After macOS “Monterey comes “Ventura”, but only for Macs 2017 and later.

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Today, among several other things, at WWDC22 Apple announced the new version of Mac OS. It is called “Ventura” and will be out for users to install later this year, as usual.

What is less usual is that all Macs earlier than the 2017 models won’t qualify to have it installed: they won’t be capable of running “Ventura.”

Here is the preview of the newest version of macOS:

https://www.apple.com/macos/macos-ventura-preview/?cid=CDM-USA-DM-P0021934-503234

(I am parking this here, in “Monterey”, because there isn’t a forum for the newest version of macOS just announced today, but the announcement has consequences many Mac users need to be aware of.)

Ex-Windows user (Win. 98, XP, 7); since mid-2017 using also macOS. Presently on Monterey 12.15 & sometimes running also Linux (Mint).

MacBook Pro circa mid-2015, 15" display, with 16GB 1600 GHz DDR3 RAM, 1 TB SSD, a Haswell architecture Intel CPU with 4 Cores and 8 Threads model i7-4870HQ @ 2.50GHz.
Intel Iris Pro GPU with Built-in Bus, VRAM 1.5 GB, Display 2880 x 1800 Retina, 24-Bit color.
macOS Monterey; browsers: Waterfox "Current", Vivaldi and (now and then) Chrome; security apps. Intego AV

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DrBonzo, bassmanzam

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Apple taking a page out of Microsoft.

I will set up a Ventura forum.

Susan Bradley Patch Lady/Prudent patcher

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Moved to new forum.

Susan Bradley Patch Lady/Prudent patcher

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OscarCP

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I imagine that Microsoft loved this news. Apple not providing long term support for Macs is a big change. One of the big selling points of Macs is that they last, and this is the second yearly macOS release from Apple that has cut support from 2 years of Macs, so we’ve swiftly gone from the latest macOS release supporting Macs up to 6 years old to 5 years to now 4 years. Yes, you can stay on the previous yearly macOS release for a couple of years, but 7 years of security updates for a Mac is much less than 9, and maybe they’ll go ahead and do this again next year and it will be 6.

Does anyone know if Apple has said anything to justify this decision? I assume that it is purely a case of them forcing people to buy new hardware, so I don’t imagine that they have.

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Apple is wanting to transition out of the Intel-chip support.
I’m looking for things to ease up after they are exclusively supporting ARM.
Maybe I’m just dreaming?

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Alex5723

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Sky wrote:

I imagine that Microsoft loved this news

When Apple moved from PowerPC to Intel it has cut all PowerPC support in 2 years. People weren’t rushing to buy Windows XP instead.

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OscarCP

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By my calculation, my mid-2015 MacBook Pro that I bought in June 2017 is going to be out of hardware support in July 2023 and, being now in Monterey, out of software support in late 2024 (still to be seen), after six and nearly seven and a half years of service to me, respectively, and five and six and a half since it was last sold, in July of 2018. I understand that this has been, more or less, the case for many years. I leave the 2016 Mac issues to be explained by others who are familiar with them.

So the outstanding question, assuming no future announcements change the hardware’s picture, is whether Apple, in the end, will still support Intel Macs’ software for as long as it has until now.

Ex-Windows user (Win. 98, XP, 7); since mid-2017 using also macOS. Presently on Monterey 12.15 & sometimes running also Linux (Mint).

MacBook Pro circa mid-2015, 15" display, with 16GB 1600 GHz DDR3 RAM, 1 TB SSD, a Haswell architecture Intel CPU with 4 Cores and 8 Threads model i7-4870HQ @ 2.50GHz.
Intel Iris Pro GPU with Built-in Bus, VRAM 1.5 GB, Display 2880 x 1800 Retina, 24-Bit color.
macOS Monterey; browsers: Waterfox "Current", Vivaldi and (now and then) Chrome; security apps. Intego AV

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Well according to Mac World the latest tale of woe for unpported Macs are as follows:
MacBook models from 2017 or later.

