Excluding drivers from Windows Update in Win10 (a WU option)?

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This from EP:

This might be old news but the Windows 10 beta build 15002 in early January 2017 had a new Windows Update setting to either include or exclude drivers from downloading thru Windows Update.  Example of the new Windows Update setting to include driver updates is posted on this Ten Forums page:

https://www.tenforums.com/tutorials/48277-driver-updates-windows-update-enable-disable-windows-10-a.html

then in beta build 15019 released near the end of January that option for the Windows Update settings was removed (awww nuts!)

I hope someday Microsoft restores that option to include/exclude drivers from downloading thru Windows Update in a later feature update for Win10 (seems like it may not make it into the upcoming 1703 creators update).

But at least in v1607 release of Win10, there’s a group policy option to not include drivers with Windows Updates (only available to Pro, Education & Enterprise users).

I think I’ll make the permanent switch to Win10 IF Microsoft can include that new Windows Update option to include or exclude device driver updates, instead of Win10 users resorting to use the “metered” connection trick and/or the WUShowHide.diagcab tool to hide or block driver updates.

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There was big misunderstanding of that option and a lot of misinformation spread around that option which never worked as most people understood it.

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This newer setting was only available to Insider Preview Fast Ring for three weeks.

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It is available in Windows 10 1607 and Windows Server 2016 – see snapshot

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The policy is but the setting isn’t. (As explained in the first post.)

Do you have any links to the misunderstandings or misinformation? (Because I think that was a different setting.)

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The setting is available and working.

Only that there were no drivers bundled with Quality Updates yet.

Most people did not understand the wording of the description and they believed that the policy operates on driver updates in general.

 

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The setting being discussed here (Settings, Update & security, Windows Update, Update settings, Advanced Options, Choose how updates are installed, Include driver updates when I update Windows) is not available in 1607 (or anywhere else now/yet).

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Nah, MS is steering towards Apple business model – you either accept what is thrown at you (you may even love it and tell everybody that it’s the best thing in the world) or go the the other side of the fence :).

You may own your hardware, but you won’t be able to fully control it with your software.

 

BTW: I saw a Windows XP Professional screensaver on some computer at Copehagen airport yesterday :). Always nice to see a system that simply does its job :).

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Woody’s been promising to cover this group policy option for four months:

https://www.askwoody.com/forums/topic/woodys-win10-tips/#post-24691

https://www.askwoody.com/forums/topic/how-to-roll-back-a-bad-driver-update/#post-15440

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@ b

The 2 links that you provided do not indicate any PROMISE by Woody to do as you suggested.

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I must have misinterpreted “If you have a tip, a tool, or want me to look into a topic for a tip, hit me in the comments here.”, and “Good point. I should add that to this discussion.”

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There was also “The “Do not include drivers” setting, along with wushowhide, will be the subject of a later article that discusses how to block specific patches.”
https://www.askwoody.com/forums/topic/woodys-win10tip-block-forced-updates-in-windows-10/#post-24217

But Woody’s Win10Tip: Apply updates carefully only included wushowhide.

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@ b

There’s a new series on InfoWorld’s Woody on Windows called Woody’s Win10Tips. The tips are targeted at people who just want to use Windows 10 and get on with their lives. And they’re in the usual “Woody” style – to the point, no bull, no marketing fluff. They (intentionally!) aren’t long enough to discuss all of the nuances. But they do point in the right direction.

Posts start on November 1.

If you have a tip, a tool, or want me to look into a topic for a tip, hit me in the comments here. There’s a tab up at the top of this page summarizing the tips and pointing you to them.

https://www.askwoody.com/2016/woodys-win10-tips/

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I’m afraid you lost me. I have no idea what point you’re trying to make.

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@ b

Win 10 Tips = a useful piece of information, especially about how to do something.

b said, “When will you be covering (as promised) the “Do not include drivers with Windows Updates” policy available since Windows 10 version 1607?”

The above are 2 different matters.

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Many thanks for defining tips for me.

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@ b

IOW, if you have a tip, a tool, or want Woody to look into a topic for a tip, hit him in the comments here, …
https://www.askwoody.com/forums/topic/woodys-win10-tips/

This is likely different from a Lounger requesting Woody to cover a certain topic or discussion. Loungers can also make their own topics in the forum.

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I did. (As in my first link, which you read.) It didn’t get anywhere.

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Since you asked :-)….

The Technet article

https://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/itpro/windows/manage/waas-configure-wufb

says:

In Windows 10, version 1607, you can selectively option out of receiving driver update packages as part of your normal quality update cycle. This policy will not pertain to updates to inbox drivers (which will be packaged within a security or critical update) or to Feature Updates, where drivers may be dynamically installed to ensure the Feature Update process can complete.

The gpedit policy says:

Enable this policy to not include drivers with Windows quality updates.

