Brad Sams: Re-org of Windows organization coming

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Yesterday’s Sam’s Report included this fascinating comment from Brad Sams: There might be a re-org inside the Windows world after Redstone 5 [Windows
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Elly, WildBill, AlexEiffel

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Wasn’t there a recent reorg of the Windows group? This smells like Windows is slowly being put out to pasture to be euthanized eventually.

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HiFlyer

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Eventually, there will only be WaaS. It’s going the same way as Office. Subscription, no independent installs.

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HiFlyer

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And with Microsoft calling the shots about what this Windows “service” will do, there’s less and less incentive for them to keep providing APIs that allow third-parties to “sideload” software (not that such a term actually has any business being applied to real PCs, but MS seems determined to make it fit).  A general-purpose OS is expected to be able to run just about anything, but a service can be whatever the service provider says it is, and you can take it or leave it.

Microsoft has been looking at the iOS walled garden (again something that would have no business being applied to real PCs) and drooling over the profit potential, and while I have my doubts that they can successfully force Windows into that box, it certainly does look like they’re going to attempt it even at the risk of killing Windows off completely.

Whatever the outcome, it seems evident that the days of Windows as what it has always been (a general purpose desktop OS) are numbered.  If MS can’t make “Apple” level profits from Windows, it seems that they have no use for it. It will either be transformed into something far more profitable for MS, or it will die (and being forced into something far more profitable effectively kills it for those of us looking for what it used to be rather than what it will become).

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HiFlyer, BobbyB

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The walled garden for Apple is based on being both the device and OS manufacturer. So when you buy an Apple device Apple is providing the OS and some software in the price. On Macs one can ‘side load’ software and ignore the walled garden; I do not know how easy it is to side load on an iPhone. Macs are still general purpose devices with an optional walled garden.

For MS to make money off the walled garden is there has to be strong incentive for one to use it. One possible incentive would be that all software installed is updated through it. But this has to include traditional W32 programs as well as ‘apps’ or it is pointless to use.

Linux distros use a ‘walled garden’ approach. But unlike MS, they are not trying to make money off the repository. They are using the repository to centralize distro maintenance and access to curated applications. Depending on the distro, there may be a ‘user repository’ or PPA system to install unofficial applications and have them also monitored by the package manager.

Drooling over the potential profits of a walled garden misses the primary advantage to a user of one. It is the convenience of being able to find curated, approved software that will run on your kit. With the added major benefit that all software updates and upgrades are centrally managed by the OS. Once you have an automated update system for the software security is much improved as the user does not have to keep track of all the applications and find their updates. Instead of dozens, the user might need to monitor 2 or 3 outside of the package manager. Focus on the real user benefits and stop slobbering over potential profits then MS might make a walled garden work.

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WildBill, HiFlyer

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The incentive to use a walled garden is that you want software, and it’s the only place you can get it.  If it’s not, it’s not a walled garden.  Linux repos are not walled gardens.

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Drooling over the potential profits of a walled garden misses the primary advantage to a user of one.

I doubt “user advantage” is part of MS’s equation…

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HiFlyer, lurks about, BobbyB, Bill C.

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True, the user does not figure in MS’ plans going forward.

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I can think of one way that this “walled garden” would be to the user’s benefit: a small company might want a secure operating environment for their employees – email, apps, file sharing, etc. A Microsoft “walled garden” could provide this for a company. Certainly this would work if none of that company’s computers were very old, for example, by renting rather than purchasing their computers.

Let’s not forget that Microsoft makes the bulk of their money from corporate sales. I strongly believe that Microsoft thought about how the “walled garden” would appeal to corporations who very much need reliability and security, and who have a budget to spend on IT needs.

