How to configure storage in a new workstation

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We are going to be setting up new customizable HP Z2 G9 Tower Workstations (SKU: 4N3U9AV_MB) shortly.

The machines will be delivered with a single 256 GB PCIe 4×4 2280 Value M.2 SSD.

We plan on replacing the single 256 GB SSD with two 2 TB drives and then then clone the Windows 11 Pro operating system onto one of the new drives and then remove it from the system and put it away for safe keeping.

Our question is, what type of drives should we get – M.2 or SATA drives.  Speed is not an issue when acquiring the drives.

In the past we have configured our workstations with one Western Digital 2TB Blue SA510 SATA III 2.5″ SSD and one SATA 2TB 3.5 inch hard drive.  The hard drives being used for daily Acronis backups.

The workstations are setup to accommodate up to 5 drives as follows:

• An Internal M.2 storage                M.2 SSD
• A second Internal M.2 storage     M.2 2nd SSD,
• A third Internal M.2 storage        M.2 2nd SSD,
• An  Internal storage                        SATA 3.5″ HDD or SSD,
• A second Internal storage              SATA 3.5″ HDD or SSD.

So, the question is, what kind of drives should we acquire to populate the new systems?

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Mr. Austin, TechTango

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Kathy,

IMHO, and it’s just that!

I’d keep the 256G SSD as your boot/windows drive.
Just add a 2TB (or greater if needed) to accommodate your data.
Depending on the size of your programs you may want to put them in a partition on the 2TB drive. Definitely, keep your data on a separate partition if not a separate drive.
These steps will make it much easier to restore the boot/windows drive when necessary.

Use the Location tab of the Documents folders (Documents,Music,Pictures,Videos, etc) to move them to the 2nd drive, easy peasy.

Also, why store all those 256G SSD when you can store images of them on one big spinner? Maybe even keep a copy of that spinner? Much more efficient from a storage space/organization stand point. Just make sure you have an good naming convention or better yet store each image in a separate directory with the directory name being the computer name it goes to.

HTH

May the Forces of good computing be with you!

RG

PowerShell & VBA Rule!
Computer Specs

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opti1, Kathy Stevens

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RetiredGeek

Thanks for your thoughts.

My thinking on storage is evolving and it makes sense to leave the original 256G SSD as the boot/windows drive.

As our machines are set up now, we have a 2 TB C drive for Windows 10, programs, and data.

We back up the C drive to second 2TB drive every night after the close of business.

I will have to think about how to setup Acronis to back up two different drives to a third each evening.

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Mr. Austin

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Kathy,

If setup right you shouldn’t have to backup the Boot drive every night only after major changes, i.e. new software installation, or BEFORE patch Tuesday! The important stuff, your data, will all reside on the larger 2nd drive.

May the Forces of good computing be with you!

RG

PowerShell & VBA Rule!
Computer Specs

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opti1, Mr. Austin, Kathy Stevens

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I agree with RG, keep the M2 SSD as the OS and programs, and store all data on a single 2TB SATA (or 2TB M2).

This makes your standard “clone the boot drive” slightly harder because you need external M2 drive caddies. To get around this you could repurpose one of the old machines as a backup unit, image backup the machines to the backup unit and then restore to a caddy on the backup machine as you require. The backups can occur in the background without disturbing the users and you can create the clones at your leisure (so to speak).
You can also backup your data to the backup machine and backup the backup machine to external disks during the day for sending offsite.

cheers, Paul

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Looks like we will be adding 2TB WD BLACK SN850X NVMe SSDs with heatsinks to our new systems.

Or possibly 2TB Samsung SSD 990 Pros with heatsinks

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Mr. Austin

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I’m a fan of SSDs from well-known makers like Western Digital. Mebbe Kingston. The advantages of SSDs now far outweigh the advantages of the old-tech spinners. The last spinner to fail on me was an external, Seagate 8 TB backup drive (5,400 RPM?), which went unexpectedly kaput. Seagate’s once-legendary quality is now long-gone.

When configuring a new Windows 11 Pro system last year, I learned the hard way that it’s best to have a separate, dedicated boot drive – rather than having a big system drive which contains the All the Data According to Me.

