would that be universal for all Dells?

If I understand you correctly, when you have to restore an image you instruct the computer to boot to the USB stick and then restore the image from the USB hard drive.  That means you do not set up the USB hard drive to boot ever and rely on the USB stick? Or do you make the USB Hard Drive bootable as an alternative?

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I recently installed [ https://www.macrium.com/reflectfree ] and have started using it, thus far only to do Backups; haven’t practiced any Restores yet.

I suggest that you download the PDF [ https://knowledgebase.macrium.com/display/KNOW72/Macrium+Reflect+User+Guide ] and skim through it first. Some sections are not applicable to the Free edition program; skip them.

I bought a 2TB Western Digital ‘Red Plus’ (CMR, not SMR, so I can use it elsewhere if I want to) internal drive and use it in an adapter case. Any new drive MUST be Partitioned and initialized before use. I created two partitions: 1TB for backups of various flavors, the remainder is not initialized yet.
I have two USB bootable flash drives, one each created for Windows 7 and 10.

The sizes shown here are from the folders’ Properties data, and are for my configurations. Your sizes will vary, but should be in the same ballparks. I have not analyzed to see why the two ‘sources’ folders are so different in sizes.

I prefer to use a bootable flash drive, this means 2 USB ports: one each for the flash drive and for the external. (But if the Portable has been initialized to be bootable then one needs only 1 USB port.) Boot from the flash, and use the screens to direct what and where you do things.

After reading the Guide, I created a boot flash and booted from it, then looked through all the screens. They are well presented. Finally set up the external drive and did a Backup.

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ECWS,

I’ve done it both ways (partition external HD & use USB Thumb Drive to boot) and they both work fine with Reflect. My current method is using the USB Thumb Drive since I have multiple normal HDDs that I use in a USB Dock and I can’t see loading the same thing on to multiple locations.  As far as booting you have two choices. One, you can set your BIOS to boot from USB first then you don’t have to worry just insert the bootable Thumb Drive and either reboot or turn the machine on depending. There  are two downsides to this method. One is a slightly longer boot time as the machine always has to check for bootable USB devices. Two is that depending on your hardware if you have both your USB Thumb Drive and your USB HDD plugged in it may check the wrong one first and report drive not bootable, this happens on my laptop. The other method is to know the key to press on your machine to get to the boot menu where you can select the drive to boot from, and yes F12 is the standard on Dell computer as all of mine are Dells.

HTH

May the Forces of good computing be with you!

RG

PowerShell & VBA Rule!
Computer Specs

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ECWS

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It does.  Thanks – appreciate the detail.

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Periodically an update for MR rolls out, I make bootable 1 DVDs and 2 USB sticks respectively for both laptops.  That way, if for some strange reason either the previously-tested-some-days- ago DVD or the USB stick does not boot, the other one usually will.  If/when a Restore is needed, one problem I do not want is:  “My only boot device for said laptop doesn’t boot.  Now what?”

"Take care of thy backups and thy restores shall take care of thee." Ben Franklin, revisted

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I’ve been an avid MR user for several years. I do my backups to a NAS and have successfully restored directly over the network one at least 4 occasions — 3x to recover a home PC/laptop that became corrupted and the other to move the OS to an SSD. A couple other really neat features are 1) the ability to mount an image like a drive and explore it to recover / restore individual files or folders and 2) to boot an and run an image (even over the network) — this one is slow, but I used it to fire up a program I had on an decommissioned computer that I still had the backup image for.

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Macrium gives two choices: Image or Clone.  Which did you use to move from a HDD to a SSD?

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PKCano wrote:

I always create a CD or bootable USB.
You can leave those two programs on your drive. They take up very little space.

  I do the same, except I make both DVD and USB boots, because in the past, sporadically a USB fails to boot (for whatever reason), and the DVD very rarely fails to boot.

"Take care of thy backups and thy restores shall take care of thee." Ben Franklin, revisted

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Just noticed that Macrium offers options to:

• Image selected disks on this computer
• Create an image of the partition(s) required to backup and restore Windows

In the middle of the program it says “Image this disk.”

What is the difference between these options?

 

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“Image this disk” is everything on the disk. This may be multiple partitions or only one.

“Image of the partition” is an individual partition. You may have an OS partition and a data partition and do a file backup daily, so you only need to backup the OS partition.

cheers, Paul

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Noticed today that Macrium shows three partitions on my disk.  How can I find out what these are.  Thought there was one reserve section for record and then the disk contents itself.

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Right-click on the 3rd partition, Open and see what’s inside.

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[ECWS]

Do you mean right click on Macrium which is running on my computer.  Or do I look on the backup? Or is there a way to look at it on my computer without affecting the contents?