MacBook Air models from 2018 or later.

MacBook Pro models from 2017 or later.

Mac mini models from 2018 or later.

iMac models from 2019 or later.

iMac Pro (all models)

Mac Pro models from 2013 or later.

Mac Studio (all models)

Looks like the infamous “Trash Can” Mac bit the dust this time not sure yet if this release has some ARM only features, but be of good cheer theres always the good folk at the OCLP project on GitHub they are sure to have a fix soon enough as the Beta Versions have just hit the testing commumity and for those out of support OCLP works fine with the minimul fuss to install, even with Bootcamp.

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OscarCP

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OscarCP wrote:

So the outstanding question, assuming no future announcements change the hardware’s picture, is whether Apple, in the end, will still support Intel Macs’ software for as long as it has until now.

It will but will cut on new features with the new OS just like it did with iPadOS 16 to iPad Pros where the new Stage Manager is supported only on M1 iPads.

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Alex, thanks. But I was referring to people stuck in Monterey, as is anyone with a pre-2017 Mac right now — or soon better be.

By the way, the information on which Macs are eligible to install Ventura?

For the benefit of those who did not know this already:

That is in the official article from Apple linked with the URL I pasted in my original comment, at the beginning of this thread: click on it; when the page with the article opens, scroll almost all the way to the bottom and you’ll find Apple’s Official list of what is in and, by implication, what is out when it comes to installing the just announced and forthcoming version of macOS.

You can’t miss it,  because it is written inside a big fat red rectangle that practically fills the whole page.

Then you might find some other things in this article about Ventura that were announced by Tim Cook and Co at the Apple Developers Conference AWWDC22, things that you scrolled through on the way down to this red page and that might also be of some interest.

Ex-Windows user (Win. 98, XP, 7); since mid-2017 using also macOS. Presently on Monterey 12.15 & sometimes running also Linux (Mint).

MacBook Pro circa mid-2015, 15" display, with 16GB 1600 GHz DDR3 RAM, 1 TB SSD, a Haswell architecture Intel CPU with 4 Cores and 8 Threads model i7-4870HQ @ 2.50GHz.
Intel Iris Pro GPU with Built-in Bus, VRAM 1.5 GB, Display 2880 x 1800 Retina, 24-Bit color.
macOS Monterey; browsers: Waterfox "Current", Vivaldi and (now and then) Chrome; security apps. Intego AV

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Alex5723 wrote:

OscarCP wrote:
So the outstanding question, assuming no future announcements change the hardware’s picture, is whether Apple, in the end, will still support Intel Macs’ software for as long as it has until now.

It will but will cut on new features with the new OS just like it did with iPadOS 16 to iPad Pros where the new Stage Manager is supported only on M1 iPads.

Here Are All the macOS Ventura Features Your Intel Mac Won’t Support

..In fact, as long as your model of Intel Mac matches the minimum requirements for macOS Ventura, there’s relatively little in terms of new features that will be off-limits to you. That said, here are three exceptions that we’ve been able to identify as being exclusive to Apple silicon.

Live Captions
Reference Mode with Sidecar
Emoji Support in Dictation Mode..

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Alex … once more, for the second time and this is it: I wrote what you are quoting concerning people like me, who are now stuck in Monterey and not allowed to upgrade any further to Ventura and beyond by Apple, denied the right even by Tim Cook himself from his high throne in Cupertino.

And at about the same time as this has always happened, some five years since the last Macs of a given model were sold (in my case in mid-July 2018) when they go “Vintage” (mine in July next year) and lose hardware support. But still with near two and a half years of software support left, being now in Monterey, for a total of close to seven and a half since that date. In my case and in the case of quite a bunch of other people too.