The setting, which is only in beta build 15019 (I think) says:

Choose how updates are installed, Include driver updates when I update Windows

The terminology is different and confusing. All three descriptions appear to apply to the same setting.

ch100 notes, above, that if you enable this policy, Windows Update will not include drivers in its “Quality” updates – which I take to mean cumulative updates. We haven’t seen drivers in cumulative updates for a long time, as best I can tell. People expected that enabling this policy would keep Windows Update from installing ANY driver updates. That appears to be incorrect. See

This discussion:

https://social.technet.microsoft.com/Forums/office/en-US/d9c825c2-43ff-428d-af10-f58d7035b9fb/how-do-you-stop-windows-10-pro-update-from-updating-nvidia-graphics-driver?forum=win10itprogeneral

Seems to imply (but doesn’t state) that you have to turn on the setting and THEN use wushowhide, in order to block driver updates. That’s absurd. wushowhide works independently of this setting.

This discussion:

https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/windows_10-hardware/windows-10-continues-to-overwrite-graphics-drivers/06421673-9e19-458a-8b0e-26f0d3781ad8

Points to either a bug in the setting, or at best a real confusion in the terminology used.

This discussion:

https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/windows_10-update/will-windows-fix-their-update-feature-for-drivers/68a0b725-b741-46be-bb45-9247eb989712

implies that the setting didn’t work – the only way to turn off automatic updating of the Nvidia driver is to turn off the Nvidia streaming service.

What’s happening? I haven’t a clue. The setting is so poorly described/documented that I’m still scratching my head.

4 users thanked author for this post.

Elly, PKCano, satrow, ch100

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ch100 notes, above, that if you enable this policy, Windows Update will not include drivers in its “Quality” updates – which I take to mean cumulative updates.

This is my current understanding, but what it should be in reality, is everyone’s guess.

The other explanation about the inbox drivers or those installed with Feature Updates (1511, 1607, 1703…) seems to be exactly what is happening.

Installed drivers are automatically updated only if Microsoft considers that there is a mandatory update (Security, Critical) or during installing a new version of Windows.

For devices with no drivers installed and for which there are drivers available at Microsoft, they will get automatically the suitable drivers.

Any other updates are treated as Optional and are installed (without warning) only when the user with admin rights right-clicks the device in Device Manager and scans for new drivers at Microsoft.

This seems to be happening as documented, but there are always chances that the behaviour may not be as expected, as this is one of those areas (like all Windows Updates for Windows 10) where confusion is created on purpose for the “better good of the society”. 🙂

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satrow, woody, PKCano

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woody wrote:

This discussion:

https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/windows_10-update/will-windows-fix-their-update-feature-for-drivers/68a0b725-b741-46be-bb45-9247eb989712

implies that the setting didn’t work – the only way to turn off automatic updating of the Nvidia driver is to turn off the Nvidia streaming service.

What’s happening? I haven’t a clue. The setting is so poorly described/documented that I’m still scratching my head.

I’m pretty sure that it’s the GeForce Experience (quite a new optional nVidia component/standalone) that’s responsible for the driver auto-updating, and the streaming service is for pushing graphics output to a nVidia SHIELD handheld gaming device.

With a custom nVidia install it’s possible to run with just the Display Driver Service plus the Driver Helper Process.

Preventing Windows(MS) Update from installing drivers should only block MS servers from pushing driver updates, not nVidia servers.

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ch100, woody, PKCano

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@ b

October 31, 2016 at 7:55 am … b said, “Please cover “Do not include drivers with Windows Updates (ExcludeWUDrivers)”, which is new in 1607:
https://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/itpro/windows/manage/waas-configure-wufb”

No, you did not ” if you have a tip, a tool, or want Woody to look into a topic for a tip, hit him in the comments here = https://www.askwoody.com/forums/topic/woodys-win10-tips/”, ie you were actually requesting Woody to cover a certain topic.

IOW, Woody only made a promise to commenters about Win 10 Tips, ie he did not make any promise to commenters who request him to cover a certain topic. It would be foolish of Woody to make a promise to fulfill every request from commenters.
You really likely have misinterpreted Woody’s statements.

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Let’s leave it at that, shall we?

I’m getting dizzy trying to figure out what I promised and when. The post here is the best I know on the topic.

1 user thanked author for this post.

Elly

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@ b

Also,
https://www.askwoody.com/forums/topic/woodys-win10-tips/

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Hey, I’m all ears.

What I’ve seen:

• The 1607 group policy “Do not include drivers with Windows updates” doesn’t work the way people thought it would.

https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/windows_10-hardware/why-doesnt-do-not-include-drivers-with-windows/2f22af44-d772-443f-9eb2-384df188f216

• 15019 had a Setting for it that may or may not have worked. We didn’t have any driver updates to be able to test it and, anyway, it disappeared in 15031

Sounds like it’s a mess. Anything I’ve missed?

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I think in 1607 should be like here, in my reply above

The setting is available and working.

Only that there were no drivers bundled with Quality Updates yet.

Most people did not understand the wording of the description and they believed that the policy operates on driver updates in general.

 

The description of the policy is clear enough for me

Enable this policy to not include drivers with Windows quality updates.

If you disable or do not configure this policy, Windows Update will include updates that have a Driver classification.

 

Supposedly there are, although I don’t know of any, quality updates (previously named simply Updates, Important or Recommended, rarely Optional) including drivers.

WU seems to allow for those releases in Windows 10 and Windows Server 2016, at least according to this policy.