The advantage in having a separate system drive is that when Windows goes widdershins for whatever unpleasant reason, all you’d have to do is restore the system drive image. And your actual files, your true gold, are all happily unmolested on a secondary drive.

These days it takes Acronis True Image 2025 (a Perpetual license, not a subscription) around 50 minutes to create its first, full image for my daily driver. Then mebbe 30 mins for its follow-on images. But that’s a configuration in which I don’t have a separate Windows system drive.

Human, who sports only naturally-occurring DNA ~ oneironaut ~ broadcaster

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Kathy Stevens

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I have been wrestling with the question how to configure storage in our new workstations now for over a week.

The first of the new computers are being delivered today and I will be opening the boxes for a quick peak inside tomorrow with set up probably at least a week away.

When all is said and done, we are going to continue our past practices of having two 2TB SSDs in each machine. After setting up Windows 11, we will clone the 256 GB PCIe 4×4 2280 Value M.2 SSD that shipped with each machine to one of the 2TB SSDs and remove it from the motherboard and put it away for safe keeping.

The two drives that will remain in the computers will be 2TB Western Digital BLACK SN850X NVMe SSDs with heatsinks.

From there we will use Laplink PcMover to transfer apps and data from the old computers to the new workstations.

Once all is well, we will continue out practice of:

• Using Acronis to back up the C drives of each computer to the second 2TB drive daily after the close of business,
• Using Acronis to backup the system to an external drives on Fridays,
• Coping all data files to an external drive on Fridays,
• Cloning the C drive to an external drive monthly just prior to updating Windows.

I want to thank everyone for their participation in the discussion.

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Mr. Austin

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Kathy Stevens wrote:

From there we will use Laplink PcMover to transfer apps and data from the old computers to the new workstations.

You obviously know exactly what you’re doing. And I if were in your shoes I’d be doing things in a very similar manner.

And I’ve used Laplink around three times. It used it was to transfer both the files and apps from an old Windows 10 desktop to a new Windows 11 laptop (my daily driver). Since that time, around a year ago, the Windows 11 box has had lots of issues with being able to awaken scheduled programs like Acronis, or Backup Outlook, or cloud backup client software apps. It just won’t run scheduled programs.

To get Acronis to run I have to log into the ‘sleeping’ machine and ‘awaken’ it.

I tried everything to solve it and nothing worked (including asking advice here). Eventually, a third-party tech group, and the machine’s maker, and Microsoft said that to solve the niggling sleep issues I’d probably have to put a factory image back into the box and then reinstall everything else.

So… I don’t know a workaround to solve the zombie sleep issue, but I strongly suspect that importing apps via Laplink PCMover from Win 10 to Win 11 to be the cause.

Human, who sports only naturally-occurring DNA ~ oneironaut ~ broadcaster

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Kathy Stevens

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Mr. Austin

I will try using Laplink first to move apps and data from an old Windows 10 machine to one of the new Windows 11 workstations.

If I run into problems, after setting up the new machine, I can always go back and use the 256 GB M.2 SSD drive that we took out of the new PC to clone the operating system onto the new 2TB SSD, set up Windows 11 again, install Microsoft Office the other apps from saved media, and then download files from and external drive.

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I  think you are making too much work for yourself (keeping the work). Having a large server and automating the backup will save you loads of time and give you fewer disks to track.
I’d come and do the job for you if I was close 🙂

cheers, Paul

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Kathy Stevens

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Paul T

I am having enough problems purchasing and setting up our new fleet of workstations and am afraid that configuring, setting up, running, and maintaining a server is beyond my capability.

We have been running and backing up standalone computers for over a decade without a problem.

It seems to me that every month there are more issues when trying to update Windows on computers tied to servers than standalone units.

Then there are the security issues.  We deal with a huge volume of sensitive data drawn from numerous “highly sensitive” sources. It seems to me that computers tied together via a server poses a greater risk to our data suppliers and customers than our stand-alone units.

So bottom line, we will continue to backup our systems using the methodology that has not failed us over the last ten years.

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WSbobby-p

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A server is just a Windows machine with lots of disks (you have them) in a RAID configuration. You then create a share user on the server and use that to connect from the remote machines. The remote machines remain independent and require no changes.