If at Apple they keep up their policy of supporting the last installed version of macOS in an Intel Mac until this version unofficial but expected and customary EOL, some three years after it was first released. Which remains to be seen, now that the Macs with Mx CPUs is what at Apple they care most about.

What novel fripperies I’ll be finding or missing by not being able to upgrade to Ventura is certainly not something for me to rue and despair about. I agree with you entirely there.

Ex-Windows user (Win. 98, XP, 7); since mid-2017 using also macOS. Presently on Monterey 12.15 & sometimes running also Linux (Mint).

MacBook Pro circa mid-2015, 15" display, with 16GB 1600 GHz DDR3 RAM, 1 TB SSD, a Haswell architecture Intel CPU with 4 Cores and 8 Threads model i7-4870HQ @ 2.50GHz.
Intel Iris Pro GPU with Built-in Bus, VRAM 1.5 GB, Display 2880 x 1800 Retina, 24-Bit color.
macOS Monterey; browsers: Waterfox "Current", Vivaldi and (now and then) Chrome; security apps. Intego AV

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Alex5723

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If you want to install Ventura on your your (or any other unsupported Mac) Mac you can use OpenCore Legacy Patcher for Ventura.

“OpenCore Legacy Patcher is a software tool that allows PC users and owners of older Mac models to install newer macOS versions on their machines. With the help of the OpenCore Legacy Patcher, you can run macOS versions on unsupported computers.”

https://github.com/dortania/Opencore-Legacy-Patcher

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/macos-13-ventura-on-unsupported-macs-thread.2346881/page-2

“Payne Mononymous Bachman said:
I wonder if open core patcher right now will pick up the new beta if a profile is installed. With the over the air update.

It does, just loading the update from 12.5beta to Ventura Beta….fingers crossed.

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Alex, Nice of those OCLP to help install Ventura to the likes of me. But the only reason I would install Ventura would be if doing that prolongs Apple’s software (macOS) support for another year, until late 2025. Would Apple do that when I install Ventura, not in the usual way (now impossible to me), by the graces of a third-party company, using a third-party application?

And an application that, even if using it were OK by Apple — so using it to install Ventura will really extend Apple’s software support for my Mac — using it would nevertheless make my Mac less useful, if Ventura does not include the usual drives that I need to do what I do? (See BobbyB comment below.)

Color me Skeptical.

 

 

Ex-Windows user (Win. 98, XP, 7); since mid-2017 using also macOS. Presently on Monterey 12.15 & sometimes running also Linux (Mint).

MacBook Pro circa mid-2015, 15" display, with 16GB 1600 GHz DDR3 RAM, 1 TB SSD, a Haswell architecture Intel CPU with 4 Cores and 8 Threads model i7-4870HQ @ 2.50GHz.
Intel Iris Pro GPU with Built-in Bus, VRAM 1.5 GB, Display 2880 x 1800 Retina, 24-Bit color.
macOS Monterey; browsers: Waterfox "Current", Vivaldi and (now and then) Chrome; security apps. Intego AV

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Well it does appear that the latest incarnation of MacOS Ventura has dropped from its Beta Version all the legacy Drivers that would have supported “Out of support” Machines, and in a strange move invited MrMacintosh and the leading Developers from the OCLP project to the Cuppertino “WDC Shin-dig”

Is this Apples way of politely reminding them not to bother in any future endeavours by making it more difficult to patch out of support Macs?

I always wondered why some Mac’s that are out of support needed “Post Install” patching and others did not, including my little 2014 MacBook Pro. I had put it down to the “Metal Graphic” thing that seemed to occur around 2012. Apparently not, seems Apple as well as M$ tend to leave archaic remnants of Drivers in their offerings, but not this time.

I have no doubt for those of us still with Intel Macs the OCLP guys will come through with a patch this time round and until then pull up a comfy chair and grab a bowl of Popcorn or Potato chips (Crisps for the UK listeners) and enjoy the show.

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Alex5723, pmcjr6142, OscarCP

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