The registry key/value when this policy is enabled becomes:

HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Policies\Microsoft\Windows\WindowsUpdate

ExcludeWUDriversInQualityUpdate    REG_DWORD    1

 

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woody

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When you say “Quality Updates” you’re talking specifically about Cumulative Updates, right? Microsoft’s marketing terminology drives me nuts.

There were Cumulative Updates in 1507 and 1511 that included drivers. They broke many machines. I don’t recall seeing any driver updates inside Cumulative Updates since 1607. Does that match what you’ve seen?

Many drivers have been released as separate entries in Win10 Update. But I don’t think they’re bundled with Cumulative Updates any more. If that’s the case, this setting in 1607 is useless. And it makes me wonder why MS brought it back for 15019…

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ch100

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Strictly speaking Quality Updates are any previously (Windows 7 in “normal” times and before) Updates. They include Critical Updates (those under true Important) and Recommended Updates and to less degree the Optional Updates.

Quality Updates in this context are those meant to improve (Recommended), correct (Critical/Important) or install new features (Optional), which means anything else than Security Updates.

It should be noted here that Optional Updates in more recent times have been defined as either bringing new features (old style Optional, RDP 8/8.1 components for Windows 7, Platform Update for Windows 7, Hyper-V extensions) or preview updates (new style Optional).

So in summary, anything non-security qualifies as “Quality”.

This leaves us with only two types of updates: Quality and Security instead of four types previously, although even before the label of Update (now called Quality) was unique, only the flagging in WU was different.

In modern times, which means after October 2016, Quality Updates are or will be most of the times cumulative, but the cumulative updates can and do often bundle Quality with Security updates in one item.

Hope this post does not confuse readers more than Microsoft’s own documentation 🙂

 

 

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Elly

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There were Cumulative Updates in 1507 and 1511 that included drivers. They broke many machines

I was not aware of those releases and the purpose of the Group Policy in 1607 is likely to address those updates. But how would those updates be selectively installed to update Windows Components while leaving drivers out?

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Microsoft seems to have already released documentation for Windows 10 1703.

Have a look here:

https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/hardware/commercialize/customize/mdm/new-in-windows-mdm-enrollment-management#whatsnew10
What’s new in Windows 10, version 1703

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Elly, woody

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Which means that the files for the new version will be timestamped March, 17 or around that date and the expected official release for CB will be early April 2017.
Those more inclined to install the leaked (unofficial) distributions, will have them available around or even before March, 17.

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Likely. It’s starting…

https://www.askwoody.com/2017/windows-10-beta-build-15042-64-bit-only-is-out/

Build 15042 has no watermark, no expiration notice.

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ch100

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Excellent article here on what’s new in the upcoming Creators Update (aka Redstone 2):

https://www.howtogeek.com/278132/whats-new-in-windows-10s-creators-update/

From the section “More Control Over Windows Update” — updates can be paused for up to 35 days, and driver updates can be disabled – except on Windows 10 Home edition. The number of Active Hours can be set to 18, up from the current 12…

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Elly

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It’s a great article but… but…

It looks like the new “pause updates” setting is bringing the old 1607 group policy into the Settings app, which is all well and good – and commendable – but I still don’t understand how the group policy works, and thus don’t understand exactly what “up to 35 days” means.

See http://www.infoworld.com/article/3155912/microsoft-windows/windows-10-beta-build-15002-brings-real-improvement.html

The “Include driver updates” setting doesn’t appear in the latest beta build, 15042, as mentioned above. I have no idea why it was pulled, but it’s possible people found it too confusing. I’m still confused, too.

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Dunno about the driver updates setting — the How-To Geek article was based on Insider build 15031…

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KootchieKoo wrote:

How-To Geek article was based on Insider build 15031

Yep, and 15042 changed it completely.

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woody wrote:

It looks like the new “pause updates” setting is bringing the old 1607 group policy into the Settings app, which is all well and good – and commendable – but I still don’t understand how the group policy works, and thus don’t understand exactly what “up to 35 days” means.

My assumption is: Pause for 35 days, unless explicitly/manually unpaused before then; otherwise it will automatically unpause after 35 days.

Like many Windows 10 Settings, it seems to me that the design team knew what the intention was so the wording wasn’t too crucial, but they’ve never shown each new setting to any user group and said, “Is it immediately obvious what this setting actually does and why you might want to use it?”

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woody

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b wrote:

My assumption is: Pause for 35 days, unless explicitly/manually unpaused before then; otherwise it will automatically unpause after 35 days. Like many Windows 10 Settings, it seems to me that the design team knew what the intention was so the wording wasn’t too crucial, but they’ve never shown each new setting to any user group and said, “Is it immediately obvious what this setting actually does and why you might want to use it?”

That’s precisely the problem. The new group policy (build 15042) is completely inscrutable. There’s no indication how the two entries in the group policy interact – if they interact at all.

It looks like one of the entries in group policy has been brought to the main UI in the Settings app, but it also isn’t clear what that entry will do and how/if it’ll interact with (or override) the entries in the policy.

It’s an absolute mess. And I need to explain to people what’s going on….

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