Alternatively, a Synology DiskStation DS1621+ or similar will take 6 of your existing 2TB disks to give you 10TB (RAID5) with protection from mal/ransomware. Again, the workstations remain independent.

cheers, Paul

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TechTango, Kathy Stevens

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Kathy Stevens wrote:

If I run into problems, after setting up the new machine, I can always go back and use the 256 GB M.2 SSD drive that we took out of the new PC to clone the operating system onto the new 2TB SSD

Good idea. Smooth sailing to you!

Human, who sports only naturally-occurring DNA ~ oneironaut ~ broadcaster

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Kathy Stevens

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Kathy Stevens wrote:

2TB WD BLACK SN850X NVMe SSDs with heatsinks

Reviews of this drive on Amazon (which are excellent, by the way) say that these don’t come with the screw to hold them in place in their slot. So, you’ll want to make sure that for each of your new computers you don’t lose the one that’s already there for the existing 256GB drive and you may want to have extras on hand in case your motherboards don’t have them for the empty slots you’ll be filling. Or at least check those empty slots when you crack open that first one to check it out. One definition of pretty frustrating is to have to stop cold in configuring your computer to run out and try to find a local source that has these screws for you to buy before you can complete configuring.

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Kathy Stevens, Cybertooth

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opti1

Your post came just in the nick of time.

Picked up two of the HP Z2 G9 Tower Workstations (SKU: 4N3U9AV_MB) this morning and was just about ready to place and order for four 2TB WD BLACK SN850X NVMe SSDs with heatsinks from B&H Photo.

Looked inside one of the PCs and sure enough there are no screws in the empty SSD slots on the motherboard.

So, the question now is where can I get the proper size screws?

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Kathy Stevens wrote:

So, the question now is where can I get the proper size screws?

This is where someone who builds their own computers needs to weigh in.

I found this from Crucial:

“M.2 Screw sizes are not standardized in all systems so if the screw that is included with your [Crucial] SSD does not fit into the standoff in your PC you will need to contact the system or motherboard manufacturer to find out the correct sizes needed“.

https://www.crucial.com/support/articles-faq-ssd/about-m2-ssd-screws

If you can get access to the service manual for your computers it may tell you the specifications for the M.2 SSD screws you need for the motherboard in your new computers.

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Kathy Stevens

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I have found the HP part number for the missing screws.

It is N45593-001  (SPS-SCREW KIT Z2).

Found some on ebay.

But would prefer to purchase them from a recognized vendor.

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TechTango

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Looks like I will be able to find M.2 mounting kits at NewEgg.

Now I have to figure out which kit(s) to buy.

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Be careful as you need 2 parts for the mount.
The first part is a “spacer” that has male and female threads. This screws into the motherboard where the top of the new M2 disk goes. Before installing the disk you must install the spacer.
The second is the “holding screw” which screws into the spacer after the M2 disk has been installed.

If you are replacing an M2 disk with a bigger M2 unit, then you must move the spacer before attempting to install the new M2 disk.

cheers, Paul

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Kathy Stevens

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Thank you Paul T

Our new workstations have turned into a significantly bigger project than I had anticipated.

Now I have to figure out what motherboard is in the systems so that I can order the correct spacers and “holding screws”

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Screw kits should all be the same, per my link. The M2 drives are all the same apart from length and the mount is the same.

cheers, Paul

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Kathy Stevens

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Paul T

My concern is not the M drive itself.

My concern is the motherboard. Is there an industry standard with respect to the size of screw mothers accept?

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Kathy Stevens wrote:

Is there an industry standard with respect to the size of screw mothers accept?

Kathy, there are standard sizes of screws for standard sizes of motherboards (mounting screws for the motherboard to the back panel, hold-down screws for PCI or PCIe card slots, etc.).  ATX and usually µATX motherboards use the same sizes, and the screw size and mount of M.2 NVMe SSD’s is typically the same.

Always create a fresh drive image before making system changes/Windows updates; you may need to start over!

We all have our own reasons for doing the things that we do with our systems; we don't need anyone's approval, and we don't all have to do the same things.

We were all once "Average Users".

Computer Specs

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Kathy Stevens, Paul T

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bbearren

So if I understand what you are saying, the M.2 SSD Mounting Screw Kits available from microcenter    https://www.microcenter.com/product/600435/micro-connectors-m2-ssd-mounting-screws-kit  should be compatible with the motherboard in HP Z2 G9 Tower workstations.