Found it under Disk Management in Computer Management – could not right click though.

• This reply was modified 4 years, 4 months ago by ECWS.
• This reply was modified 4 years, 4 months ago by ECWS.

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[Alex5723]

You open disk management, right-click on the partition and select Open.

• This reply was modified 4 years, 4 months ago by Alex5723.

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Try using the free MiniTool Partition Wizard, there are others programs that will do the same, to let you r/click the partition to ‘Explorer’ its contents.

https://www.partitionwizard.com/download.html

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I would leave those partitions alone. 500MB will be Windows reservations for booting etc and can safely be ignored, except for system/disk backup.

cheers, Paul

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Alex5723

You open disk management, right-click on the partition and select Open.

You can’t do that with partitions that have no drive letters as in ECWSs case.

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Question regarding Macrium Reflect:

• There are three options when backing up.  Not sure how the first and second differ from each other.  Does the second one only image the backup system.  Is that the one I should use?  What is the difference between the two?
  • Image Selected Disks on this Computer
  • Create an image of the partition(s) required to backup and restore Windows
  • Create a folder and files backup
• Image/Clone
  • If I take an image will I be able to clone it to a different hard drive for example going from a regular hard drive to a solid state drive.
  • Does the drive have to be the same size (Presuming it is large enough to handle all data on Source Drive)

Thanks.

 

 

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[Paul T]

Image disks = copy everything, partitions, data, layout.

Image partition = everything, but only for that partition. Useful if you have the OS on a separate partition and just want to get a machine back up quickly without your data.

Folder and file = data only. You can’t get a broken Windows installation back with this.

Image = a copy of the details of the disk/partition and data, stored as backup files. You can restore this to almost anything that has enough space, a smaller disk, a larger one, the same size, SSD, HDD.

Create an image of your disk to external storage to give you a disaster recovery point, then just backup your data / changed data  –  smaller and quicker than an image.

cheers, Paul

• This reply was modified 4 years, 4 months ago by Paul T.

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Thanks Paul.

Looks like I should Image the entire drive and maybe also image a copy of the Windows Installation (once)?  Also, should I have Macrium verify the copy – takes substantially more time according to Macrium?

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ECWS wrote:

Image/Clone If I take an image will I be able to clone it to a different hard drive for example going from a regular hard drive to a solid state drive. Does the drive have to be the same size (Presuming it is large enough to handle all data on Source Drive)

You need the clone target drive to be the same size, or larger than the original.

https://knowledgebase.macrium.com/display/KNOW72/Macrium+Reflect+User+Guide

With Macrium Reflect, you can clone your system disks to enable you to swap failed disks out of your system and get things back up and running again in minutes.

Cloning is often confused with imaging. The process is identical but instead of storing data to a file, it replicates volume contents and disk structures to an alternative device. When the cloning process is complete, the target disk is identical to the original and contains a duplicate of all volumes, files, operating systems and applications.

Cloning a disk is particularly useful to upgrade an existing hard disk and in the event of a hard drive failure, you can simply replace the failed disk with a clone and have your system up and running again in minutes. However, cloning a disk is not an efficient way of backing up your data if it changes frequently because the clone will only contain one point in time as there is no ‘Backup Chain’ history that is available with Disk Images. Also, Disk Images can be compressed and saved to any location.

More information on how to clone your disk is in our KnowledgeBase article Cloning a disk.

Windows 10 Pro 22H2

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ECWS

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ECWS wrote:

maybe also image a copy of the Windows Installation (once)?

This is duplicating the work.
You can restore bits from a disk image backup in Macrium, e.g. one file, or a partition.

I never verify the backup and have not had issues accessing a backup – not that I do it often. Up to you – it’s your data.

cheers, Paul

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Interesting.  In Macrium I always verify the backup, because just once, a while ago at the end of the verification, I received a big red error message “VERIFICATION FAILED”.   Had I not seen this, I might not have known that the backup was potentially no good, and may have relied on it later.

(I don’t know why it failed.  I just ran the same backup again, and this time it worked.)

Windows 10 Pro 64 bit 20H2

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There may have been an issue with the check, not the backup – Windows can have issues holding snapshots open for extended periods.
It would have been interesting to verify rather than re-backup – from the Restore tab, Other Actions.

cheers, Paul

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JohnW

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Tring to get an Acronis Image of Windows 10 20H2, or an Image from Windows Backup to load and operate correctly.  After the image from either is restored, both get to the login screen, and after the Pin is entered, they sit with the spinner and Welcome and never get to Windows 10.  Startup Repair never finds anything wrong.  Windows 10 loaded from a Windows 10 bootable 20H2 ISO file works ok.  What else can I try to get one of these restored images to run properly?

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