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AlexEiffel

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Don’t forget that iOS targets users that prefer stability over gimmicks. As well iOS as macOS are built with one thing in mind: efficiency and – indeed – stability. Apple isn’t afraid to change the complete architecture of its OS now and then. By (temporary) providing some kind of emulator layer, they easily moved from 68000 to PowerPC to Intel. A walled garden isn’t bad as long as you have an army of excellent programmers that produce top notch apps. Microsoft can only dream about that. Also, they can only dream about switching architectures. In essence, Windows is still the OS of 15 or more years ago. With the same burdens like a registry that should have been gone the way of the dodo decades ago. A driver model that is a pain in the you-know-what. In all their despair, they force people apps and other stuff to their throats they don’t want. Meanwhile, people don’t care about what OS a device is running. They care about what they can do with it. Walled garden or not. The haydays of Windows are over for sure. People that gather on AskWoody and similar places are no exceptional naggers. Never in Windows-history, there were so many complaints about an OS. While at the same time there are way more stable alternatives. Including Linux, most people do not even realize they use that OS. What Microsoft should basically do is rewrite Windows from the ground up. Offer an emulated sanbox for older software, and thus break with the past. I fear they are not capable of doing so. Thus, Microsoft will unavoidably go the way of IBM. It will not dissappear, but just become a moloch at the server market. Cloud storage, saas etc. Windows will not survive the next 10 years. Not like this, in all its pushy ugliness

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The only problem I foresee with subscriptions is that the more you charge for a service the more your customers expect that service to be provided in a transparent and competent manner – not a description that can currently be applied to Windows. Microsoft will need to up their game considerably.

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GoneToPlaid, HiFlyer, BobbyB

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I wonder if Nadella’s firing of the Windows Update Quality Control Team, perhaps, was a bad idea in light of where Microsoft apparently now is heading. Snarky sarcasm was intended.

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Cybertooth, WildBill

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An MS Walled Garden? Hah. A big cement wall with barbed wire on top so you can’t escape. Inside is a swamp filled with alligators, mosquitoes, and poisonous snakes. The way MS has been putting out product (as demonstrated on this board) is equivalent to picking up a dirty needle in the park..
Just my opinion of course..

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Cybertooth, HiFlyer

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This is to be expected Woody, eventually MS will create their own complete online Eco-system, apps, email, office, patches, cloud, support, IoT, digital amazon on steroids all via their own ISP with AI taking over in WaaS, DaaS and your cash for the privilege to use it.

BTW: I’ve been watching waayy too many futuristic sci-fi movies, but there again, where did this business framework come from? :)/

Windows - commercial by definition and now function...

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columbia2011

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Pointing the ship at every iceberg they see is getting the passengers antsy, so MS are now going to reorg the crew, again.

One thing that concerns me (and I have no proof that this will happen – it is just a bad feeling I have) is that Microsoft will insist that Windows 10S will be the only client version of Windows for all WaaS connected devices in the future. All users (not just enterprise users) will become ‘end users’.

That would be the iceberg I hope they miss.

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lurks about, WildBill

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If that would happen it’s over for Windows. In essence Windows then becomes a terminal, albeit a very inefficient one. For that, there are really much sleeker alternatives.

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Where was Brad Sams when Microsoft announced the upcoming changes back in March )https://news.microsoft.com/2018/03/29/satya-nadella-email-to-employees-embracing-our-future-intelligent-cloud-and-intelligent-edge/)? Hope it’s not Alzheimer.

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All this sure sounds like a litany of good reasons to keep older hardware systems already running older operating systems from being upgraded. The problem with software that always changes written by organizations undergoing change is that it could all easily change into something you decidedly don’t want, and I know *I* don’t want Windows as a Service in any way, shape or form!

-Noel

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Elly, AlexEiffel, columbia2011

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Noel:

I think that for a small company that doesn’t have anyone very knowledgeable of IT issues, as long as they have up-to-date computers, I think that WaaS, Office 365 with SharePoint, etc., would be a very helpful thing. It’s either that or hire a knowledgeable IT person, something they might not have the money to do.

What are your thoughts about that sort of situation?

Jim

Group "L" (Linux Mint)
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The moment Microsoft would offer a full fledged version of Office 365 (for the same price) that runs in a browser, I will happily throw out every single Windows system running here. Instead, I would install Ubuntu on those machines as long as they work. But that is probably the very same reason the Redmont boys will never be so clever. Somehow, they still can’t say goodbye to Windows. Realizing your time is over is not always easy.

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