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It looks as if I have determined the right M2 standoffs and screws to use.

They are listed for use in ASUS ITX, Gibabyte, and MSI mother boards, but appear to work in Z2 G9 workstations.

The standoffs are 2.5mm high vs. 6mm or more for other motherboards.

Will open the tower’s case and double check.

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Kathy Stevens wrote:

Will open the tower’s case and double check.

You’ll know for sure, then.

Always create a fresh drive image before making system changes/Windows updates; you may need to start over!

We all have our own reasons for doing the things that we do with our systems; we don't need anyone's approval, and we don't all have to do the same things.

We were all once "Average Users".

Computer Specs

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Just found and ordered the elusive spacers and screws needed to install 2TB WD BLACK SN850X NVMe SSDs with heat sinks into our new HP Z2 G9 Tower Workstations (SKU: 4N3U9AV_MB).

I found them at Walmart.

https://www.walmart.com/ip/863823-001-Hp-Screw-Kit-24-B010-TOUCH/798981232

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Mr. Austin

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That link doesn’t look right to me, no spacers.

I would expect the spacers to be longer than 2.5mm – they are on my Dell tower.

This Amazon link seems right (4.5mm).
Or this one at Walmart.
You may have to try a few to get the right length…

cheers, Paul

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This thread seems to have the right (blue) ones.

cheers, Paul

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Kathy Stevens

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The images of “screws, etc,” in the most recent thread you posted do not match those inside of the case of our new workstations.

That is all for now, I am off for the holiday.

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Found the correct “screws”.

1 x Caddies & Trays: HP 450712-001 – Hard Drive Isolation Grommet Blue Mounting Screws for DC7800 DC7900 6000 6005 Pro 8000 8100 Elite

https://www.cpumedics.com/caddies-trays-hp-450712-001-hard-drive-isolation-grommet-blue-mounting-screws-for-dc7800-dc7900-6000-6005-pro-8000-8100-elite/

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I don’t like the look of those ones. They use self tapping screws and disks are always (IME) installed using machine thread screws.

Kathy, can you please take the SSD out of one of the workstations and take a photo of the screw and mount?

cheers, Paul

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Paul T

See the enclosed pictures

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I can’t see the thread on that. Can you take a shot of the hole in the mobo?
And the end of the screw?

cheers, Paul

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Kathy Stevens

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Paul T

Do the following pictures help?

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That’s fantastic, we can see exactly how it works.
You have a long screw with a machine thread and a holding device (blue) that is held in place by the screw. There is no standoff to screw in before installing the SSD.

The ones you have found on ebay look right, apart from being black – there is discussion of the black and blue being different. I would measure your blue one and ask the seller to do the same before buying.
Measure overall length.
Measure the distance between the bottom and the slot in the middle. (I  would buy a small metric ruler to measure it, if you can find one. Doing that in inches is ugly!)

cheers, Paul

p.s. have you asked HP for those parts? May be more expensive but they will be right.

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Kathy Stevens

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Hopefully I have found the correct standoffs and screws for SSD drives

https://www.ebay.com/itm/284944863690

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Quote from the link in @Paul T‘s post# 2720829 (note the part I highlighted.)

There are two HP types… some have blue plastic and some have black plastic as part of their build. Either type is meant to firmly slip onto the “rear” half-round notch of a M.2 stick, but their center screws are of two different sizes. Central in the plastic is a finely machined brass nut with a specially milled steel screw running through that. The notch in the plastic keeps the M.2 stick properly elevated above the motherboard. This is almost nanotechnology… In some of the HP/Compaq PCs they just use plain old inexpensive M2-threaded metric screws. The more advanced ones are not cheap for HP to make, but they are easy to lose. See install tip below.

Since your existing screws/standoffs are blue, the black ones in the link you posted won’t work (the screws will be the wrong size for your motherboard.)

What you need are these blue ones which exactly match the pictures you posted.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/286024714543

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Kathy Stevens, Paul T

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n0ads wrote:

Since your existing screws/standoffs are blue, the black ones in the link you posted won’t work (the screws will be the wrong size for your motherboard.) What you need are these blue ones which exactly match the pictures you posted.

This gets so confusing and it appears it’s not easy to sort it out.

Is there any standard meaning attached to the colors of screws/standoffs or are the colors just a random choice by the manufacturer?

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Random choice by the manufacturer!

cheers, Paul

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Cybertooth

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Also confusing, “most” computers include the appropriate screws/standoffs (and sometimes even “peel & stick” heatsinks) for all the M2 slots on the motherboards in the PC’s they sell, regardless of whether you actually ordered any M2 cards when you purchased it.

For example…

My Aunt’s Dell Optiplex desktop came with screws/standoffs for all 3 M2 slots even though she ordered it with only one M2 drive.

My Asus ROG Maximus XI Gene motherboard came with screws/standoffs & M2 heatsinks for all 4 M2 slots.

Obviously HP doesn’t do this with the PC’s it sells… which, IMHO, is a good reason not to give them a 5 star rating!

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wavy, Bob99, opti1

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Corporations are so money focused these days that I wouldn’t be surprised if there is someone at HP who probably can tell you exactly how much money they save by NOT putting those screws in the motherboards and they’re probably even trying to figure out how not to have to provide that one screw to fasten in the M.2 drive they install at the factory.

 

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It has been an interesting adventure.

We purchased customizable HP Z2 G9 Tower Workstations (SKU: 4N3U9AV_MB) from HP during their ongoing Black Friday sale.  According to HP the units were marked down from $2,007.00 to $1,003.50 each with free shipping.

During the customization process we discovered that HP wanted:

• $1,005.00 to install each 2 TB HP Z Turbo Drive TLC M.2 SSDs vs. $134.99 to purchase WD_BLACK 2TB SN850X NVMe Internal SSDs with Heatsinks from newegg and
• $120.00 to install 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR5-4800 UDIMM Memory vs. $82.99 for Crucial Pro 32GB (2 x 16GB) DDR5 6000 (PC5 48000) Desktop Memory Model CP2K16G60C48U5 also from newegg.

The savings were obvious and I had installed SSDs and memory before so no problem – I would take advantage of the $1,777.03 savings on each workstation between what HP wanted to charge vs. what newegg was charging for two SSDs and one 2 x 16 GB UDIMM Memory package for each workstation.

Then the adventure began. I discovered, after receiving the first two HP Z2 G9 Towers, that the screws/standoffs for the two empty SSD slots on each motherboard were missing.

Then the quest began in earnest:

• Contacted HP’s help line multiple times to get part numbers for the missing screws and standoffs – no luck.
• Searched the tower’s data sheet – no luck.
• Searched the tower’s Quick Specs sheet – no luck.
• Searched the Maintenance and Service Guide HP Z2 Tower G9 Workstation Desktop PC – no luck.
• Started the AskWoody topic, “How to configure storage in a new workstation” and got lots of help determining what was needed.
• Started searching vendors websites that “suggested” that they could provide the appropriate screws/standoffs and ended up ordering three sets of screws and standoffs.

Now it is a matter of wait and see if anyone delivers usable screws and standoffs.

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TechTango, Cybertooth

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It may be small consolation, but had you purchased those HP systems with the same specs at full price, you’d probably still have had to pay that additional $1005 for them to install the HP Z Turbo drives.

HP used to have complete and detailed documentation for all their systems online. You can still get a lot of stuff, but (for example) finding motherboard diagrams and specs is a crapshoot: there may or may not be any for the specific system that one purchased.

 

Keep Running Windows 7 Safely for Years to Come  
Make Windows 10 look and work like Windows 7

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Kathy Stevens

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Kathy, you got me thinkin’. I have to have Lenovo solve my daily driver’s noisy/growling fan problems (ThinkPad P16, Gen2).

And since new the machine has *never* properly awakened to run scheduled tasks, including Acronis, I’m getting an estimate for Lenovo to reinstall a factory Windows 11 image to try and solve its sleep issues.

The box currently has one, 2TB SSD drive, their “M.2 2280 PCIe Gen4 Performance TLC Opal”.

But I’d instead have them install the factory image onto a separate, 512GB system-only drive.

Human, who sports only naturally-occurring DNA ~ oneironaut ~ broadcaster

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